or is it because of what you choose to associate with Valentine's Day?
NYS. Valentines day is the day I proposed to my W. It has always been a VERY special day for us and we have always celebrated it as such. Sure, there is the mass hysteria, but for me it is VERY personal. If I had no personal attachment to the day I doubt I would feel as bad as I do.
Ok, now for the worse news. I think made a mistake and lost my only two live humans that I talk to about this. I told them about tonight and they flipped on me. They basically said they could not help me anymore since I am choosing to let this happen. As if I LET anything happen. Of course, they got me more stirred up. I called my W to "talk" but thankfully she didn't answer the phone. What would I have done if she did? I would have asked her why she HAS to go out tonight and I would have pressed her for an answer. I would have asked her if she was serious about breaking things off with him, why do such damage to our R by going out with the OM.
Anyway, she didn't answer, I didn't leave a message and I suppose I will make up some lame reason why I called.
Tim. Somewhere I missed that your W was doing the OM thing tonight too. I'm sorry for that, but you seem to be in a good mood. I wish I was. I am really fighting with this one. You know, in all our minds, we come up with these deal breakers that we think will give us just enough pushing to take matters into our own hands and end our M. For me, leading up to V-day, her going out with OM was one of those things. I was convinced that if she could be THIS cold as to blow off our tradition and hurt me this much for HIM, then I was done. Well, I guess I am not done, but it does put another nail in the coffin. If she indeed is not doing what it looks like she's doing, then so be it. I can't know or control that but as we all say around here, I CAN control what I do and I am not totally sure what I want to do, if anything. Once again, I am going out with my boys tonight. Whatever else happens is up to, well, God?
Well, it certainly isn't up to us. If it was, we'd be doing much better!
Fortunate for you she didn't answer.
But I know what you mean by all of us establishing that one or two things that would be the proverbial straw breaking the camel's back. I've established several of them and each time I find myself stepping back up to the plate for another hit.
"Achieve success, but without vanity; Achieve success, but without aggression; Achieve success, but without gain; Achieve success, but without force." Lao Tzu
Sorry your "two live humans" didn't give you the support you needed. I think so many people just don't know how to react. They think telling you your S is a jerk is helpful. Gee as if we didn't realize it ourselves. Anyway, if you need to talk to a live human, my digits are in Petite's thread.
Now that you've mentioned that V-day has a special significance outside of the national cheesiness I understand more why you've been obsessing about the day. I probably would too. I feel the same way about the 4th of July.
What makes you happy outside of your W and kids? Is there something you can do for yourself today that will put you in a good mood? Maybe a photography field trip. That way when you exchange gifts with her you can have a big smile on your face. It would be even better if you still have that same smile when she goes off to be with the OM. Let her wondering why you are so happy.
Thanks SS. Yea, it is the deeply personal significance of this day that is pulling me down. More of the usual "how could she" thinking that gets us nowhere but seems to creep in nevertheless. I have to work right up till when we are going to exchange, then take my S5 to karate, then we are off to enjoy the evening...without mommy. The real hurt will come when S5 says something insightful like "Don't you and mommy love each other. When people love each other on valentines day they go to dinner" or some similar thing. He has a knack for things like that. I am really struggling right now. I feel physically panicked like I used to in the early days. I can control it better now but it still scares me. I will keep you posted.
I'm so sorry this is such a hard day for you. Your friends want to take care of you and let you know that you don't deserve to be treated like this and see you as a victim.
They are partially right. You don't deserve to be treated like this. You are a good man that deserves to be treated with respect, compassion, and dignity. But, they are wrong that you are a victim, that you are being abused. You are an adult and you have chosen to accept this undeserved treatment because it is part of what you need to do FOR YOURSELF. You need to know that you have done your best and respected your own wishes and values by this marriage. You are not a victim, so tell your friends they don't need to defend or protect you. You are an empowered chooser determining what you can determine about the course of your own life.
