I can't tell you both how much I appreciate your input and encouragement. But, there is a little part of me that wants to know: Does this ever work? Yes, I have read some of the success stories posted here, but is it like .5% of DB'ers in this situation (non-contrite cheating spouse) that ever revive their marriages? Although I am still in shock and still just barely functioning (I can't eat of sleep to save my life these days. Not at all like me) I'll do anything to save this marriage, but not if my chances of reconciliation are the same as if I gave him an ultimatum and he moved out (which he would - I know it would push him right to her.) Any insight on the question of success? Now, as a second issue, I am in big hot water with H now. Monday morning after catching him the night before, out of my mind with grief, and still believing that I could cope if he told me everything (I knwo that that isn't true) I asked him where the nameless woman lived. He said the midwest, but when I found a number on his phone labeled only "F" I called it saying this is H's wife, who are you? She was flummoxed, I supposed becuase I'd caught her. How foolish. It was a co-worker of his, who's number he had to call and give condolences after her father died. I made an quick excuse and apology and hung up. I did not make any accusations, but I suppose my intent in calling was clear. Well, I didn't tell H becuase I was scared he wouldn't go to counseling with me. HE called yesterday saying "F" had just come to his office to ask about the call. HE played dumb and apologized, and then called me with a fury in his voice I have never known. He actually thinks that my betrayal of trust is the same as his!! Of course, I know what I did was wrong, and I apologized, but he can't hear me. Indeed, he is an alien. It's worth mentioning that his job would be in danger if his bosses found out such is the organization he works for. I had promised not to take that route, but he thinks my errant call was the same thing as calling his bosses. Now, of course, I can't point out that he is the only one who can stamp out any possible rumor by leaving the OW and renewing his vows to me - he wouldn't be able to hear that either. Anyway, the point of bringing up this incident is that until now he was at least a bit real in the evenings- would come home and have dinner in a reasonably normal way, but now he is scowling and short with me every moment. Last night I again apologized and asked if he wasnted to do a "feeelings inventory" (from our MC) to tell me how he was feeling, he said I didn't want to know with the implied meaning that he is leaving and I should give up hope altogether. I tried not to respond at all, and said "you are important to me and to our son" and went to bed. So how do I conduct the evening now? Try to be cheerful like Suzy Creamcheese and ignore his attitude - I sense he would resent my faking it - or just treat him like a roommate to take some of the emotional pressure off - i.e. no pretending like its all right, just joint care of the child and then seperate evenings after S2 is in bed? When I read DB and MR I often feel like I have to go straight to last resort becuase I've got so little to work with - but is that advisable? Anyway - sorry for such a sordid, and perhaps negative post, but I still so new at this and unsure if I have the strength to endure what is ahead of me. Thanks everyone for any input.