I am alive. I would like to tell you all the amazing spiritual and male bonding experiences of this weekend. I arrived friday lost, beat, tired and alone. It was all I could do to drag myself there. I left on Sunday with a whole lot of new 'brothers', men like me who want to live with integrity, accountability, and connection to feeling. It was awesome.
To find a sense of 'purpose' in our lives.
The other day I posted this question to myself:
Quote: I mean, what kind of man would go sit on the bathroom floor with his wife while she tells him how she can't 'make it' on her own, how her relationships with men don't work, how she's a failure and is only where she is in her life because of ME and she can't stand on her own?
How many would then use their last drops in their 'cup' to lift her back up so she CAN feel like she will be ok without me, she CAN deal with her relationships better, and she WILL be a success in her business. All so she can be strong and confident enough to leave me.
Here is the answer: A man who lives with Integrity, and Accountability to himself, and to his creator. A man who, no matter what, is the protector of his family both emotionally and physically. I am accountable for my failure to do this in the past. So, to get back into integrity I need to do this in the PRESENT, even if protecting W from not being able to support herself and helping her to reach HER goals ends my marriage.
I don't know how it will turn out, she wants what she wants and believes she must leave me to get it. That's ok if she needs that but I really think she'll be so much happier if she stayed!
I met another man at the warrior adventure who also was going through a divorce. He had never heard of Divorce Busting and when I talked to him it was obvious he needed it. So I gave him my number and the website address and said call me if you want more info. Maybe it will help.
Quote: You are amazing. I really, really wish my H had found this site when I was "lost" and could have walked through it all with someone like you.
Blessings to you, Amy
THank you Amy, I dont' feel 'amazing' but I do feel honorable. There is no guarantee that my W will want the marriage again, even as we become the persons we were meant to be. BUT there is a guarantee that whatever happens, she will be forever able to look to me for support until the time she may find someone else to fill that space for her.
I'm hopeful, but cautious. She is where she is and I will respect that. And I will always give her unconditional love.
PLease excuse this but I am having a bad day and only want to ask a question.
Do you ever think that maybe you should take all your love and give it to someone else who has been in your shoes and is looking for someone like you to cherish and would give their right arm for a guy like you?
I see all you are giving and I am trying to do the same but I am feeling today like what is the point. Bad day today, is their something to say about just moving on?
Transfer some of that strength over here with words if you can. Just not sure today I am doing the right thing.
Wife filed pr-liminary papers, does not wear ring, No OM but no talk R or us. 2 months into S and i dont see light and dont feel I will becasue of the things she has done.
well, today my W was in a flirty mood and at one point jokingly said to me "Your life would be meaningless without me!"
I said very calmly "No, my life wouldn't be meaningless without you."
She paused and asked me "What would it be like?"
I stopped and thought for about 30 seconds. She said "I'm sorry I shouldn't have said that" I replied "No it's ok, I'm thinking about my answer to your question"
Then I looked her in the eyes and said "My life would be a lot less fulfilling without you. I would miss my friend".
She didn't say anything and looked kind of dumbfounded, like the answer was a puzzle.
I really did think about it. I meant what I said, your life should not be meaningless because you lost someone you love. That doesn't do any honor to the person you lost and is not why you were put on this earth. It's NEEDY to put your whole reason for existing on one person. I DO miss my friend, my best friend.
So here's my puzzle. Was she looking to see if I would say 'yes it is meaningless without you' so she could feel good?
Remember, one of her 'fears' is that she would have to 'take care of me' again. So, I'm wondering if, as a woman, did she want to feel that importance in my life, or did she want to know that I was NOT needy, does that make her feel safer with me? What?
Or did I scare her away? This is very weird.
Oh, we also had sex today. She just walked up to me and embarassingly asked if I had time to 'fool around' and I said 'Sure, but is it ok if I FEEL something with you instead of it being 'just sex', can we actually be emotionally present?' and she said ok.
There was some crying again but I puased and held her a lot and I think what she needed was just that, to be loved and held. I was fully present emotionally and she felt it and knew it. She hasn't told me why she cries, but I don't mind it if I can be a comfort to her.
Afterwards she said that Counselor told her this was good therapy for her (I assume to get over being used by OM asswipe, who by the way sent her some 'stuff' she gave him along with a whiny letter telling her he was now devastated or something like that).
I felt really weird thinking that she's using sex with me as a way to 'heal' after choosing such a loser for an affair. To reaffirm her 'attractiveness' I guess. I'll have to ask Counselor tomorrow what the heck she's talking about.
And we're getting divorced, remember? Strange days.
