IMO, lingerie is fantastic for foreplay... bring it on! And being undressed is one one of my biggest turn-ons! So I am all for use of clothing during foreplay... But when it comes down to time for actual intercourse.. then it should be all naked skin.
And during sleeping time... it really doesn't matter if you are wearing eskimo clothes or some kind of lingerie.. it's all clothes. There is nothing like the feeling of rolling over to my wife and having my hand feel nothing but skin next to me. THAT is a fantastic thing!
Quote: In Dr. Laura's book, I think it is 'The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands', there is an area that addresses this issue (I read the whole sex chapter in the bookstore). She talks about how husbands have a need to see their wives nude, and should not have to rely on looking at a Playboy magazine to see a nude woman. We don't need our SO's running around the house nude all the time, but it would be nice if we could see them in the shower, perhaps changing out of their clothes into pajamas, etc.
H used always to make some admiring comment or another whenever he caught me nude. Sometimes I would act all coy and sometimes not. The coy thing was just playful but in his low self-esteem way sometimes he would take it badly. Other times I would find it annoying. Like Christ can't I just get undressed and into bed without some comment But mostly I was fine with it, liked it. Now he never seems to do it anymore. I don't prance around like an idiot trying to get his attention. I just dress/undress in front of him like I always have and I never get a single comment. Now I could take this badly and think I'm getting old/fat/ugly but I know I'm not, I'm in good shape and still cute. Why does he no longer seem to notice? We've been through this before. He went through a phase of it when we had been married for about 3 or 4 years. I was 34 and climbing the freaking walls! And yes then I did prance around like an idiot in lingerie and stuff trying to get him interested - it only made it worse if only I had know then what I know now, that kind of persuing behaviour never pays off.
The weirdest thing was just a few days after S was born and I looked awful - all wobbly belly and distended breasts - and he was looking at me naked with this strange look on his face which I took to be disgust. And I said "why are you looking at me like that" and he said "because I'm lusting after you and I can't have you until you've had the post-natal check up". Weird, there I was thinking I looked like something the cat dragged in and he was feeling sexual frustration by setting eyes on me.
You never know, some of the LD wives that cover up like eskimos may have caught that same look on H's face and never dared ask why he looked at them that way. Just assumed it was disgust and never dared show their bodies again
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
Ignoring the LD spouse never works. I have done it and so have many other men on here. We can go for months and never try anything with our wives and yet they still come to bed dressed as eskimos.
Many HD people need skin time. I think part of the problem is that some people are VERY comfortable with who they are and I think that most LD's are NOT in some way. Being naked in front of your spouse requires that you be VERY comfortable with yourself, which is sexy in its own right. I personally HATE pj's opn my wive, it makes it virtually impossible to arouse her, she is one of those people that has their arousal pattern backwards. SO it takes a lot of work to arouse her, and it is ten times harder when all the good spots are virtually impossible to get to.
I think that maybe the thinhg to do is to stop sleeping with them all together. I wonder why I even bother sleeping with my wife anymore. It is clear that when she comes to bed, she wants to sleep. You can do that ANYWHERE. It is clear that many LD's like this do NOT understand the marriage bed. They see bed as for sleeping, so why do they need the HD spouse in the same bed. What's the purpose?
Anyone know why LD people seem to need a whole lot more sleep the HD people?
"Being naked in front of your spouse requires that you be VERY comfortable with yourself, which is sexy in its own right."
I will disagree to some degree here. While being comfortable naked is definitely sexy, I think being uncomfortable, but still being willing to LET GO, make yourself vulnerable to your partner is a great feeling to both give and receive.
" personally HATE pj's opn my wive, it makes it virtually impossible to arouse her"
Why? I can think of LOTS of things to do to arouse a woman in PJs, and I'm a freakin novice at this stuff. What is it about your W that makes it impossible? I'm willing to bet it is really something else and the PJs are just an excuse.
"she is one of those people that has their arousal pattern backwards."
I think you are treading dangerously close to the "freak of nature" comment here CeMar. There is no backwards way of being aroused, there is just the way a person IS aroused.
"when all the good spots are virtually impossible to get to."
How do PJs make it impossible to get to the good spots? I can understand a pair of tight fitting jeans, but PJs? Seems like you could have a lot of fun sliding your hand down inside and ... I'd better stop before this turns into a BF or Stigmata post.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
There are lots of areas on her body if given the proper attention can bring her to arrousal. But when she wears head to toe flannel PJ's, it can be impossible to get to all of them. There is only so far that you can push these flannel sleeves and legs before they get too bunched up on the body.
