Learning to Trust Myself VI

[heatherg]

I've finished journaling our first MC session....here it is.

H talked for probably about the first 15 mins of the session. The C asked how we were doing and H said not good. Not good at all. He first expressed that he had told me he thought counseling would probably be a bad thing for us. The C didn’t ask him to elaborate on that. He went on to say that we had a really bad couple of weeks and that his session with the C had opened up a lot of things that he had “set aside for the benefit of the marriage and the family”.

He told her that everything him and I discuss, I either type out on the internet or look up on the internet. He said he thought it was almost ‘comical’. He told her about the incident where he found a website I was looking at (Marriage Builders-LoveBusters) and he laughed. He told her that I got really upset and then told him he was no longer allowed to use my computer. I added in “I actually said ‘unless you ask me first’”. He said I thought the whole point was that whatever you do is open to me. I said “Only if you respect that right. Laughing at me was not respectful.”

He went on to talk about my business dinner and how inappropriate he thought it was under the circumstances and how I did not discuss it with him before I made the commitment to go. At various times throughout the session, we came back to this either because he brought it up or because I did. We both used it as an example of what we didn’t like about the other person.
I told H he would get farther with me if he would have explained how the business dinner made him feel (scared, anxious, whatever) because that would get empathy from me. Telling me that the dinner is inappropriate is only going to make me defensive and want to list all the reasons that it isn’t inappropriate. The C said “H, why do you think that a business dinner is inappropriate?” He said “It isn’t?” C said “No, women have to go to business dinners all the time in this day and age.” H said “With a stranger, a man they’ve never met?” C said “Sure, all the time, new clients, whatever.” H said “Well, she has a history with this…” C said “Ok, so under the circumstances, you feel it’s inappropriate”. He said yes. The C said “Ok Heather, if H had expressed his feelings instead of telling you it was inappropriate, how would you have reacted?” I said “Well, the morning of the business dinner, I gave H the benefit of the doubt and tried to validate his concerns (told him I wouldn’t drink anything, I’d call, etc)…..I would have said those things much sooner if he would have expressed his feelings to me rather than attacking me. Would I still have gone? Yes. Would I have made it as easy for him as possible? Yes.

The C asked us both what we thought the root causes for our problems were. She looked at H first. He said there was too much to pick one thing, he said there were layers of issues. The C said that may be true, but often all the layers are caused by a few core problems and if you focus on the layers instead of the core problems, you’ll never get anywhere. H ended up saying that I was a ‘self oriented person’. She said “Ok, so Heather is self-centered, is that accurate?” He said no, not self centered, self oriented. She said what is the difference? He said well, self centered is where someone consciously looks out for number one. Heather doesn’t even seem to realize she’s being selfish, she doesn’t realize how it impacts other people. It’s not intentional with her. But I see it more and more, even with the kids. I said “Can you give an example of what you’re talking about with the kids?” He said “Well, karate for one. (He looks at the counselor) I don’t know how she does it. She comes straight from work, plays with D3 for about 45 mins while S5 is doing karate and then she stays for her class right after. She hardly sees the kids on Wednesdays and Fridays.” I say nothing, but I think to myself ‘If my karate class is his best example of my selfishness, then I’m ok with that.’

When the C looked at me for my answer to what I thought the core problems were, I told her I was sure that one of the core problems is that we can’t communicate. I said H is disrespectful and dismissive of me and 99.9% of the time he is so sure he’s right, he will argue his point to it’s death. He even tells me how I feel and argues with me about my own feelings. I do not feel heard, I have not felt heard throughout this entire marriage. Before my A, I tried to tell H that I felt we were drifting apart, that I wanted to spend more time alone as a couple. I found pornography on his laptop. He argued with me about why it was wrong for me to feel the way I did. He never heard me.
He briefly defended his position that our family time should have been enough for me, stating that we did fun things and went out to dinner, etc. and I looked at him and said “Clearly it wasn’t enough for you either H, or I wouldn’t have found porn on your laptop.” I turned his own statement back on him and said “Why couldn’t our family time have been enough for you H? Why?” He did not answer.
I told the C that I don’t believe H has ever cared whether I stay or go, live or die, he just doesn’t seem to care. She asked “Do you believe he truly doesn’t care for you or do you think he’s just acted that way?” I said “Now, I believe he truly doesn’t care for me.”

I mentioned his body language and pointed out that it was disrespectful. I pointed out how he chose to sit on the chair instead of on the couch with me. How he was facing away from me. I asked him if he meant to tell me something by that and he said he didn’t notice he was turned away from me and he did not address sitting in the chair vs the couch. The C elaborated on body language some and agreed that body language can say a lot although she didn’t express an opinion on H’s body language during the session.

