new, blue and searching for a clue

[haphazard]

And, I see, as I just said in response to Stigmata's post, that, to a large extent, I'm able to get some portion of the attention, love and affirmation that I want from S14.


I am worried by this Landica. By all means have a happy, fun relationship with your S but PLEASE at all costs do not DEPEND on him for love and affection in your life.

He is too young and even if he weren't then he is still your son and you are his mother. It is a power relationship and that power can be abused. I'm sure he is loving the fact that he has such a close R with his mother and is not a surly teen (as are you), but teens get surly for a reason - it is to break away from their parents and assert their independence. With parents who are in a healthy R there is usually quite a bit of head to head between father and son because S wants to topple F from his throne. S has already done this without a struggle.

I know of what I speak. My brother had a much too close R with my mum. He seemed unaffected at first but gradually his life fell apart. You see he had already been crowned king at an early age, he had nothing to strive for so he didn't.

I am not saying this is your S and you Landica. A couple of sentences on a BB cannot possibly sum up your relationship, I am just saying beware.

take care

Fran

[landica]

Fran: I completely agree with you about S14. His father, due to his many problems (alcoholism, infidelity) was not really *there* for much of S14's life. Even now, X isn't really reliable in terms of following through on his commitments to S14 (not fulfilling promises to do things with him, not picking him up on time) In fact, S14 said to me just the other day, "I love Dad, but he's lost his chance with me."

But I am very aware of the dangers of having *too* close a relationship with S14. After all, look what happened to Oedipus and Jocasta.

And S14 does have a normal teenage life -- lots of time spent hanging out with or im-ing friends or playing video games. He's also very independent. For example, last weekend he decided that he wanted to visit one of his friends who's away at boarding school and, after, getting my permission, made all the arrangements to get there and organized a bunch of his friends to come along. All I had to do was drop him off and pick him up at the train station.

And S14 takes his schoolwork very seriously and spends a lot of time doing the vast quantities of homework that his school assigns and preparing for the numerous quizzes and tests.

But, still, I do worry that he is *too* attached to me and that I encourage it too much.

And, oddly enough, X encourages it as well. When X sees that I'm down about something, he says to S14, "go give Mom a big hug" or "tell Mom how much we love her and appreciate her." It's as though he uses S14 to express some of the affection for me that X just can't give me.

It's funny though, it's so much the exact opposite of my relationship with my parents at his age. When I was 14, my mother wasn't speaking to me (cause I have moved out to live with my father) and my father, when he wasn't working, was prone to bizzare fits of irrational rage (mostly directed against my stepbrothers). All I wanted to do was to spend as little time and have as little contact with them as possible.

L

[landica]

I've been avoiding you. I'd admit. And a big reason is I see a lot of my x in you in terms of where you are. This is her last summer.

---

I'm so sorry that I remind you of her. And I can understand why you'd rather stay away from the thread. So, I really appreciate your offer to try and help me understand X.

In many ways, I was your H. Not quite the background issues but the sulkiness, yes, depression, frustration with keeping up with x in the financial measurements (which is not your sitch as we've already determined). And I became LD. But, unlike you, she never brought it up. We were actually having some good times but she started detaching from me in her new jet-setting new city, new country, new hotel life surrounded by scads of Ms and Fs either Ded or in midst of D.

---

Well, I hardly have a jet-setting lifestyle. But I certainly understand that being around cheerful people seems a lot more attractive when your spouse is depressed and unresponsive. I find myself spending more and more time at work. I have to keep reminding myself that, since I'm not in the private sector, I'm not generating billable hours, and no-one is going to give me anything extra for putting in 12-hour days.

I can only assume my x is commiserating with newly D older guy with money, among others and was not so dismissive.

---

Ouch. That has to hurt. But, you know, I wouldn't necessarily assume that she's happier (not that that's much comfort to you). I think most divorced people, after the "glow" of the divorce has worn off, begin to remember the good things about their x, and miss them. Even my mother and father, who still hate each other with a passion and can't be in the same room together without causing a scene (even though they divorced in 1969) occasionally say things like "Gee, I wish I'd worked harder on my 1st marriage."

at some point I'll try to give you some perspective from H's side . .. . When I get more info about him I can give you more M perspective.. . .And if you're wondering about H's behavior just give a shout, esquire.

---

If/when you feel up to this, I'd really appreciate it.

L.

[landica]

"Landica, if you think that I love you, you're just fooling yourself. I came back because I felt guilty"
That one, along with all of the other just charming answers you think he would give you (or has given you) about why he is back in the house, makes me wonder why on earth you would actually want to remarry him I'm lost here. When my H moved back home it was only going to be with bowing to the alter of LFL (at least for a little while ) Similar to what we have been telling GEL of late regarding how her H should be acting right now.
Why do you let him get away with that BS!!

Well, you do have a point here. I guess I feel that X does (in his own way -- which, ultimately, may not be enough for me) love me as much as he is capable of loving anyone.

