not sure what to do next-please help

[lisa0219]

Erin,
I just logged onto this website to message today..Reading your story has been almost like I was reading my own. I don't know what to tell you to do. I left my husband and month and a half ago and regret it every single day. Maybe he is having an emotional affair. Have you asked him what is missing in the marriage. You have a young child, do you set a night for just the two of you, your husband and yourself, to spend time together. Go for dinner, a movie, or just for coffee and talk. those are just ideas that I have, cause that is what I wished I would have done.
Good Luck
Lisa

[RBinBR]

Erin, I've reread your thread, and I had some more thoughts.

First, let me say that all of his actions until the trip are going to be based on the anticipation of how great that will be. (It might "cement" their R, as you suggest, or it might cause it to fizzle, who knows?) That means that there is basically no hope of change until after he gets back, unless you decide to do something drastic, as you will be tempted to do.

What you should know is this: most affairs do not ultimately result in a divorce. In those that do, the straying spouse rarely ends up marrying the other person in the affair. In those cases where they do marry, they have over a 75% of divorce. Therefore, if you can be patient, you have a very good chance of getting him back. There are many people on these threads for whom DBing works. See Tim's thread for a recent example.

His trip is not the end of the world and it is not the end of your marriage, even though it must seem like it.

On the other hand, it is easier for him to maintain his fantasy when he doesn't see OW but every few months for a short while. A long distance affair can last much longer than other kinds because there's no opportunity for the two of them to get tired of each other, which they might very well do if they were together all the time.

So, if you simply can't handle doing nothing until he gets back from Europe, you could try to pull a big 180 on him right now.

Personally, I would tell him that MC is useless right now because he won't work on the marriage, he instead wants to work on his affair; and his lying makes everything he says in MC worthless anyway since there's no way you can believe any word that comes out of his mouth. I would stop going, stop talking to him about your R or the OW, and basically quit talking to him (though still being friendly when you do speak).

You may also want to throw some light on the sitch and tell some more people. It isn't necessarily wrong for more people to know -- just ask yourself if that person could help or if they would only hurt your chances of reconciliation.

In any case, you need to reformulate a plan. Fear is not a plan and you can't live the way you are right now.

[CurlyQT]

Erin - how are you going?

I hope you've recovered from the ordeal of finding out your husband is going to Germany.

Thinking of you

[Donlee]

Erin,
RBinBR is exactly right. Hang in there. We are here for you.

Don

[Erin]

First, thansk so much to so many who have replied. I can't say how much reading your encouragement has helped. Now, I wish I could be a littel more orgnized in responding, but I'm not so good at this posting thing, so I just see what happens....

H has surprised me since I told him I knew about the trip. He has not been too defensive or withdrawn as I would have expected. I suppose I made this easy when, in fear, I told him a few days after confronting him on his lie that nothing had changed. I guess I was taking GH's advice - I asked myself if his plan changed the overall situation wherin he was cheating and I was DBing, and it didn't.

As me for me - I have gotten a grip of sorts. Somehow. I am able to eat again which is a relief becuase I love food (yes, three cheers for the LBS diet! 5'7" and lost almost thirty pounds since Jan - don't worry - 138# is still healthy for me.) And since I'm eating, I can run when my schedule allows which helps my mood immeasureably. I'm planning on running the cherry blossom 10 miler in a few weeks, and if my marriage still sucks I may well sign up for the Marine Corps Marathon this fall. I last ran it 10 years ago - I was a senior in college. I was so strong and fast and lean - I would love to feel powerful like that again. My days with S2 are good, but I have bad moments. I yell, and I hate yelling at my kid. I cry, and I hate crying in front of him. Sometimes he comes up to me, puts his little baby hands on my face and says "mommy sad." It breaks my heart. THis little guy is so precious, and he deserves two good parents, instead he has one injured one. God willing, we'll all get through this without too many scars.

Now, about the sitch - we have actually had a few good conversations. No "marriage conferences" as we were supposed to, to a few R talks nonetheless. It occurs to me that H thinks we are working on M when we have R talk - while I would think we were working on M if were doing M things together: dates, living together, eating dinner as a family etc. I think that's how he justifies saying he is working on M when that is impossible when he is carrying on A. I am a bit uncomfortable with all the R talk, as it is not very DB, but he doesn't seem to mind, and it is getting us somewhere. Anyway, a few things have come into the light between us, and show some promise for expanding. After MC a few weeks ago, where he went on about how he never got enough recognition in our M, I asked him why he rejected $ex with me so much over the past few years (I swear, I am attractive and nice and good in bed - still it was a crummy pattern of 2-3X, then nothing for a month or more etc.) He said he didn't know, and we both said it was a puzzling thing - maybe a symptom of something bigger, but unsure of what it meant. Well, HE brought it up last week, and we explored further. I suggested that maybe his internet/MB habit was out of proportion to his real life, and he agreed. Anyway, to spare you the details, the more I think and read about this, I think it is critiical to what happened with OW, and although I don't see him taking responsibility for it (maybe ever) I do think he is interested in changing this pattern. Anyway, I think it is so good that we are talking about it openly - and I am guessing that we can becaues there is no sex between us right now, so no pressure etc. Although he did say he thought I was looking hot lately.