When we touched on the business dinner subject again, C asked what he would have liked for me to do and H expressed that he would have liked for me to have discussed it with him before I committed. I said I could have done that and next time would try to consider him first. H told the C that would never happen…that I may stick to my word if exactly the same situation happened again, but if it varied in any way, that I would be right back to doing as I please. The C got firm with him and told him that he can’t assume what I will do, he doesn’t know and that anytime one person starts thinking they know what the other person will do or say, there is trouble.

I also told him that honestly though, he is not the person I call first with good news anymore. He doesn’t seem to care anyway. I said “H, if you can tell me that you care about me, care about his marriage, say you want it to work, I am there.” He sarcastically said “Yeah.” He mentioned that something will inevitably ‘set me off’. I said “H, come on now. You admitted yourself that on the day of your C session, a lot of things had been reopened. You were not nice to me that day and you didn’t tell me why. Then the toy store incident. Things went to hell in a handbasket that day and we haven’t recovered since. Perhaps if you would have been honest with me that day and told me that you had a lot on your mind because of the counseling session things would have worked out differently.” He said something about things ‘not going my way’. I looked at the C and said “He doesn’t understand that the opposite of my way is his way. (I looked at H) “Who’s way do you think you’re fighting for? Do you think you have some higher purpose??” The C looked at H and said “Do you feel you’re better than Heather?” He said “No, no….well, except for the whole cheating thing”.

C told H he needed to stop shutting the door. She said that in order to rebuild this marriage we will have to work hard and take risks. Taking risks sometimes requires trust and that can be regained. She said it is difficult, but it is not impossible. She told H that he shut doors several times during the session and that he will have to stop doing that. H said that I blame him for everything, I blame him for my less than perfect relationship with my son. He gives his version of that and I give mine. Then he says again that I blame him for everything and C says “I don’t hear that”. H surprised, says “Oh….ok.”

At one point, the C asked H if he felt he needed help with anything or felt he needed some guidance in making any changes with himself. H seemed confused by that question so she sort of clarified, saying she mean does he have things he wants to change about himself. He said “No, it’s all R stuff”. I was bad here. I could not resist saying “No, as a person, he’s entirely perfect. I’m the one who’s been in C for 2 years because I’m messed up not him”. I apologized for my lack of restraint.




H talked for probably about the first 15 mins of the session. The C asked how we were doing and H said not good. Not good at all. He first expressed that he had told me he thought counseling would probably be a bad thing for us. The C didn’t ask him to elaborate on that. He went on to say that we had a really bad couple of weeks and that his session with the C had opened up a lot of things that he had “set aside for the benefit of the marriage and the family”.

He told her that everything him and I discuss, I either type out on the internet or look up on the internet. He said he thought it was almost ‘comical’. He told her about the incident where he found a website I was looking at (Marriage Builders-LoveBusters) and he laughed. He told her that I got really upset and then told him he was no longer allowed to use my computer. I added in “I actually said ‘unless you ask me first’”. He said I thought the whole point was that whatever you do is open to me. I said “Only if you respect that right. Laughing at me was not respectful.”

He went on to talk about my business dinner and how inappropriate he thought it was under the circumstances and how I did not discuss it with him before I made the commitment to go. At various times throughout the session, we came back to this either because he brought it up or because I did. We both used it as an example of what we didn’t like about the other person.
I told H he would get farther with me if he would have explained how the business dinner made him feel (scared, anxious, whatever) because that would get empathy from me. Telling me that the dinner is inappropriate is only going to make me defensive and want to list all the reasons that it isn’t inappropriate. The C said “H, why do you think that a business dinner is inappropriate?” He said “It isn’t?” C said “No, women have to go to business dinners all the time in this day and age.” H said “With a stranger, a man they’ve never met?” C said “Sure, all the time, new clients, whatever.” H said “Well, she has a history with this…” C said “Ok, so under the circumstances, you feel it’s inappropriate”. He said yes. The C said “Ok Heather, if H had expressed his feelings instead of telling you it was inappropriate, how would you have reacted?” I said “Well, the morning of the business dinner, I gave H the benefit of the doubt and tried to validate his concerns (told him I wouldn’t drink anything, I’d call, etc)…..I would have said those things much sooner if he would have expressed his feelings to me rather than attacking me. Would I still have gone? Yes. Would I have made it as easy for him as possible? Yes.

