Hey, Imdi! I'm taking Ellie's corner in this, too, and here's why (and BTW, Ellie's the one who predicted this for me looong before I had the facts to which I could attach my emotions):
I had a "betrayal," too, about a year ago. It went even a little further than yours. When H left me in September, *that's* the reason he gave for leaving. He said he couldn't move past what I had done, and that his feelings for me had changed because of it.
I had to buy into that because I had no evidence that there was *any* other reason why H would leave me. Looking back, I think that's one reason why I dropped the rope with H and why I wasn't angry at him for leaving. I felt like I deserved it. It sounds like you're feeling the same way about your sitch.
Ellie speculated soon after I had started posting that my H was likely having an A and had left me for OW. One part of my brain didn't want to believe it -- and couldn't, quite frankly, because I had no evidence whatsoever -- but the other part of my brain almost *wanted* to believe it because at least then I could understand why he was doing what he was doing.
For months, my H's A went undetected by me and everyone else. And he was successful in transferring his guilt onto me. He told his parents and all of his friends that I had cheated on him, and that's the reason he didn't think my baby was his, and thus the reason he left me. He painted me as the bad guy -- and had me totally convinced that I was -- while all along (from the days leading up to him leaving me), he was emotionally, and later physically, invested in OW.
The only way I uncovered their A was walking in on them (except I had seen her car once at his house during our separation; however, I wasn't going to get angry at him for dating while we were separated, so I kinda let it roll off my back). After I caught them, I checked H's cell phone records and discovered the truth: That he had been confiding in OW, obsessively, since days before he left me. And he recently told me that the night he left me, he and OW made out.
All I'm trying to point out to you, Imdi, is that you could be *totally* convinced right now that you're the bad guy, and you can be doing everything in your power to make amends to H, and there's a definite chance that you're taking all the heat while in fact he secretly carries *a lot* of the responsibility.
A good friend of mine gave me some wonderful words of wisdom when I "came out" about my "betrayal." He said, "True justice is paying once for a mistake." You've paid your debt.
Forgive yourself, Imdi. And understand that you may not be entirely at fault here. Yes, it's good for you to soul-search to find out what you did wrong. Many people (including me) will argue that limited contact like you had with that guy is not worth you beating yourself up over. But only you know what you're willing to forgive yourself for, and when.
Be prepared, though, for the possibility that one day you'll realize how much heat you took while your H was conducting a betrayal of his own. I'm not saying with all certainty that he is, but many of the same signs are in your sitch as I had in mine.
Many people will also tell you not to go snooping. I know there was a part of me that regretted it after I did. But I went in search for the truth, and I got it. At least I was able to see that I wasn't entirely at fault in my situation. I was able to forgive myself finally and understand what I was *truly* up against, as opposed to what my H was telling me. I realized that I wasn't the problem; he was. It didn't make the pain go away, but it made me realize that I had absolutely no control over my sitch and that no amount of apologizing or making amends could fix the problem ... because the problem wasn't mine.
Your H has you in a very good spot (for him), if in fact he is carrying on a R with OW. He has you, actively making amends for your "transgression," and he's taking advantage of that -- with or without an A. In other words, if he *is* having an A, then he's making you continue to pay for something while he's just as guilty, if not more so. If he's *not* having an A, then he's just digging the knife in deeper with you, using his words to push you back down in the water each time you come up for air. That's not fair, and it's not healthy.
Look around and see the many people (including me) who have been able to put our spouse's A behind us. He11, my H might have gotten someone else preggo, for goodness' sakes. And I'm not some saint. If *I* can move past a full-blown A -- and so many others can, too -- why do you think your H can't get over you freakin' talking to someone on the telephone? Doesn't make sense, does it? Not unless he's casting blame on you in an attempt to keep you so beaten that you don't have the energy to find out what he's really up to.
I would advise that you get back in touch with yourself a little and stop being a victim of his transfer of guilt. It takes a lot of courage to do, and only you know when enough is enough. But don't let him run over you, Imdi. Don't let him take advantage of your love.
And at the point when you think you can handle the truth, go find it. If you discover your H is having an A, it's going to hurt. But it's also liberating for you and your sense of self. You will be able to break free from the bondage of your own guilt, and that's so very important in your own healing process.