Now, in the meantime, a major job offer appeared on the scene. It would change his whole life in a big way - double the money almost and no travel and no risk of deployment - cushy civilian life. I think he is going to take it, and I am scared to death. I fear he is taking it to be able to live alone (not with his mom who is driving him nuts) and pay child support and be with OW who he otherwise cannot be with. Moreover, I think he will be miserable doing this job, especially considering he LOVES his current position. However, I have been reading lots of posts by GH and OT and I will say that I don't KNOW what he is thinking in taking the job. It's worth mentioning that he has said a few "we" sentences about after the new job i.e. "we'd get a sailboat" - which I know weren't mistakes becuase he has assiduously avoided ANY future talk about us. It's like he was trying it out on his tongue, so I know not to make too much of it. So, I am trying to be supportive and not interfere, and own that I don't need to fix this for him.
I guess that has been a biggy for me - not trying to affect outcomes lately. When my MIL told me she was going to kick him out - instead of panicking about where he will go and telling her that kicking him out won't make him move home, I just left her with it - said "It seems like this makes you really sad. Me too." I'm a very textbook middle child who tries to fix everything for everyone - so this is a big step and I am a little proud of myself.

Now, about Germany I am still stuck. I just don't know how I can tolerate it if he does go. I can avoid doing anything rash until then, but I don't know if I can tolerate DBing when he comes back. I suppose I have to expect that he is going - as RB said - everything he does right now is leading up to that trip. In fact, when I asked him what he was thinking in going - he said "I don't know" - but also "I guess I think the answer lies there." Not encouraging at all. Why oh why can't he see that the answer lies in him!? This is especially ironic given that one of his complaints about our M (before I knew about A, and thought this was just about M) was that I look for happiness outside myself too much. HA! So, I expect that he will go. I simply don't know if I can handle it. I know an ultimatum is no good. I also know that I don't think I can handle such an in-your-face betrayal. I have no options other than to observe, but I don't know how I can avoid action after he comes back. Hopefully we will talk about this in MC next week. He has also said he is going to seek IC, but I'll believe it when I see it. I suppose I could go dark if he goes and then see how the chips fall...I just don't know what else to do. I know that he thinks he can disentangle himself by going - but we all see that he will only be more entangled. Horribly so. Lord, if only he wouldn't go. Easter would be a wonderful time to come home and recommit to a marriage, wouldn't it?
So, I guess I'm in a DB holding pattern trying to be lovely while he thrashes about and destroys our married life and all of his integrity. I am feeling good about doing as well as I am - and he has noticed. Said several times how I am doing better than him - you know, it makes me mad when he says this - it's like he's thinking, "phew. Now I can go ahead and leave her now that I know she won't fall apart." Anybody else have the urge to tell thier H how bad they are really feeling underneath all the "as ifs"?

Enough for now. Thank you all for your insight - its not like the light at the end of the tunnel - its better - its a much needed light IN the tunnel. And it is dark in this one.
E

[grasshopper]

Erin,

You mentioned me a few times in this last post, and I see I haven't even posted to your thread. Sorry for that.

It seems like you are doing GREAT considering what you are facing. I don't know how I would do if my W was planning such a trip.

You are correct, however, when you say it doesn't really change the core situation. You just have to be careful that you don't go beyond your ability to respect yourself in all this. If you can give him the time and space because YOU want to and YOU can accept the responsibility for the pain you cause yourself because if it, then by all means, continue on. I personally think you sound great, and strong too.

These things, the A's, hate the light of day. With this thing so in the open, it's likely to fade in terms of excitement for your H. He is already making those stupid little gestures they all make that symbolizes him recognizing what he is doing. That means DB is working.

I think if you're able to GAL while he is gone, and focus on that great little man who deserves you more than your H, you will be ok. When he returns, you will just have to deal with that when it happens.

I posted that I went to church for the first time in like 20 years this past Sunday. All kidding aside, you know what I got most from it? I realized that most every religion and philosophy I am aware of centers around the idea that living in the present, that is not worrying about the past or future, is paramount to happy, healthy living.
The sermon was about that, the book I am reading currently is about that, and so much of what we read in the other books is in some way about that. Even my C says that all the time...wonder if there is something to it, lol.
What I am saying is that you cannot control this, and you cannot predict what will happen on the trip, or when he gets home. You only have a CHANCE to predict how YOU will be by making goals and plans to improve your life situation.

Like I said, you're doing great. Smile once today and twice tomorrow.

GH

[RBinBR]

My days with S2 are good, but I have bad moments. I yell, and I hate yelling at my kid. I cry, and I hate crying in front of him. Sometimes he comes up to me, puts his little baby hands on my face and says "mommy sad." It breaks my heart. THis little guy is so precious, and he deserves two good parents, instead he has one injured one. God willing, we'll all get through this without too many scars.

