Supreme Overlord of the Universe

[chromosphere]

"The simple explanation for my response is that while I was at work I was distracted from the reality of my marriage. Driving home I would often have to fight tears, because although I could distract myself while at work, now I was going to have to face the then unhappiness that was our relationship.
That yawning pit of loneliness within me would rear up larger and larger the closer I got to home along with the ingrained dread that it was never going to change."

Wow! Did you jump inside my head and pull that out?

"You're dealing with the fear that you're going to do something to make it worse. You have a flicker of hope on occasion that it's going to be different this time. Your heart is exposed and beating rapidly behind your protective shield longing to make a connection with your spouse. There are rushes of anger when you think this doesn't have to be so hard and waves of despondency that it is so hopeless."

Ummm, can I just give one big ditto to the statements here or do I have to ditto each instance.

[Greeneyedlass]

Karen,

Gotchya! I kind of thought that might have been what you meant, just wasn't sure.

GEL

[Cobra]

Chromo,

I think the joint sessions you two are having is a good start. You attend self esteem counseling. Does she see anyone on her own? If she has her own fears and vulnerabilities, disclosing them in front of you may be too scary. She may do better one-on-one with a counselor, possibly a female counselor.

My statement about your gift giving was meant to warn you not to get too disappointed if she does not/cannot respond. I think most women want strong, confident men, the unison of opinion from the women on this board supports that, but I am still not certain all women can really accept that confidence, due to their unknown FOO. Since you may not receive the support from your wife, I would not assume it is intentional. She may need more time to work through her issues to realize how and why she is not/can not give you what you need. Just because she knows “everything” does not mean she is capable of doing anything with that information. In many ways, this is not her fault, though it is her problem.

[Chrissy]

It has always been my philosophy as a teacher that if I can't explain something to ANYBODY, then I don't truly understand it.

Well that is not the case here. I only have the basic high school knowledge of science. Its not that you could not teach me it is how much you would have to teach me to get me to a level of understanding to relate to the subjects of which you are all speaking.

In other words you are doing nothing wrong. I just do not have the basic knowledge of theroys to follow along such advance convo!

I do agree with my coach that defeating gloom is a case of "not feeding the monster." If you sit there and dwell on the gloom, it just gets worse and worse.

I agree with that also that is why I suggested the part of changing your preception/expectation of what is waitting for you at home.

I myself spent years dreeding going home and what was there. The fights the anger so forth. It got to a point where I avoided going home any earlier then I had to.
I started working 12 hour days and would make pit stops so my almost hour drive home would extend to at least two.
I felt almost panicy about walking in the door.
As Mrs Nop said work was a excape from the misery of my marriage. I had to learn to start focusing on the good things that were inside that door way to change this feeling of pure dread at the sight of my house. Some of the simple things I suggested like changing into more comfortable cloths or shoes or sitting on a comfy bed with my kids where exactly the same things I used to get to the point where my house was not a looming pit of darkness but a bright beacon of joy. (not that it still does not look like a dark hole sometimes thats sucking me in at times, But I no longer just want to run from it upon sight)

Right. That is what I meant by distracting myself. I am not pushing the gloom to some inner part of myself where it will bite me later, I am just actively choosing not to dwell on it.

Ahh well thats what I was meaning.


I will say though I will change tactics if necessary. 3 month blocks may be a good start though, I'll think about it.

This is what I was referring to. The changing tatics. Sort of like when BF told you to do one week of no iniating physical contact with your wife. To see if it made a difference in your wifes behavior.

I have been choosing to respond in a certian way or not respond all to my H's behavior. To try to physically touch him say a hug every day after dinner or what ever to see if it helps our sitch. I stick to a pattern for 3 months then evaluate to see if anything has improved from these actions. If not I toss them out the window and try another approach. I am just not sure if three months is to long or long enough to really see a change. And thought maybe your C had helped you establish valid timelines that you could share

I think that is one of the problems with R books. They tend to adopt a "you should respond this way" approach, which may work for some people, but not all.

Self help books in general are something I am rapidly losing faith in. You read four chapters of what the purpose of the book is. Another four on what it will teach you then four about what you should have learned. I seemed to find they spend more time telling you what they are gonna say later then actually saying much of anything.
Lets talk about what I am gonna talk about is not much of a help if you never really talk about it in my book.
Sorta like the last two C I went to who just wanted to run in circles instead of giving one suggestion as to how to change anything.

Masters of the Universe/He-man thing very well.

Omg I actually forgot about that show! God I am getting old.

[NOPkins]

Hi, chromo.

