16 months and counting

[Jabez]

Venting / Journaling

Today has been one of those days.

It's 3PM and I'm tired already. This past Wed WAW wrote to say that she "has honored my request long enough" and now DD's will be sleeping over at her apt on Tue and Thu nights. I'm just so tired of the picking, the false accusations, the selfishness and the unabashed greed. The alien is in full bloom.

I keep wondering if WAW is an MLC'er. I've looked thru the 6 stages of a MLC and can see behaviors defined in stages 1 & 2 in her past. She's been in stage 3 for about 18 months now. She's been getting more and more angry with me over the taxes and custody sitch. She's written that she feels like DD's "just visit her" and "she's losing her connection to them". My initial reaction was "DUH!", you can't be doin' the hokey-pokey w/OM every night and still have the same R w/DD's that you once had.

Another item of interest is WAW's focus on her weight. 3 1/2 years ago when the mini-bomb dropped (I'm not happy, but I'm not leaving), WAW had been going to the gym for years, but really got strict on what she would eat (no candy, ice cream, eat only Cheerios or oatmeal for breakfast, lots of salad) and lost 5 or 7 lbs. She whitened her teeth. She looked awesome. DD's told me last week that they go running w/Mom when they are with her b/c she thinks she's getting fat. (She still looks great to me!)

So the "lost connection" and the "attention to physical appearance" in conjunction w/OM's mom wanting to see me has me wondering "What's up doc?".

I wonder if she is on the "bridge" leaving Replay heading toward Depression. Or is she starting a new cycle of Replay? Something is brewing my, "Spidey Senses Are Tingling".

I'm w/DD's this weekend. We're going out for breakfast tomorrow and they are going out for lunch and shopping w/my SIL on Sun. Hope to get out and enjoy the warm weather here in the Mid-Atlantic.

Peace,
~J

[heatherg]

Jabez-
I hope you don't feel like anything I said was harsh. I can imagine how difficult it is to have to subject your girls to divorce in the first place and clearly you feel you have a better home for them. I just really feel that you think that one of the consequences of WAW leaving the M is for her R with her daughters to suffer. However, it doesn't have to be that way, I guess it's between WAW and the girls. I was just saying that I think it would be great for your girls if they could have a great R with both parents, both R's encouraged and nurtured by both parents. Two homes. Two families. Since that's the way it has to be.

Since Oct 2004, she has chosen to be a part-time Mom.

Exactly why do you say that? Do you think she's neglected the girls or are you saying that because her decision to cheat and destroy the family was not in the best interest of her daughters?

I'm not a licensed psychologist, but I think that I could get you and many other lay people as well as mental health professionals to agree that I what I think is in the best interest of the girls is really not an unreasonable plan.

Jabez, reasonable is a very subjective term and changes depending on whose perspective you're looking from. I didn't say your plan was unreasonable. Even parents who go for full custody have their reasons and I'm not trying to judge your reasons or your custody agreement. I guess I feel like I know the position you are in because when I was contemplating D, when I had H served, I had to do some really serious thinking about custody. I wanted my kids the majority of the time. I could come up with lots of reasons why it was best for them. But in my heart, in my heart, I knew I didn't have any more right to these human beings than my H does. In your situation, you may feel differently and you're certainly entitled to feel differently. I just think that mindset will create more of a tug of war between yourself, WAW and the girls and less coparenting is going to occur if that attitude shines through. And I think coparenting would be a really great goal to shoot for, whether you have primary custody, joint custody or full custody. I hope you see where I'm coming from and don't think I'm just trying to be a creep. I consider myself your friend and I hope you do too.

I'm sorry you're having a bad day, I hope it gets better. At least it's Friday!!

[Jabez]

I hope you don't feel like anything I said was harsh. No, harsh isn't the word. I just didn't agree with all that you wrote. I hope that this reply isn't received as harsh.

clearly you feel you have a better home for them It's not a matter of comparison. This is the only home they've ever known. If they had their druthers, they druther mom come home and we all live together, but since mom won't do that, they're obligated to go there.

one of the consequences of WAW leaving the M is for her R with her daughters to suffer I think that it is a natural course of events when a parent leaves the family to nurture their love for someone outside the family, i.e. the "absentee father". It's not like I kicked W out, she chose this life, I did not.