I've been writing about that on my thread. I'm actually starting to get very resentful on behalf of my D4. I've dealt with my issues, but how can I not be angry with my W for what she's doing to our D?

[RBinBR]

Now, about Germany I am still stuck. I just don't know how I can tolerate it if he does go. I can avoid doing anything rash until then, but I don't know if I can tolerate DBing when he comes back.

Erin, I think you need to start working on some plans right now. Don't be left to react without putting some thought into what you will do in different situations.

I know that he thinks he can disentangle himself by going - but we all see that he will only be more entangled. Horribly so. Lord, if only he wouldn't go.

Now, why do you say that? Can you predict how his trip is going to go? You are assuming that he will become more emotionally attached to her, but the exact opposite could happen.

Besides, didn't he meet her in Jan.? So, to quote GH, what will really change by his going? He has been having an A, and it is continuing. The only thing you have to decide is how you are going to react.

I also wanted to pull up something you said a while back:

In fact, I have been struggling with this new found anger - part of me thinks it has been around for a while, appropriately so, and I am just now feeling it, and then part of me says YES! feel it! Move through it! and part of me says oh no, quash that anger before it moves me to something I don't want. I am not used to feeling angry and I just don't know what to do with this. I mean, I see that anger is to be avoided, but I also suspect that anger left unmitigated turns into resentment, and that has been a trap for me my whole life.

Are you letting this anger out? You don't want to try to squash it. I'm concerned because you're yelling at your kid. Take a broom and beat your bed with it or something. Does running get the anger out for you? Find a way to get it out without hurting your son.

[RBinBR]

he went on about how he never got enough recognition in our M

Are you doing anything about this? This is hugely important -- your H has given you a big key towards regaining his heart. As hard as it may be right now, you need to find things that you still admire about him and let him know when you talk. I believe that in your acting "as if," you should indicate that you still believe in him and are confident that he will eventually do the right thing.

Your previous mention of your sarcastic comments indicates another area that you can address this issue. You have to stop all of those permanently.

I suggested that maybe his internet/MB habit was out of proportion to his real life, and he agreed. Anyway, to spare you the details, the more I think and read about this, I think it is critiical to what happened with OW, and although I don't see him taking responsibility for it (maybe ever) I do think he is interested in changing this pattern.

There's no question in my mind, Erin. Most men don't get nearly enough admiration from their wives. For myself, I can tell you that I've always wanted to be proud of me. The lack of that was my largest unmet need in my marriage.

For example, the worst moment for me in our marriage (until her recent A, of course) was when I was fired in early 2004. The moment in my life when I was lowest, felt the most like a failure, and needed her support the most ... that when became angry with me and heaped more rejection on.

My own problem with porn was largely a misguided attempt to fill that emotional need. I could pretend that the women on the screen admired me and thought I was the greatest. It usually wasn't about sexual release.

[Erin]

Hey RBinBR - thanks for so much time and thought in your comments. You've got me thinking about a few things:

First, I suppose I can address the recognition issue in a few low-key ways in everyday conversation. And you're right, sarcasm undercuts that. It's just that sarcasm is my crutch...

Now, as far as the anger issue - YEs running helps immensely. However, I can't run everyday, and I really notice my ability to cope suffers when I can't get away for a few miles. I am gritting my teeth to a pulp (literally) with the daily stresses of parenthood and my marriage falling apart. Honestly, I don't feel too much overt anger at my H these days - probably that was a luxury I had when I thought he was on his way home right after leaving us (saying how much he missed us etc.) I try to do breathing exercises when I am losing it and can't do anything else (like this a.m. when my S2 sprayed toasted sesame oil all over the walls and the stairs and the carpet while I was washing my face. ) All in all, I think I am doing okay with the anger and coping, I'm just used to being an enormously patient person, and I am not there right now.

Now, about Germany - I agree that reacting is a bad idea - I just don't see any options here. I'm not ready to make any decisions or give an ultimatum, but I am anticipating how painful it will be to know he is there with her, and I just can't imagine how I will cope. How will I look him in the eye after? How will he look me in the eye?

I guess I just need something to lean on right now - something from him to help me keep going. I know that this very need is part of the problem, but I don't know what to do about it. Yes yes. I know you will all say to detach. But, I have to admit, that detaching just hasn't clicked with me yet. I don't know how to love him and not let him hurt me with his actions at the same time. It's almost 3 mos since d-day, and I am still in nearly constant agony. I am so tired and so sad and feel so rejected and like such a failure at marriage. Yes, I do have okay days and some good moments, and I suppose I need to remember that I won't always feel like I feel right now - but it sure is hard to come up with a game plan when the chips are down like this. He is scheduled to leave for Germany two weeks from Thurs. The good news is that he is going to IC on 3/30 for the first time. I am tryig so hard not to get my hopes up. It could be weeks or months before that yields even the smallest change...
enough for now
Erin