AS for the arousal backwards, yes it is blunt, but it pretty much is the truth. Honestly, who wants a spouse that operates this way? The HD spouse basically ends up providing the desire for both spouses. In the long run, this will usually fail. As Dr. Harley says, the only real solution is that the LD women must regain some level of desire.
There is only so far that you can push these flannel sleeves and legs before they get too bunched up on the body. Uhmmm...forget the sleeves and legs Cemar and just go for the waistline/neckline. Much easier and won't bunch up. But really, is it the pj's that are the problem. I think not. I've stated before that I often go to bed in Eskimo gear. If I want to have sex with H, it would come off very easily, or at least partially off in order to get to the good parts Some women really do wear that stuff to stay warm But I'd much rather have a hot body lying on top of me. Just doesn't happen as much as I would like so the gear comes on. I liked your list on the other thread. GEL is right, let's here some good things about your W now.
Well that eskimo gear does not come off easily when you have to arouse them first. That is the tough part, she must be aroused in order to desire at all, but then she limits the possibilities of arousing her.
"There are lots of areas on her body if given the proper attention can bring her to arrousal. But when she wears head to toe flannel PJ's, it can be impossible to get to all of them. There is only so far that you can push these flannel sleeves and legs before they get too bunched up on the body."
I guess it depends on which areas you are talking about, but why are you bunching up the sleeves and legs? There is a much more direct route, iykwim. Granted, my W likes it when I rub the back of her knees (although it isn't a sexual turn-on), you can do that through the flannel. I guess I also don't understand why the flannel itself is a problem. My W has flannel PJs, and I can remember (a long time ago ) getting her aroused by rubbing her breasts through the flannel. Its like a treasure hunt trying to find the nipple to play with. Of course your W is different than mine. I don't mean to imply that there is a one size fits all solution. But maybe you could try something like that.
"Honestly, who wants a spouse that operates this way?"
It doesn't really matter what anyone else wants, what do YOU want? Apparently you don't want that. So what are you going to do about it? Sit around and pout or form a plan of action? Its ok to feel sorry for yourself sometimes CeMar, but you have been stuck in that mode for far too long.
Got a question for you. I read back through some of your posts, and I have yet to run across a post where you said unequivicably that you LOVE YOUR WIFE. Sorry if I missed it. Do you love your wife? If so, say it, here as a response to this post. I'm sure I'm not the only one here who would like to know the truth about how you feel toward your wife. I'm getting the feeling that you don't. Prove me wrong. I can tell you one thing for sure. If you can't say to us on this message board that you love your wife, then there is NOTHING ANYONE can do to help you fix things.
Let me say that for the most part, your posts come across as you wanting someone to validate your negative view of your wife. Can't you see that this frame of mind is getting you NOWHERE!!!!
OK, so now I've followed in the footsteps of several others and ranted at you. The only reason I'm doing this is that I'm hoping that maybe one more will provide critical mass for change in your life. I'm betting it won't, and that is really sad.
You are an intelligent person CeMar. I know you can figure this out. But it almost seems as if you WANT to be unhappy. That you have some sort of Munchausen syndrome or something.
Rant over.
Chrome.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
"Well that eskimo gear does not come off easily when you have to arouse them first. That is the tough part, she must be aroused in order to desire at all, but then she limits the possibilities of arousing her."
Got a thought for you. Why don't you just one night rip the freakin things off her. What are you worried about? That she gets mad and denies you sex? Sounds like that is happening anyway, so what's the difference? I mean, don't hurt her in the process, but most buttons will pop off with a minimal amount of force. And if you grab both pant legs at the bottom and lift up and away, the PJ bottoms should slide right off, assuming they are elastic and don't have a tightly tied drawstring. I guess if it is a pullover instead of buttons, that might not work. Hmmm, have to think about that one.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
But mostly I was fine with it, liked it. Now he never seems to do it anymore. I don't prance around like an idiot trying to get his attention. I just dress/undress in front of him like I always have and I never get a single comment. Now I could take this badly and think I'm getting old/fat/ugly but I know I'm not, I'm in good shape and still cute. Why does he no longer seem to notice? We've been through this before. He went through a phase of it when we had been married for about 3 or 4 years. I was 34 and climbing the freaking walls! And yes then I did prance around like an idiot in lingerie and stuff trying to get him interested - it only made it worse 
if only I had know then what I know now, that kind of persuing behaviour never pays off.
Some women really do wear that stuff to stay warm 
But I'd much rather have a hot body lying on top of me. Just doesn't happen as much as I would like so the gear comes on. I liked your list on the other thread. GEL is right, let's here some good things about your W now. 
) getting her aroused by rubbing her breasts through the flannel. Its like a treasure hunt trying to find the nipple to play with. 
Of course your W is different than mine. I don't mean to imply that there is a one size fits all solution. But maybe you could try something like that.