I feel like my relationship w/DD's has suffered. I don't get to eat with them 2 nights a week and every other weekend. This is going to sound very selfish and self-centered, but it seems like there is an inordinate amount of chatter about preserving and nurturing the relationship b/w the WAS and the children, but very little empathy and focus on the LBS, and how they have to juggle their own feelings about WAS, less time w/their children, and their children's feelings about WAS. I hope that didn't sound too petty.

Since Oct 2004, she has chosen to be a part-time Mom. Do you think she's neglected the girls or are you saying that because her decision to cheat and destroy the family was not in the best interest of her daughters? She's chosen to spend half her time w/OM. She's partially rejected DD's causing them emotional pain. Not physical neglect or emotional abuse, but by putting her own happiness ahead of DD's and expecting them to just accept it, I would categorize it as "partial emotional abandonment".

But in my heart, in my heart, I knew I didn't have any more right to these human beings than my H does. Heather, I'm not living in your home and only know what goes on from what I read. Quite possibly your postings take on the function of venting so maybe H isn't quite as bad as I think he is, but if he was half-in-the-bag a few nights a week and if you weren't around to make sure S5 was getting to bed before the late show was over, and from the way H teaches S5 to disrespect you, I would guess that he wasn't acting like the parent S5 & D3 need him to be and so in their best interest, I'd think that they would grow up to be better people by being with the better adjusted parent, i.e. you.

I guess I feel like I know the position you are in because when I was contemplating D, when I had H served, I had to do some really serious thinking about custody. Heather, I really do appreciate your empathy. I have very strong opinions about infidelity and how it influences our children. The truth is very important to me. My promise is very important. For two people to tell their kids, "Mommy and Daddy just don't love each other anymore and so you just have to accept it" is a failure to keep their promise not only to each other, but to their children. Its a cop-out.

In your situation, you may feel differently and you're certainly entitled to feel differently. This is the way I look at it. WAW said that she doesn't love me anymore. I'm a good dad, but our family is over, etc. OK, I accept that. You don't love me, you want to live next door to OM, go ahead, bye. You don't want to be a part of our family OK, don't, but I do and the girls do. We'll do fine w/o you, have a good life w/OM!

Open the vent, here it comes. . .

WAW didn't even try, she just walked. Yeah, I'm still hurt. Yeah, I still think this whole thing is wrong. I'm workin' my @$$ off trying to lead DD's by example. Trying to be loving and kind and gentle to the woman I love each time she kicks me in the gut. Understanding that she doesn't appreciate the a mess she's created. Understanding that right now she may not be capable of appreciating it. And understanding that right now she may not be "able to handle the truth". And, yes, it's got to be done. But somedays I'm still sitting here missing her all the time and DD's half the time and not wanting that to increase anymore.

You are my friend Heather. I know nothing about you other than what you posted here and the fact that you kissed a man a few times and now regret it and are workin' you @$$ off to make your R/M better gives hope to me that someday, if I love my W "right" now, we may be writing to each other from the "Piecing" board.

[blackfoot]

Trying to be loving and kind and gentle to the woman I love each time she kicks me in the gut.
Thats not logical, reasonable, or attractive. Did you see my post to TG about fighting with your SO?

Understanding that she doesn't appreciate the a mess she's created.
Yes she does. Make her own her half. Without fear, or anger. NO lovebusting. Flat facts.
And understanding that right now she may not be "able to handle the truth".
Give it to her anyways.

And, yes, it's got to be done. But somedays I'm still sitting here missing her all the time and DD's half the time and not wanting that to increase anymore.

manly hugs jabez.

[Jabez]

Trying to be loving and kind and gentle to the woman I love each time she kicks me in the gut.
Thats not logical, reasonable, or attractive. Did you see my post to TG about fighting with your SO?

BF,

Is TG TampaGuy1961? I looked thru his current two threads in "We're Separated" and didn't see your post regarding fighting with your SO? Can reply w/a link so that I can see it?

[WindyCityBeth]

Hey Jabez -

I am also really stuggling with the anger and resentment. I had some great advice on my thread so I thought I'd paste it here and maybe it will help you too.