Here is something for you to consider doing.

Tonight, while your wife is brushing her teeth, make it a point to brush yours at the same time. As soon as she is done (make sure you finish first), grab her up in your arms (be powerful but gentle), look her straight in the eyes (no sheepishness) and TELL her "Kiss me.". If she responds with a peck, then you say "more". If she she tells you "no" or refuses, then let go of her, smile and say "You have no idea what you are missing", then turn and walk off. Make sure that you show no sign of hurt feelings for the rest of the evening. Don't engage her in an argumentative way regarding the rejection, even if she attempts to pick a fight. Do NOT acquiesce to any excuse she may offer as to why she didn't want to kiss you. Don't let her off the hook. You maintain your position that a wife should be reasonably willing to kiss her husband. Period. Don't budge from your position.

One other thing. Since you are tall, and you are obviously kowtowing to your wife, I am assuming that you are doing that physically as well. Make sure that you always hold your head up, stand tall, and don't slump in order to make yourself appear shorter, or less intimidating. That is very common behavior for tall people.

All the best,
-NOPkins-

[chromosphere]

"One of the things my H did when I first started staying at home was to install the following rule: When he arrives home, he comes to me first. He gives me a hug and a kiss"

I do something along those lines already, but I'll have to admit that I probably come across very tentative. I'll strap on my brass-ones tonight and come across very manly and see how it works out.

"baby just comes up and flat out pushes us apart, then raises her arms as if to say, Yo here I am..which wanna you lucky dogs is going to pick me up?"

If you said nothing else, that would prove you have kids. The smaller of the twins will actually start crying a bit if I hug momma too long (in her opinion).

"If this magnificent Hero Guy goes to ME first, I must be pretty special."

You know, the whole "a good R with your S sets the tone for your kids" is obviously true, but your statement really crystallizes it for me. My kids (at this age) do really look up to me (well, so does everyone else) so if I treat momma as a very special person, and I wouldn't have to fake it, it can't help build respect for her in them as a collateral effect. Wow! Light bulb for sure.

"Anyway, he's done that every night for the past 6 years and it really helps. Go get em tiger."

Actually I like to think of myself more of a Lion, but thanks anyway. I think combining your suggestion with NOPkins (see later post) are really great. Heartfelt thanks! See, this is what we all need. Concrete plans of action. I have always hated sermons in church that go on an on about "being a child of God", "love Jesus", "Don't give into the Devil." I've always like the "there is an old lady out there who can't make it to church anymore, why don't you videotape the service, take it to her house (bring your VCR if she doesn't have one) and watch it with her." Action!!!

[chromosphere]

"My bf used to always greet the dog first before me, getting down on the floor and hugging and kissing him."

So he kissed the dog first then you? You ever hand him a wet wipe and a breath mint?

[chromosphere]

"Sounds childish probably but that really hurt my feelings."

Doesn't sound childish at all. I'll have to admit here that the W and I don't go to sleep at the same time most of the time. It is caused primarily by the fact that she nurses right before going to bed, so I usually do some housework, play around on the computer, or get grading done while she is doing that, and often she finishes and goes to sleep while I am still at it (I can get involved in stuff and go one-track mind sometimes). I really need to stop doing that, looking at nursing as a golden opportunity to get some work done, and instead make it a bonding time of sorts. Of course, the W usually falls asleep while nursing, but we could still build EC if I sat there holding her hand while she slept.

Sorry about what happened GEL. I would probably react the same way as you did. But I think that is one of those "gloom" responses that we just have to distract ourselves away from.

[chromosphere]

"As Chromo would say, grrrrrr."

He he, I have my own saying here on SSM.

[chromosphere]

"she see anyone on her own? If she has her own fears and vulnerabilities, disclosing them in front of you may be too scary. She may do better one-on-one with a counselor, possibly a female counselor."

I have considered suggesting that she go see our MC alone sometimes (the MC is the first person I began seeing when my depression got really bad). Thoughts?

"Since you may not receive the support from your wife, I would not assume it is intentional."

I do know that intuitively, but thanks for the verbal warning. Besides, it defeats the purpose of a gift if you only give it expecting something in return.

"Just because she knows “everything” does not mean she is capable of doing anything with that information."

A good point. I'm hoping that when the time is right, the W and I can share some books or online reading or whatever and create a more concrete plan of action to build/maintain our EC. She is just still way too tired with the newborn to really focus much. Although I do have good news. The newborn slept through the night last night!!!! Woo Hoo!!!! Sleep may be returning soon. And when you are rested, you are more physically able to ... well, you know.