Thanx NY and TMU! Anyone out there wondering about detatchment should read what you 2 have been posting. It was for me a least a very enlightening few minutes reading your post! I see so much of myself in "What happens if you do not detatch"! Then I read about denial, and that is what my perception of what my W is going through in her life.
We need to detatch from a person in denial until we are both able to emmotionally come back to reality.
Tim
my story http://www.divorcebusting.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=1049617&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1
Quote: Do those things mean I am NOT in denial? I am denying the negative feelings that could come from those realizations but is that the same as denial?
To me, denial would not be acknowleding that there was an A, nor your part in the demise of the R, pretending that life was still great and that your WAS was coming home and you were going to live blissfully ever after and ride off into the sunset together.
Denial would also be to me, not working on yourself to improve yourself. Falling under the not realizing your role in the demise of the M. There are people that as I say continously chase their tails. The facts are the fact, sometimes people don't like to accept the truth, they prefer to receive nothing but attaboys instead of facing themselves and working on changing who they are.
I went through denial for a few reasons, one because I couldn't grasp how he could give up everything for nothing. I kept thinking, oh he'll be back. More importantly, I was in denial of what our R really was...I had created almost a fantasy of what I thought it was instead of what it really was, not a healthy R.
I had problems detaching initially because everyone got involved...no matter how far I tried to get from the sitch, I was pulled back into it. Finally I think we (everyone involved) has detached themselves. Funny the person who detached the first was his best friend and not because of our sitch...because he learned who Dave really was and wanted no part of him in his life anymore...
So which came first, the chicken or the egg...did I detach first and then accepted I was in denial? Or vice versa...not quite sure what happened first.
Thanks Lisa. That helps. I don't think I am in denial but I am smart enough to recognize, as Vince suggested in his thread, that I seem to have turned a corner pretty quick here and I am just covering my bases. I want to believe in myself, and it's coming. For the first time in my life, I really feel like I'm NOT in denial. I am finally aware of myself, my role in my own life for better or worse, and how my lack of awareness has affected my W and everyone around me. I cannot, nor do I want to, predict the future. I would LOVE for my W to see the changes in me, once sufficient time goes by to make them more real to her, and agree to work on our R. I would LOVE for her to tell my tomorrow that she's left the OM but I can no longer wait for that to get my happiness. I am still sad as hell sometimes but today, for the first time in a LONG time, I walked out to go to lunch and the sky was a beautiful blue, I heard the birds and the wind in the trees. It was just beautiful. I know it sounds corney, but when I look back at who I think I may have been, at times when I was being myself and not pleasing someone else, I would have noticed those things. I noticed them today. Maybe she'll notice tomorrow...
but detachment will do much of the same things as denial. It will protect you from pain.
So does drinking booze or sleeping. Similarities between things does not equate them as being the same thing, however.
It will help you not face problems because you will not internalize them.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You can be totally detached and still face and work on problems, you just don't permit the problems to impact you to knee jerk yourself. It's about the taking a step back and handling yourself better in the face of things, it's not about ignoring those things.
It lets you avoid negative consequences because you just choose not to react to them.
No, I believe that you can very well see the negatives while detached. Again, one works through the problems while being detached, so the reason you choose not to react constitutes a healthy purpose when detaching, an unhealthy purpose though when in denial, where you won't work on the problem because it's disturbing that the problem exists, which is because one's attached.
I am fully aware of my situation. I know there is an affair. I know our marriage is in deep trouble. I know I need to work on myself. Do those things mean I am NOT in denial? I am denying the negative feelings that could come from those realizations but is that the same as denial?
Denial is stage of the grieving process, so if you're in the grieving process, there will be times denial may manifest. It's not a linear process, so denial may be revisited from time to time. Denial takes several different forms of manifestation. Seeing problems and putting blinders on is one manifestation, for example. Thinking, "How could she do this?" is another manifestation of denial.
So, the question really becomes, how does the knowledge of your circumstances affect you emotionally? That's where detachment comes in.
Quote: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You can be totally detached and still face and work on problems, you just don't permit the problems to impact you to knee jerk yourself. It's about the taking a step back and handling yourself better in the face of things, it's not about ignoring those things.