Contrast a child with a parent who is constantly verbally abusive and manipulative with a psychologist with a patient who is constantly verbally abusive and manipulative. Neither the child nor the psychologist deserves that treatment. But, only the child is abused. It is the choice of the psychologist to endure that treatment because of her own goals. It is also the choice of the psychologist as to what boundaries she sets and enforces.
Now, I'm glad that your W was honest with you about seeing OM. That is at least a sign of respect. I would accept that she has no intention of this being a date with OM. However, it may turn into one out of her feeling guilt over hurting him, or the old "one last time" for closure story, or her fear of being alone because she is realizing how F'ed up her life is. Then again, she may feel compelled to get some closure on that R BECAUSE this day is so important to her she can't face it without doing something to end that chapter. There is NO TELLING. And, even if she were totally honest with what she is thinking, planning, and feeling at this moment, there would be NO TELLING. No matter what, she will be all over the place for quite awhile.
I know what you mean about deal breakers that turn out not to be deal breakers. I did that myself. I think we take things that haven't happened, and we really don't think will happen, and set them up as deal breakers so that we feel we have some smidgen of self-respect. But, this really backfires.
We don't know how we will feel or react when the purported deal breaker happens. And how could we? It's not like we've have multiple experiences to learn what to expect. If it turns out not to be a deal breaker, then our having linked it to our self-respect makes it seem like such another deep blow. Another loss of self-respect, and diminishment and sacrifice of who we are, another step on the way toward getting a permanent "please sh*t on me" tattoo on the forehead.
So, it is best not to impose these deal breaker ideas on yourself. Quit giving yourself ultimatums when it comes to the marriage, lol.
But, you still need to set and maintain boundaries. Personally, I'd quit sharing a marriage bed with someone who was regularly putting another partner before me. But, that is me. Being unwilling to participate in her drama tonight is a great boundary.
And, I'll tell you my trick that is responsible for the great R I have today. My H, then BF, and I were having a difficult time because of old stuff on his side. I had to give myself daily pep talks about it being my choice to endure a pretty good amount of crap because I saw so much potential that it was worth the risk to me. Anyway, my trick was to choose a block of time to which I was committed to handle what was going on. That was my boundary -- I was unwilling to go through the pain without an end in site. At the end of that time, I would then reevaluate things and then make another choice as to whether to commit another probationary block of time, to end the relationship, or to fully commit to the relationship long term.
I committed a one month block of time which was good for me. Too short and it would have been, oh, well, nothing has happened and I have to reevaluate tomorrow (or whatever). Too long and it would have seemed unbearable. Anyway, it gave me huge amounts of strength and patience during that time. It was also very healing I think in terms of finding respect for myself and moving out of victimhood. It was also a very powerful good in my R, I believe, that led to very good outcomes.
So, my advice to you would be to put her on probation for a month or 6 weeks. You do not need to share this with her, it is a tool for you to master your own role in this mess. Observe what happens, take notes, detach. Roll with the punches and step away from the drama when possible. Affirm to yourself that it is your choice to do so. Pay attention to your needs. Question whether an R with W could ever meet those needs. Learn what you want and expect in a permanent R. I'm telling you, the mental time limit on my acceptance of the situation really helped me a lot. And, to emphasize, it wasn't a deal breaker time limit -- if things aren't better by such and such a date then I'm out of here. Rather, it was a time limit on a certain kind of acceptance I would commit to before I reevaluation my choice.
So get this. Now my W wants to go to dinner with me and the boys. Oh, she is still going out tonight "just for a bit" but wants to have dinner with us first. I guess this is fair game since I made plans to take the boys out and did invite her when I first did it. Whatever. I will go. The kids will enjoy it and we'll take it from there. I still plan on going out with them before she leaves. I'll be damned if I see her walk out of our house, all dressed up to go, well, go somewhere to do something with someone. I am tired. This is a draining day, but really, despite all thats going on, it is probably going better than I thought. I have not exploded...yet.
