New Year, New Life, New Me...New Thread!

[StrongEnough]

Thanks C4H-

I would have to say that detaching is more appropriate for those of you NOT in piecing. Not sure how it's going to affect my situation.

Time will tell.

~SE

[CRAZEE4HER]

SE,

I think detachment is necessary, where ever one is in this journey. Why?

I see detachment not as distancing ourselves form anyone or anything, but establishing our own autonomy, our own sense of self.

We decide not to be needy any more. We don't need another person to define us. We are free from the control that others had over us, because we gave it to them and now we're taking it back. We take responsiblility for our own happiness.

C4H

[StrongEnough]

We are free from the control that others had over us, because we gave it to them and now we're taking it back.

I think you hit on something here. Took me a while to realize it, but it finally came to me. H gets upset and distant when I am detaching and taking charge on my own life and happiness. I never understood why he would want me to be emotionally needy. (He claims he doesn't but actions speak louder then words) and it IS a control thing isn't it? When he no longer controls or influences my life, to someone who is controlling by nature, it must be untolerable. That explains why he gets short fused and distant. It's all about control just as it always has been.

Thanks C4H. I think I finally have a little clue.

~SE

[CRAZEE4HER]

Ah Ha, lets take this a step further. This is enlightening for me as well, as I was the "controlling" spouse.

He/I/We get short fused and distant, because we need you to need us. That's how we define our self worth - through you/her. Or at least that's what I think was happening, until I got turned on by detachment. And yes it is a controlling thing. The moodiness and anger are controlling behaviors.

We know the buzz words "Ooooh, yes, I want an independent wife. I want you to be strong and self-sufficient." We say it but we don't believe it. We say it because it's PC, it's what you want to hear from us. But really what we want is for you to be miserable with out us, that way we can go fishing, golfing, drinking or whatever and our dutiful little wifey will be sitting home with our kids too afraid to say anything for fear of losing a loser like us.

Yikes, C4H is starting to bring himself down. F that let's talk about sex.

[StrongEnough]

Again...this is all starting to make a lot of sense to me. If I think about what would make me happy, right now...today, tonight. I would love to get a night away and go stay at Mohegan. IF I was to say to H.."You know, it would be really nice right now to get some time to myself to unwind. I think I'll book myself a room at the casino and have fun". Holy crap...no way that would fly. He would let me go to the casino (non-controlling) but not stay overnight (controlling). So, he in turn will sit there and say that he doesn't control what I do, that he lets me do what I want......but infact no matter what, there is always a small amount of control. H could be fearing that a night away from him alone could lead to an epiphany of sorts that may not be to his advantage. As long as he has some fear that he could or may lose me, he will try to control and maipulate to the best of his ability to ensure he is always in the forefront and watching what I do. Therefore, making it difficult for me to detach.

Sorry if this doesn't make sense. I am talking out of order here.

Sorry you brought yourself down.......go ahead talk about sex....LOL. (Or, lack thereof )

~SE

[CRAZEE4HER]

Unfortunately it makes a great deal of sense.

could lead to an epiphany

or it could lead to something else.

This is really sad, because I understand all to well the thought process. It's insecurities that drive the controlling behavior. It's not strength or dominance, it's weakness.

As long as he has some fear that he could or may lose me, he will try to control and maipulate to the best of his ability to ensure he is always in the forefront and watching what I do. Therefore, making it difficult for me to detach.

EXACTLY!!

And here is the irony - He/I will never be able to let go of the insecurities that cause the controlling behaviors, that drive our spouses away, that creates the insecurities, that cause the controlling behavior, that drives our spouses away .............. until He/I/We detach ourselves.

Damn, I'm good today. Lets get together an I'll show you how good.

[StrongEnough]

C4- are you suffering from lack of oxygen to the smaller brain??? Quite brazen and bold today my friend. It's all good though.

I understand and relate to everything you said. So, basically when he tells me he trusts me and knows I would never cheat, yadda, yadda, yadda......it's a line BS. It's just another tactic to manipulate by making me feel like I can't do anything that could raise doubt in his mind.

I really wish that he would even consider, just for a second, that he exhibits this behavior. Alas, he is in denile and gets pissed about it saying that everyone is trying to just "label" him and nothing of the sort. I know full well that if I choose to stay in this marriage that I will spend the rest of my life being controlled to a certain extent. THe problem is, with guys like you/him you are very very good at twisting things to make the controlled person feel crazy for even having thought or felt that way. It's just a vicous cycle. THe question is, if I detach.....will it break the cycle or does it have to be him specifically to detach?

[CRAZEE4HER]

No, No - He's not feeding you a line of BS. He wants to believe those things, but he can't his own insecurities won't allow it. He is actually the needy one.

You are absolutely correct, he has to accept, understand all this - and nobody can tell him. It doesn't work like that. He's got to learn it on his own to believe it.

Your detaching won't brake the cycle, your detaching is for you, it's for your sanity.

His detachment is necessary to break the cycle.

Now, again let me emphasize. I'm speaking of emotional and intellectual detachment of the drama, of those things that drive us crazy about one another - not a physical separation, not giving up on our R or M or whatever it is were trying to revive.

And Yes, I am feeling particularly Cocky today. Speaking of feeling Cocky. You free later? OOPS!!

[StrongEnough]

Yes, I see what you mean. He is the needy one. He needs to control me in order to feel that his position in my life as my H is secure. Without, it raises his doubts, which raises his anxiety and ends with him lashing out.

I wasn't referring to a physical seperation either when I speak of detachment. It IS trying to seperate myself from the drama but it is difficult with someone who is controlling. In many ways, they block all your efforts to detach.

LMAO...OOPS........I'm free now...

[always_14]

OUCH...the controlling spouse really describes ME. I was controlling in the most ridiculous ways. Just this last week I finally realized that H sees me as nothing but someone to escape from , hide from, lie to, feels trapped, controlled, not wanted, always disappointing.

You're right, it comes from insecurity, fear, anger, which leads to mistrust. Of course, the saying, what you focus on expands is right....he never lied to me until I started to control and demand. How sad.

I realized that this is NOT the person I was or W that I wanted to be. Still doesn't make the past behaviors OK, I still regret it deeply and am paying for it now. BUT, as you mention here, it's the controlling spouse that has to detach from those behaviors, the insecurities and fear, so the other spouse does not completely withdraw from the marriage to a point of no return...while you can still remember the person you originally married.

I hated who I became, was ashamed of her, was not me. It was so easy to snap out of it. People make mistakes and change, I guess...forgiving myself is the hardest part, it's like waking up from a dream and looking back at the movie of your life and this other person you became. Ugh.

It really hits home when you read things that say these behaviors are a form of abuse...emotional abuse. That is HARD to read and to digest, but it's true. I finally was able to utter those words to H....I was ashamed but felt good to admit it. It feels human.

Now, it's gonna take a LOT of time, consistent, persistent actions that are NOT controlling, handling a situation where I would have exercised control in a totally different way, of NOT slipping, AT ALL. To the controlled person, you start to think that it won't ever change--like SE...you assume that your H will always be that way to an extent. So he has to work EXTRA hard to undo that. Good lesson for me, because it may be part of why H does not want to committ fully..he's scared and has every right to be.

You're right, the controlling spouse needs to see this for themselves. Needs to see what they are in YOUR eyes and how ugly the picture is...that you add NO value, comfort, love to their life, only fear, resentment and anxiety. I guess it's easy to snap out of it after that.

Funny, it's amazing the results you reap with letting go of the controlling persona. Just the last few days with H have been more relaxed and more rewarding than the months past when I thought I was "working hard."