Quote: How is it that these people (WAS) seem to think everything is about them, EVEN things WE do. I ask because whenever I tell her I am going out, or doing something, she assumes it is a reaction to something she did or said. I mean I can't go to the bathroom without her thinking it's revenge for her affair.
IMHO, I imagine it has to do with guilt and keepipng us within their comfort zone. I got a lot of that from my W a couple of weekends ago. She was in a sour mood and when I attempted to create some space (she sat in the kitchen and did Word Finds and I went into the Living Room to watch TV) I was accused of being the one that didn't want to hang out with her.
I dunno, I see my reaction to that sort of behavior as kinda crucial at this point. At one point, I wanted to make sure I wasn't doing anything to p*ss her off....unfortunately, that puts the emphasis on her feelings and completely invalidates mine.
"Achieve success, but without vanity; Achieve success, but without aggression; Achieve success, but without gain; Achieve success, but without force." Lao Tzu
For you, and everyone else, I do have a question. How is it that these people (WAS) seem to think everything is about them, EVEN things WE do. I ask because whenever I tell her I am going out, or doing something, she assumes it is a reaction to something she did or said.
That's so true of LBSs too. It's true of most people. It's called "Personalization": a common, distorted cognitive reasoning process. Ah, I remember when "personalization" simply meant getting a pen with my name on it.
I mean I can't go to the bathroom without her thinking it's revenge for her affair.
It's not? I thought it had quite the symbolic meaning.
Wait....why am I the one to get smacked!?!
Cuz you know you probably deserve it, and we just didn't find out yet what it was you did that you deserve it for.
Quote: I mean I can't go to the bathroom without her thinking it's revenge for her affair.
It's not? I thought it had quite the symbolic meaning.
Now that I've attached that symbolic meaning to it...I think I make a point to save up all my trips for when I'm home
Quote: Wait....why am I the one to get smacked!?!
Cuz you know you probably deserve it, and we just didn't find out yet what it was you did that you deserve it for.
Probably for enganging in distorted cognitive reasoning processes.....
"Achieve success, but without vanity; Achieve success, but without aggression; Achieve success, but without gain; Achieve success, but without force." Lao Tzu
Well, how about no card. She says she has one but didn't get a chance to write anything in it. BS. The gift thing went fine. Really no reaction...from either of us. She got me some shirt and boxer shorts (see I got sexy undies too). Oh well, she went to the store (prolly to get a card) and then we are going out. She is NOT going out with us. I suggested (after she seemed annoyed trying to think of where to go) that it would probably be better if she just do her thing and we would do ours as planned. She said ok.
I am not really ok. I am pacing about. I will use this time to gather myself and get the car seats in. We need to go before daddy does something he will regret. I am close, but still under control. Will let you know how it plays out.
You are doing great. It sounds to me like you did a good job handling her to-be-expected ambivalence once dinner plans were back on again. You were patient and accepting when she wanted back in on the dinner, but did not get caught up in her drama about being torn and conflicted about going. You reached your "enough point" on that score and stood by it.
Who knows, she might flip flop again, for, she might feel for the first time that she isn't being guilted into going. Then again, she might not. She might be relieved. Or, she might feel stuck, feeling unworthy of having dinner with you. WTF knows, lol. You don't need to know, you have stepped away from the dinner issue and moved on.
Oh, and don't leave an open ended invite -- well, you know where we'll be in you change your mind. That is pressure, or she will experience it as such, even if you just mean to be nice to her. She will know where you'll be, I assume, because of the kids. She can suck it up and join you or not.
GH you are doing awesome! I have to thank everyone OT, Rob, NY, SS, and anyone else I missed on GH post today! It has been great and very educational! Rob you do need a smack but only after I get mine first! Sometimes we all need the kick in the butt to get our brains operational again! Which brings me to the bathroom analogy.....I LOVE IT! I am with you Rob I am saving my personal business for when I get home, and I can have achuckle to myself while I contemplate life! GH stay strong my friend, and you are an example to many of us! If you missed it earlier I still want 75% of the profits from your psychobabble book!
Tim
my story http://www.divorcebusting.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=1049617&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1
Ok, I will try to remember everything, good and bad.
After the presents thing my W went to the store. I gathered myself and got the kids ready to go. When she got back she did a few things and out of the blue she said "I asked you if you made any new friends because I saw a gift bag in your car." WTF! I laughed and said "That's funny. It was for you but I got the VS stuff so I didn't need it." Then, of course, I said...(sorry people)..."I don't think you REALLY want to start that conversation now do you?" and...
W: No, not really. M: Good, because I am not the one going out with another man on V-day. W: I know. M: Is it that important to you? W: Like I said, it is just a coincidence that it's on v-day. It's the only time I can go. M: Ok fine. W: I know we need to talk. M: Ok, when? W: Soon. This can't go on much longer. We need to talk about that. M: I assume you don't mean WE need to talk about that. W: No, I need to talk about it tonight [with OM]. M: Ok. That should go well. W; Yea. M; (hug) I know it's hard for you too, and above all else, take care of yourself please. W: I will.
We probably said more, and despite what it sounded like, it was a pretty ok convo. I said some questionable things but the gist is that she said she was going to talk to OM tonight about ending the A. I don't know if she even knows what is going to happen. I sure as hell don't.
So I took the boys out to dinner and when I got back, I found a box of french chocolates, a candle and a card. In the card was...
Front: With Love....Valentine Inside Printed: You mean everything to me.
Her words: I know that I've put you through a lot but you are still my husband and I still love you.
Um, sorry, I didn't make my goal... I am not jumping for joy or anything, but it is nice to read that. Guess I'm a sucker.
What do you think? I think I did ok. She started the R talk a bit but I did not do a good job holding back entirely. I slipped but it was a FAR cry from what I had in my mind to say and do. I am ok for now. Not believing much of anything right now. Actions, not words are my religion right now. We'll see.
Sounds good Grasshopper. And, you got the card we both predicted :-)
So, when she gets home give her a hug, and then before anything else, thank her for recognizing you as a valuable human being in her life and as one that experiences pain, and then validate her warmly and sincerely.
BTW, I think it was important for her to do this TODAY because of the particular importance of the date for the two of you -- it forced her to self-examination and action. So, though she says it is just a day, given her attention and struggle with the day otherwise, I'd say she experiences the significance of it as much as you.
Thanks OT. I will give her that hug. I also think you are right about the timing of the thing, if it is indeed what she said it is. I am a little confused at why she would not just come out and say, clearly, that she was breaking things off with him. I suppose there are a million reasons why she didn't, but leaving the possibility open to NOT do that is one I can think of. Like I said, I don't KNOW anything so I will wait and see. NOW, there were a bunch of you who questioned my gift selection because it signified something romantic/intimate. I told you that the PJ's were neither of those things. WELL, she gave me a candle. THAT is something in our life that signifies romance and intimacy. I am not going to read into it, but suffice to say I WOULD NOT have gotten her a candle because of the instant meaning she would have attributed to it (I want $ex). Go figure.
You're not a sucker. Maybe it's just me, but your conversation seemed relatively calm and not as emotional as it could have been. Maybe your W is finally leaving the mother ship.
If she does actually end things with the OM, you need to be prepared for a whole rush of feelings on both sides. She may be mourning the loss of him whether he was a crap or not. And you will need to restrain your feelings of wanting her full attention and your major (and justified) lack of trust.
That said, I don't want to jump the gun as we don't know what will really be happening tonight. No assuming right? I just want you to be prepared. You also need to prepare for the possibility that she can't let him go.
Anyway she's recognized that she's hurt you and still loves you. That's a baby step in the right direction.