The cool thing is after this weekend I had I really am fine with it all. I truly believe that my answer to her question will make her really think about what the heck I am feeling, and what does she want from me.
If she were to ask me 'do you love me? Are you in love with me?' She would like the answer. But she has to ask.
Quote: Do you ever think that maybe you should take all your love and give it to someone else who has been in your shoes and is looking for someone like you to cherish and would give their right arm for a guy like you?
Yes. Many times. Especially during the 'I'm in love with OM and I want a divorce and you suck' period of this adventure I'm in.
Remember when OM seemed to be fading out and suddenly he's back, and talking about moving to California? Read the 'back in love again, I'm done' on 1/19 at 10:04 am found HERE I was ready to give up, there had to be something better than this. But, Amy and others convinced me not to.
Quote: I see all you are giving and I am trying to do the same but I am feeling today like what is the point. Bad day today, is their something to say about just moving on?
Shark, your situation is different than mine in that you don't have the added complexity of an affair and the crazy 'in love' feelings to deal with. In my case I couldn't really even DB until the affair ended. She just could not SEE me. Sh*t man, I have been so far down, so empty, I am amazed I have lasted this out this long.
You're a strong man as is obvious by the things you say. BUT lack of patience is a problem we all have. I want this fixed TOMORROW.
DID YOU READ DIVORCE REMEDY? You will understand WHAT is going on if you do. And I HIGHLY recommend 'The Superior Man'. But you have to read it a few times and discuss it with someone who has read it to get the true meaning of some of the concepts. I know I did.
Quote: Transfer some of that strength over here with words if you can. Just not sure today I am doing the right thing. Wife filed pr-liminary papers, does not wear ring, No OM but no talk R or us. 2 months into S and i dont see light and dont feel I will becasue of the things she has done.
Shark, compared to some other situations, I really think your wife has done very little and has left big open doors. I mean, basically she's moved out and said a lot of 'classic' WAW stuff, filed some papers that are, well, just PAPERS and acting like everything is fine.
You, like me, are resisting having to change yourself and do EVERYTHING you do with her DIFFERENTLY.
you said THIS on your thread:
Quote: You know something very interesting:
When I chase my wife she gets strong and pulls away. When I get strong and pull away she acts different. There is a pattern emerging over the past 2months of this. During this time frame I have had two episode of weakness that lasts for about 3 – 5 days and during this time she is very strong in her move. But during the time in between she calls me or emails me for weird stuff and usually it’s about the kids. Oh and the funny thing, I am DB’ing and I always try to get off the phone first so I end up saying goodbye at least 3 times before we finish. She always has something else to say or ask me.
I read this and think to myself 'she has her fantasy that Shark will always be there. Shark is doing the right things to DB and attempt to let her have "what she want's" and disconnect from her and when he does, she comes back towards him. Sounds like she isn't QUITE done with Shark now is she?
Maybe not having him at her beck and call doesn't feel so good. I wonder why? Spitfire once told me that if a woman WANTS a divorce she will make a plan, and then not want ANYTHING to do with him when she executes the plan. I'm not seeing that here.
Shark, I know I want to stay the same, say 'hey you should love me!' and it's all better. BUT she left 'the same' and wants 'something different'. So, YOU have to change to 'something different'. And you know what? You really do WANT to change because 'the same' sucked for you too!
I'd trade my situation with yours any day, believe me. You have lots of hope. Way more than I had for a long time. You just need to do the work, and open your eyes.
DB'ing DOES work as long as there is something salvagable. You are a long ways from done. Do the work. Would you read a book on investment or economics or something else you needed to understand to do your job better? This is no different. Your life requires some investment but the rules are different than the stock market, and you'll have to learn the rules, and the skills to do the work. Otherwise, you'll lose your job.
Frank you and Spitfire are absolutely right on this:
Quote: Spitfire once told me that if a woman WANTS a divorce she will make a plan, and then not want ANYTHING to do with him when she executes the plan.
Something I haven't really announced on here is that I was married before and divorced. I left my first H. Something just wasn't right, we married too young....I just knew suddenly that something was wrong enough that I had to go. I went and I never looked back. I didn't call him, I didn't email him, I didn't want to be around him for even 5 seconds. I didn't file for divorce right away because I had little money and didn't know how, but I still never looked back. I took my two kids and lived in a tiny, dirty little apartment and found a job and never even thought about going back. One I made up my mind, there was no staying in teh same house he was in, there were no pleasant phone conversations. There was nothing. It was just over. As you can see, there is a huge difference in teh behavior of someone who wants a divorce and is sure of it, and the reaction we get from most spouses on this board. The things your wife does, Frank, the sex, the joking around, the going places together. That wouldn't happen. Even you Shark, as dreary as it seems, do you see what is there now? If a woman (or I'd guess a man) truly wants a divorce, they go and don't look back. They could care less about emailing or calling or sharing family time.