I think I knew that but I was trying more to play devil's advocate then express my true feelings. My bad again. I agree about the stepping back and handling yourself better. I think thats the part that I am really doing better with.
I am still sad as hell sometimes but today, for the first time in a LONG time, I walked out to go to lunch and the sky was a beautiful blue, I heard the birds and the wind in the trees. It was just beautiful.
Okay, let's just the rules down a bit...there is to be NO bragging about the gorgeous weather in FL...K? You just keep that to yourself!!
All kidding aside, I agree wholeheartedly...I found that once I started detaching, life seemed so much more, pleasant...I smiled at strangers, hell I even talk to them now...I don't worry about things. I used to have to worry about so much but all that is gone...now I just have the true beauty of enjoying all that life has to offer me. I'm finding peace...one day at a time...just be prepared...it will not be all roses...you will have a few downward slopes even if you detach...all of us are guilty of that and I don't care who you are...it's human...triggers will happen, you're only fooling yourself if you don't think they will. But when you detach you can learn to work through this triggers in a more healthier way and take them for just what they are, triggers of the past, some good memories, some bad.
Reading through all of your posts (thank you for the post on detachment NYs) I find that this is where I am and what I too am trying to achieve. The problem is in trying to reattach and find emotional intimacy with my H after I have distanced myself so far while retaining detachment. It is a dance that I don't know the steps to. I feel like a headless chicken trying to samba.
Something to think about for when the WAS returns.
Quote: triggers will happen, you're only fooling yourself if you don't think they will.
Oh, believe me, I KNOW they will. I am not predicting them but it is painfully obvious what they would be in my sitch, among many others; "I'm moving out" "I want a divorce" "I lied, it IS a physical affair" "I love him"
Those are things that are right on the horizon, or not but they are all the next steps in this kind of sitch. I know that from reading all the posts here and common sense. I am not sure how I will handle any of those. Probably not good. Those (and anything else I am not thinking of) will be the TRUE test of my detachment.
as Vince suggested in his thread, that I seem to have turned a corner pretty quick here and I am just covering my bases.
T, wherever you are today is just fine. You're recognizing the path to take, and one crawls before they can walk, and they fall down lot a lot along the way. Thankfully, they're usually tinier at that point and so the fall isn't as painful as from several feet higher, though I don't what the hell that has to do with us. As long as you're making progress, your time journeying upon the road there doesn't matter as much as the journey itself.
I would LOVE for my W to see the changes in me, once sufficient time goes by to make them more real to her, and agree to work on our R.
Her seeing your changes can most definitely happen, and most probably will, as that's totally in your control. The second part, her agreeing, that's in her control of course.
I would LOVE for her to tell my tomorrow that she's left the OM but I can no longer wait for that to get my happiness.
If she told you that tomorrow, I guarantee your thinking that would bring you "happiness" would prove to be an illusion, not real happiness.
It's also good that you're clearing out unrealistic expectations.
[for the first time in a LONG time, I walked out to go to lunch and the sky was a beautiful blue, I heard the birds and the wind in the trees. It was just beautiful.
You're reconnecting with the beauty of the world around you... taking notice of it, appreciating it, you're now starting to live. It is a beautiful, wondrous thing. Our lives in this world are not to be taken for granted. And that connection is very healing too.
Here's an email exchange between me and an old pal artist friend of mine about that:
Robert: "Now is the point in the day where I cant really start another section of the painting and I don't have a good book to read so I just sit. Sometimes I sit for quite some time and don't really think. I just listen to the sounds around me. The train goes by, a dog barks, I hear the clock ticking, the wind or rain, my breathing, my heart beating. It's really quite nice."
Me: "Sounds like an enjoyable time, relaxing, soothing, meditative perhaps. It's amazing how much does go on around us that we don't make ourselves aware of. I like to look at the moon and stars at night and feel a sense of awe and wonder. It's really the old "Stop and smell the roses". We're only around once, and the planet and consciousness is an amazing place to be in and not take for granted.
Get back to work."
OK T, that'll be $125 for the session, please. No extra charge for the quotes.