The C asked us both what we thought the root causes for our problems were. She looked at H first. He said there was too much to pick one thing, he said there were layers of issues. The C said that may be true, but often all the layers are caused by a few core problems and if you focus on the layers instead of the core problems, you’ll never get anywhere. H ended up saying that I was a ‘self oriented person’. She said “Ok, so Heather is self-centered, is that accurate?” He said no, not self centered, self oriented. She said what is the difference? He said well, self centered is where someone consciously looks out for number one. Heather doesn’t even seem to realize she’s being selfish, she doesn’t realize how it impacts other people. It’s not intentional with her. But I see it more and more, even with the kids. I said “Can you give an example of what you’re talking about with the kids?” He said “Well, karate for one. (He looks at the counselor) I don’t know how she does it. She comes straight from work, plays with D3 for about 45 mins while S5 is doing karate and then she stays for her class right after. She hardly sees the kids on Wednesdays and Fridays.” I say nothing, but I think to myself ‘If my karate class is his best example of my selfishness, then I’m ok with that.’

When the C looked at me for my answer to what I thought the core problems were, I told her I was sure that one of the core problems is that we can’t communicate. I said H is disrespectful and dismissive of me and 99.9% of the time he is so sure he’s right, he will argue his point to it’s death. He even tells me how I feel and argues with me about my own feelings. I do not feel heard, I have not felt heard throughout this entire marriage. Before my A, I tried to tell H that I felt we were drifting apart, that I wanted to spend more time alone as a couple. I found pornography on his laptop. He argued with me about why it was wrong for me to feel the way I did. He never heard me.
He briefly defended his position that our family time should have been enough for me, stating that we did fun things and went out to dinner, etc. and I looked at him and said “Clearly it wasn’t enough for you either H, or I wouldn’t have found porn on your laptop.” I turned his own statement back on him and said “Why couldn’t our family time have been enough for you H? Why?” He did not answer.
I told the C that I don’t believe H has ever cared whether I stay or go, live or die, he just doesn’t seem to care. She asked “Do you believe he truly doesn’t care for you or do you think he’s just acted that way?” I said “Now, I believe he truly doesn’t care for me.”

I mentioned his body language and pointed out that it was disrespectful. I pointed out how he chose to sit on the chair instead of on the couch with me. How he was facing away from me. I asked him if he meant to tell me something by that and he said he didn’t notice he was turned away from me and he did not address sitting in the chair vs the couch. The C elaborated on body language some and agreed that body language can say a lot although she didn’t express an opinion on H’s body language during the session.

When we touched on the business dinner subject again, C asked what he would have liked for me to do and H expressed that he would have liked for me to have discussed it with him before I committed. I said I could have done that and next time would try to consider him first. H told the C that would never happen…that I may stick to my word if exactly the same situation happened again, but if it varied in any way, that I would be right back to doing as I please. The C got firm with him and told him that he can’t assume what I will do, he doesn’t know and that anytime one person starts thinking they know what the other person will do or say, there is trouble.

I also told him that honestly though, he is not the person I call first with good news anymore. He doesn’t seem to care anyway. I said “H, if you can tell me that you care about me, care about his marriage, say you want it to work, I am there.” He sarcastically said “Yeah.” He mentioned that something will inevitably ‘set me off’. I said “H, come on now. You admitted yourself that on the day of your C session, a lot of things had been reopened. You were not nice to me that day and you didn’t tell me why. Then the toy store incident. Things went to hell in a handbasket that day and we haven’t recovered since. Perhaps if you would have been honest with me that day and told me that you had a lot on your mind because of the counseling session things would have worked out differently.” He said something about things ‘not going my way’. I looked at the C and said “He doesn’t understand that the opposite of my way is his way. (I looked at H) “Who’s way do you think you’re fighting for? Do you think you have some higher purpose??” The C looked at H and said “Do you feel you’re better than Heather?” He said “No, no….well, except for the whole cheating thing”.

C told H he needed to stop shutting the door. She said that in order to rebuild this marriage we will have to work hard and take risks. Taking risks sometimes requires trust and that can be regained. She said it is difficult, but it is not impossible. She told H that he shut doors several times during the session and that he will have to stop doing that. H said that I blame him for everything, I blame him for my less than perfect relationship with my son. He gives his version of that and I give mine. Then he says again that I blame him for everything and C says “I don’t hear that”. H surprised, says “Oh….ok.”

At one point, the C asked H if he felt he needed help with anything or felt he needed some guidance in making any changes with himself. H seemed confused by that question so she sort of clarified, saying she mean does he have things he wants to change about himself. He said “No, it’s all R stuff”. I was bad here. I could not resist saying “No, as a person, he’s entirely perfect. I’m the one who’s been in C for 2 years because I’m messed up not him”. I apologized for my lack of restraint.


This is my best recollection, I'm sure some things are out of order. I know it will help to keep a journal of our sessions even if I can't remember everything in it's proper order.