I dont think it's all that diff from what other WAS deal with. They get to a point where they aren't happy.. they want to be happy.. it's not really us necessarily.. it's just that life has changed or they have problems and they can't find their way back into the marriage. At least that's the way it is with my XH. His depression; the way he handles problems; his childhood; baggage we've built up in our R. He loves his family, or at least wants to, but he's not mentally or emotionally able to pull it off right now. Maybe that's what answered the Whys for me. I saw that it doesn't HAVE to be about him not caring or wanting to hurt his family. The only answer that makes sense at all, is that he just can't and even he doesn't know why.


I'm not sure uf that helps you but perhaps if you look at your wife as being someone who is unhappy and doesn't know why. So, she blames you and lashes out at you. It isn't right, of course, but she just isn't strong enough right now to handle the emotions. Stay firm and hold up your boundaries but also be compassionate and compromise where you can.

WCB

[Jabez]

I'm not sure if that helps you but perhaps if you look at your wife as being someone who is unhappy and doesn't know why.

WCB,

I couldn't agree more. I've come to the conclusion that WAW is unhappy and it's not me, our R or our M. It's something deep inside her. The only way that I can "help" is to stay out of her way and let her work thru it herself. I think that WAW has an idea as to why she is unhappy, but to face it and deal w/it terrifies her.

~J

[blackfoot]

TG =Thatguy.

He has a thread in SSM. need help with boundaries.

I know your pain and fear jabez and not wanting to do anything to make the distance greater. Unfortunately fear is going to cause you to freeze and do the wrong thing. Its nearly impossible to see it when you are in the mix of course. the best thing you can do is take care of you and acknowledge you cant control the outcome. I do know that untill you reach this place, this state of mind, and act in accordance with it, its going to stay the same and/or get worse.

What would happen if you said NO. to your W about the girls staying over during the week?
Just NO.
Yes its inconvenient for her. Yes she misses them. Those are caused by her choices. If she threatens with lawyers? That too is her choice. You dont have to explain, you dont have to create a situation. Just No, they cant stay there. Youve said your piece, thats that.
Its not enforceable of course, your not going over there to get them, she can do what she wants --including ignore your NO. I am curious what would happen.

[Jabez]

I know your pain and fear jabez and not wanting to do anything to make the distance greater. Actually, the longer I'm "out" of our old R, the more I realize how I don't want to go back to that. W doesn't understand or believe that. She see's only the old and no other possibility.

What would happen if you said NO. to your W about the girls staying over during the week?...I am curious what would happen. Here's what happened. W emails "DD's are staying w/me tonight". I reply, "We haven't agreed to that, until we agree on a different schedule or a court orders a different schedule the schedule stays the same". W replies "DD's are staying w/me tonight". I reply, "I'll be by to pick them up at 9:00". At 8:30, I call and talk to DD's, ask if they are coming home, they say No, I say, I'll be by to pick you up at 9:00 D14 crys, D15 is silent. W gets on the phone agitated, aggravated, angry, threatens to call the cops if I show up, hangs up on me. 9:00 I ring the door bell. No answer. 9:01 I ring again. D14 opens the door in tears (D15 is in the shower). We talk, I assure her that I love her, I will always lover her, kiss her good night and leave w/o DD's. D14 calls this AM still in tears. D14, D15 & I talk. I wish them a good day at school, tell them that I love them and will see them after school.

I think that I've broken thru my fear of doing the wrong thing. In Tom Peters' business book "In Search of Excellence" he talks about "analysis paralysis". His remedy to that is to "do something, anything". I'm not going to go wild doing whatever strikes my whim at the moment, but after filtering my thoughts thru what I've learned in the past 18 months, I will do something.

[heatherg]

Wow Jabez, this reminds me so much of the power struggles that go on in my household. When someone just refuses to acknowledge your boundary....now in my situation, I would post on the boards about myself and how I contributed to the interaction and of course there are always things we should or should not have done that are so easy to see in hindsight. But do you beat yourself up about it or do you focus on the fact that it never should have happened in the first place?!

Whoo, sorry a little vent there, but I so empathize with your position there. That's really, really tough.

How are you feeling right now?