I'm shooting from the hip here, because I got so angry reading your posts. All the feelings I had when H left me, and when he blamed me for his abandonment, came rushing back. I hope what I wrote made sense. I'll be back around to check on you...
Imdi, that is some excellent advice above. Please take it. I want to see you gain a little bit of strength back.
You don't have to go searching for the definite proof today. But at least think about it; it would give you the chance to forgive yourself. (but I still say you didn't do anything wrong)
By the way, I know it took tremendous courage on your part to actually leave your house last night and NOT spend the night. Be very proud of yourself here. That was not an easy thing to do, but you did it.
I'll check back on you, too. Hugs!!!
Most of us really marry only once. First love endures, even unto our dying day. And we never really divorce.
Wow Preggo, excellent advice. I'm just realizing how much it applies to me too. My H is about to start not just one A but a second and somehow I feel like it's because I've done something wrong. I certainly contributed to the problems in our M, but hell, I'm not the one going off and screwing my coworkers.
Anyway, Imdi, I think Preggo has it right. Your H is projecting what he's done on you. As for snooping, since I found out about my H's first A, I've done probably too much snooping. You have to be prepared to find out the worst about your H. That said, I'm glad I know the truth. I hated being lied to most and felt humiliated that I was the last to know. Knowing what he's up to hurts but at least I feel a little more in control.
I hated being lied to most and felt humiliated that I was the last to know. Knowing what he's up to hurts but at least I feel a little more in control. Oh gosh, I SO know what you mean. The lying was the worst part; the denial, being the last to know. I am so glad that I am past that awful point. Imdi, it is true, it hurts to find out what's really happening, but you do stop the insanity that you go through constantly wondering if there is o.w. involved. And eventually you do feel a bit more control; at least you finally know. In your case, because your H. is projecting like this and using it as a reason to not reconcile, I think I would take P&DB'ing's advice and do what you need to do. You just cannot let him blame you for what HE is doing. You didn't even have an affair; all you did was talk to a friend that happened to be a guy! Sorry; I'm just being a bit protective of you, my friend. Hugs and goodnight, Hope
Most of us really marry only once. First love endures, even unto our dying day. And we never really divorce.
Hi lmdi I read over your thread, and just wanted to give some feedback. I agree with everyone that your H is likely projecting his own guilt onto you. When I read about your story it kinda trips me out because it reminds me so much of my own, though, and I feel at such a loss to give advice. I feel hypocritical to tell you that I think you should act "as if" you are moving on, end all intimacy, and hope he wakes up, b/c that is exactly what I feel like I should do but can't seem to succeed at it! However that is what my brain tells me you should do, for what it is worth. And I also fear that my naivity is coming into play, but I have to say that I do think it sounds like your H really does want you back, but that something (guilt? fear? resentment?) is preventing him from making a final decision. Keep in mind that that is also how I feel about my H's actions, so I could be a bad person to listen to here. But just from reading your posts, it does seem like he is terribly confused, which is why I tend to believe that if you pulled away it would force him to make a decision, and while it may seem scary to think what the decision could be, strong feelings like that are hard to get rid of. Plus, maybe just any decision would feel better than this limbo we are stuck in, no? And god, it just seems like your H and my H start to freak a bit if they see us pull back at all. My H makes up the strangest reasons to call if he doesn't hear from me, and then there is their need to be intimate with us somewhat regularly. I wonder what they would feel if that ended. Anyone else have any input on that aspect? Anyway, I am going to sleep now so I am gonna end this here, but in response to your reply on my thread, I am in Bayonne, which is right by Jersey City and Hoboken. It would be great to get together someday. Take Care!
PandDBing- Thank you for taking the time to post to me. I know the likelihood that my H is having an A is pretty great. I have had enough information presented to me. The thing is, it was easier to blame myself b/c it hurt less. I figured that if this was just about what I did, then there was a better chance of us reconciling, than if there was someone else. I try not to believe it b/c if i do, then it makes me wonder what else he could have lied about, including loving me. I never thought that i would be in this position today...i never thought he would have wanted to live without me. I guess i was wrong.
I know that what i did is nothing to end a marriage over. But, the fact that my H wants to punish me so much makes me question his feelings for me. If he really loved me, would he feel that way? I don't think so.