Frank, your marriage is on the road to recovery. I think you could feel comfortable moving over to Piecing now, I'm that sure of it. I felt that about you from the first time you posted. You were so sincere in your DBing and your love was so deep that I knew you'd do this. Your "calm and collectedness" continues to amaze me and it is a matter of time until your W recommits.
Email & MSN Messenger: Becca_1975@msn.com
Yesterday Is History
Tomorrow is a Mystery.
Today is a Gift.
That Is Why It Is Called "The Present"
Quote: Frank, your marriage is on the road to recovery. I think you could feel comfortable moving over to Piecing now, I'm that sure of it. I felt that about you from the first time you posted. You were so sincere in your DBing and your love was so deep that I knew you'd do this. Your "calm and collectedness" continues to amaze me and it is a matter of time until your W recommits.
Thanks Becca. I really appreciate your kind words.
I'm going to stay cautious for now. I still haven't gotten past the hurt of OM and to be truthful, as I get stronger in my own 'self' I'm not so sure I know what I want to do with her just yet. I think that she believes she needs to keep her 'independence', out of fear if nothing else.
I don't feel like I was 'calm and collected', but crazy out of control most of the time. I guess around HER I was as stable as possible while it was tearing me up. Sometimes I don't know how I made it this far, especially during the holidays. I think what has helped me MOST is the people on this board who took an interest in supporting me. I know I've been a little quiet on others threads the past few weeks but, as I said, last couple weeks were so hard and my cup was EMPTY as W used it all up.
I said some really poorly thought out things a couple weeks ago to 'totallymessedup' and realized that I could no longer help anyone else because I had nothing left to give and wasn't thinking straight. So I've been focusing on myself since then.
Now, I'm recharged and I feel much more empowered. So I'll start returning the kindness again.
I think W is using me right now to heal her emotional wounds from OM and there is no way I will allow she or I to fall into any kind of 'dependence' on each other. It didn't work before and it won't work now.
Sure, it sounds good on paper, but me actually doing this will be a real challenge. It's still a tough situation but there is one thing you are dead right on, my love for her is very very deep.
Well, it's THE day and I am going to stay around on the board for most of it to keep my sanity.
I don't feel like I was 'calm and collected', but crazy out of control most of the time. I guess around HER I was as stable as possible while it was tearing me up. Sometimes I don't know how I made it this far, especially during the holidays. I think what has helped me MOST is the people on this board who took an interest in supporting me. I know I've been a little quiet on others threads the past few weeks but, as I said, last couple weeks were so hard and my cup was EMPTY as W used it all up.
I feel the same way. On my thread last night I took a little heat for venting but you know what, it's really hard to convey tone and the nuances of things that happen in our sitches (not to mention forgetting key things that are said or done). I may sound like a basket case here, but I'm sure it confounds my W that I am really calm and even tempered most of the time in front of her. It is a . I owe that to you and the others here who help me daily. Thank you for that. I think you do a really great job of giving us complete information and putting in in context. It makes it really easy to offer you advice. I am glad to have helped. You are doing great and I am so happy to read good things about you and your W. I continue to pray for you.
I said some really poorly thought out things a couple weeks ago to 'totallymessedup' and realized that I could no longer help anyone else because I had nothing left to give and wasn't thinking straight. So I've been focusing on myself since then.
Wow. I am named as a witness to the crime.lol. I remember that and it was not you writing. I recognized that and if you remember my response, I did not take it to heart. I know Frank when I hear him. That might as well been a stranger.
Take care today Frank and really revel in where your heart is right now.
Quote: I said some really poorly thought out things a couple weeks ago to 'totallymessedup' and realized that I could no longer help anyone else because I had nothing left to give and wasn't thinking straight. So I've been focusing on myself since then.
Wow. I am named as a witness to the crime.lol. I remember that and it was not you writing. I recognized that and if you remember my response, I did not take it to heart. I know Frank when I hear him. That might as well been a stranger.
Yes, I knew that from your good response and I also knew at that time that I could NOT help ANYONE anymore so I backed out of that role. I'm glad is was you and not someone really in a MESS and not able to think on their own. You're strong.
So, as I have said I am empowered again and I'll be doing my best to support others now. Cup is full, life is good, with or without my W.