P.S. This probation trick was suggested to me by a friend when I was right on the verge of ending things because of by own UNuseful dealbreaker mentality. She did not want to see me treated badly, but she also knew enough DBing that she understood it was important for me to remain open to an R that meant so much to me rather than letting pride, pain, and despair get in the way.
Lol, the dealbreaker mentality reminds me of kids and teenagers who would NEVER do such-and-such, then lo and behold, they do such-and-such. I had a neice, for instance, who would NEVER like alternative rock. Yeah, right. Or new parents who would NEVER do such-and-such. But, they can't really know until they get there.
This has been very helpful for me actually. I have a problem with stubbornness in fights and I think it may have to do with this dealbreaker mentality on some level.
NYS. Valentines day is the day I proposed to my W. It has always been a VERY special day for us and we have always celebrated it as such.... but for me it is VERY personal
Well, either cling to it and suffer, or let it go. Those are your choices. Bottom line is that you're still the one attaching the meaning to the date. We all have a date we met, date we proposed, anniversary, first date, on and on. Sorry to sound harsh about this. It's time to reframe how you look at 2/14. It was what it was back then, and shall always be, but today it does not have that significance, unless you give it that preeminence.
And you're not in that kind of relationship at this moment. Its like you wearing a suit that doesn't fit and then feeling blah because it doesn't feel right.
Ok, now for the worse news. I think made a mistake and lost my only two live humans that I talk to about this. I told them about tonight and they flipped on me. They basically said they could not help me anymore since I am choosing to let this happen. As if I LET anything happen.
Screw them.
I called my W to "talk"
Was that because you're looking toward W to comfort and soothe your upset?
I was convinced that if she could be THIS cold as to blow off our tradition and hurt me this much for HIM, then I was done.
Good Lord. man. She's a Walk-Away!!! She's NOT a "wife" right now!
I CAN control what I do and I am not totally sure what I want to do, if anything.
You don't have to anything but focus on yourself without her thumbprint on you.
Whatever else happens is up to, well, God?
Personally, I don't think so, unless God's culpable for people having affairs. I think the Bible puts it nicely in Proverbs somewhere... that we're all like fish in the sea and can be snared up in a net, that chance and unforeseen circumstances affect us all (no one's doing anything to you, it's just life). And that, what you sow you reap, so for whatever you put into your sitch (cause), there'll be some sort of result (effect). And that the heart is treacherous and cannot be trusted (emotions are fickle and we cannot permit ourselves to be led by them as the results can hurt us rather than help us).
Wow OT, I'm glad you didn't heed my warning...lol.
So, my advice to you would be to put her on probation for a month or 6 weeks. You do not need to share this with her, it is a tool for you to master your own role in this mess.
I REALLY appreciate your words but these in particular were of note to me. I have already done this. It started about 2 weeks ago and will culminate with my Ireland trip. I decided to implement personal goals (see my post about my changes) and see what happened with my R. So far, sorta good. I have always had in the back of my mind that when we come back from Ireland I will re-evaluate things and see if I want to proceed. It is not an ultimatum, just a point on the horizon that I can focus on and not get TOO discouraged with things. Even before your post that got me thinking a lot, I guess I realized that I am choosing to endure this. To do that, I need internal help. The time thing helps me feel like even though I am taking a lot of $hit from her, I am only going to do it for xx amount of time. Of course, that time gets extended but it's just a coping tool so wth. I know it's also a form of self promoted denial but hey, it's better than drugs at this point. Please, keep an eye on me. I really appreciate your opinion (especially when it's a little softer like this time )
Anyway, enjoy dinner. Don't feel jerked around, it is your choice whether or not to go along with her whims at this time. You can always say "no, that doesn't work for me as I would feel too jerked around by agreeing to go with you." Instead you chose to say yes, for your own reasons. Accept the responsibility and the resentment will slide away.
BTW, I think you are right to interpret her increased honesty and her pains to be open as far as she can manage as movement. Movement where, we dunno. But, movement is good. She is getting unstuck from the mire she dove into head first. It's a tough thing, because it requires really beginning self-examination. She's been running, now perhaps she is starting to grow.