I do blame myself for what i did. But, i also know that it could have been much worse. As i pointed out to my H the other night, marriages have faced worse than this and made it. I guess it just points to how much he wants me, versus how much he wants her. I am certainly not painting myself to be a saint...even before this happened, we had problems in our M and i was partly responsible for those problems. But, if he loved me as much as he says he did, then you just don't do this, imo.
I used to snoop a lot. And i stopped. For one, if i confronted him about it, he made up some story that i didn't believe anyway. If i didn't confront him, then i had this information that was only hurting me. I've contemplated hiring someone to follow him, but i realized that the reason i was going to do it was so that i could have "dirt" on him, to use against him, to even the playing field. And i really didn't think that was a good enough reason. Believe me, there are times now that i want to follow him, or go to her house to see if he is there. But, i don't b/c i just don't feel emotionally able to handle it.
So what do i do? I love this man, despite what he is doing. And i keep hoping that he will decide that he doesn't want to lose me. But, i don't know if i am just fooling myself. The pain that i feel is unbearable. And i just wish it would end.
Thanks hope and super- I know that this is my H projecting onto me. I wonder how much guilt he even feels...i doubt any. I just feel at a loss as to what to do. I wonder if anything would make a difference at this point.
How do you get past this? How do you get over the pain and the hurt and the loss? I was laying in bed last night, crying, wondering what i am supposed to do with all of our pictures. How stupid is that? I can't imagine not having him in my life in some capacity. I don't know if he feels the same. I used to think so, but now i am not so sure.
He called last night..he was very melancholy...he didn't feel well. We talked for a few minutes. He told me he was going to be calling realtors today to come look at the house and give us an idea of how much to ask for it. So, i guess he is taking the next step. He asked me if i had anything to say about it. I just asked him if he had thought about what we had talked about the night before. He said, no, b/c he really wasn't feeling well. So, i don't know what to think.
You know what upset me today? The fact that, if my H moves in with her, then her and her kids will now have my cat as their pet...and that really upset me. Plus, all of our nice new furniture...that was supposed to be for us. God, WTF is wrong with my H?
Should i still have hope? I just don't know anymore. On one hand, i feel like there is absolutely no chance for us. And then, he will say or do something that makes me think otherwise. Like the other night, when i told him i thought that he was thinking of me in negative ways in order to justify him wanting the D, b/c if he still thought of me as the sweet girl he met, he would want to give me another chance. And he said that i was right. I mean, he could have said that i was wrong. He didn't even want to admit that to me. Does that mean anything? He says he will no longer have contact with me, but then if i don't call him for 2 days, he calls me asking if i am still alive. God, this is so confusing.
I'm sorry for rambling...just have so many things on my mind. Thanks for reading.
Hey flutter- Thanks for stopping by and for responding. As i wrote above, i do believe that my H is projecting...oh, the irony. Thank you for saying that it does seem as if he wants me back...sometimes i doubt that. But, his messages are so mixed, that i just don't know what to think or believe anymore.
I started to re-read "Make up, don't break up" last night. Only got through a few pages, but one of the things that kind of hit home for me is the fact that male distancers will often pull away after getting "too" close. So, i wonder if that is what he is doing now. It seems to have happened before. He will call me and we will have these amazing talks, and then the next day, he is acting all weird. I don't know...maybe i am grasping at straws.
At times, i do feel like i should just make the decision to move on and limit contact with him in an effort to force his hand, and that maybe he would realize he doesn't want to lose me. But, that could be wishful thinking on my part.
God, i just feel so sick this morning. And just so tired. I am so tired of all of this...i am tired of feeling miserable. But, i don't know what else to do b/c i do love my H and want my M. So, i guess that means i continue to stick it out. I hope thats not a mistake.
I love that book; Sassy let me borrow it. I read the same thing about male distancers and I wonder if that is what my H. is doing right now, also. The book is excellent, and I plan to re-read some of it this weekend. Imdi, when I’m feeling really, really bad I call a pastor friend of my family and he is also a professional marriage counselor. It’s pretty nice, the free advice. I talked to him last night and told him the latest about my situation. He talked to me for a long time and the advice he gave me was to stay in the boat during the storm. He told me a story that had to do with this, and he asked me if I understood; I told him I did. And so I’m passing this advice onto you, because I think you need it today. Just stay in the boat and ride out your own storm. That is all we can do. If we give up then there is no hope left. Hugs, Hope
Most of us really marry only once. First love endures, even unto our dying day. And we never really divorce.