That doesn't answer the question of why I put up with it. But I've been (post-divorce) in other relationships. And in none of them (even with Steve who I looooved madly) did I feel the kind of connection I feel with X.

Maybe it's that I'm subconsciously recreating my own f*cked-up childhood. Maybe I have intimacy issues of my own, and feel more comfortable with someone who doesn't want to get too close.

Maybe it's just that I've known X for so long and am reluctant to trade him in for some, hypothetical "Y"

You know, the whole "devil you know" thing.

I don't know. But, of course, if I did know, I wouldn't be here.

[LustForLife]

Maybe it's that I'm subconsciously recreating my own f*cked-up childhood. Maybe I have intimacy issues of my own, and feel more comfortable with someone who doesn't want to get too close.
That FOO-FOO bird always comes back to cr@p on your head, doesn't it?
But really, I think there is probably great truth in what you stated and it's great that you are able to be so introspective about it all. Way ahead of some other people for sure.
Now, you just need to decide what you want to do with all that history. Keep repeating it or learn from it.

[Stigmata]

I'm so sorry that I remind you of her. And I can understand why you'd rather stay away from the thread. So, I really appreciate your offer to try and help me understand X.

-L. Actually I don't see a lot of comparisons between *you* and x, other than smarts and career diligence at this point from what I know of you. My comments stem from hearing those "love him" but "not in love with him" ruminatings from you--as that was one of those hated cliches I had the pleasure of hearing, along with a number of others. And it was weird because we both are more clever than to go to "not you, it's me" blah blah blah dreck yet somehow they all came out one after another and we just were kind of like....oh, man, I can't believe we're using/hearing these lame phrases. As we all know here.

Aside from that, that's where it ends. You are a giver. And have tried to offer solutions as well as have found yourself in the position of being a doormat--which is where I identify with you this time actually. I would have killed to see this effort from x a few months ago--any effort actually. I wouldn't be here if she had. By that same token, I wouldn't be here if I hadn't allowed myself to become a doormat either.

I ID with a lot of folks around here, sitch-wise. BF, LFL, landica, Karen, Haphazard, Chrome, HD, Cobra and maybe GEL and Corris to an extent among others. Like a composite, taking parts from each and seeing similarities. I think that's why I didn't end up jumping off this board on to another a bit ago; plus I like the mix here, as was already mentioned.

But, back to you. That comment from your son in your response to Fran is troubling. He is resenting his father already. I know I had a difficult time with my feelings in relation to my parents in the 16-18 range, with a few thoughts of running away. Hate to see him stuff it in and blow up in a few years during this range. Lots of boy maturation hormones/mood swings going on, know what I mean?

And your foreboding when S14 leaves I think is warranted. Once he's gone, if nothing changes I don't see the 2 of you lasting very long after the now S18 heads off to college. So it looks like 4 years is your solutions ceiling at this point perhaps.

And that comment from X. Using S14 as a "love buffer" between himself and you. Along with you detaching from your father/stepbrothers and mother spurning you. I think you are hitting on some truths about your need to be in proximity of an emotionally distant-unavailable person.

And I wouldn't worry about being a Jocasta as of yet. Actually, I'm becoming more and more aware of my fixation on a possible OM...with nothing but very weak circumstantial evidence at this point. But in my head I've already accepted this as my worst possible outcome so I'm fine with it and need to drop it. Corri's right.

You may not be a Jocasta but my being paranoid over something over which I have no information or control will put me in danger of being an Cassandra.

At this point, as far as X is concerned, it looks like you're going to have to start taking away his privileges, just as you would with an unruly teen. Maybe start not doing what he tells you to do one request at a time and telling him to do it as he's a big boy now.

Finally, I really understand what you mean by the connection/bond you feel for X. This is my problem as well. I never thought I would have ever had a bond like that with an F. And that's why I'm here too. Although I think I need to further detach lately. If this ends in me removing myself from her life completely I think it will be a great loss between 2 people who had so much in common. But, again, I've accepted this already as a worst case scenario and must focus solely on myself and my future at present.

Cripes. Leaking my junk out on another's thread again. Ug. Having not so good past few days. e-nuff. PMA.

-Stigmata-

[Corri]

L:

My very best advice to you at this point, is to do NOTHING. Let your realizations really sink in. Give yourself some breathing room. The very worst thing you could do right now is make knee-jerk decisions, or run off in the opposite direction.

Doing NOTHING at this point allows the dust to settle. Stop thinking for awhile, stop assessing, and just live. Just observe. Perhaps keep a daily journal and just record thoughts. Your mind, at this point, is rewiring itself. Give it and yourself time. Be nice to yourself. It's OKAY.

You'll know when the dust settles. This doesn't mean you will kick H to the curb. It doesn't mean you won't. My advice to you is that whatever decisions and discussions you have with your H, it is best done with a clear head, and a clear understanding of this acceptance you are now going through. It puts you in an AMAZING position.

Hugs to you sweet lady.

Corri

[Corri]

L:

You doing okay?

Corri