Sorry this is stressful for you Jill. I don't intend it to be that way.
Quote: Imagine if the only happiness you found had to be bought.
She is happy with her pets and now most family members. Two or three years ago she did not want much to do with several family members.
Quote: Set a time limit for yourself regarding how much longer you're willing to stay in the R
I have set some goals for myself. Get rid of the things I don't use much.
BB says she loves me but is frustrated with the amount of things in the house. She keeps buying but has less trouble than me just trashing good things, while I am trying to maxamize the potential usage of what I get rid of by giving most to recycling centers and donation stores.
Quote: how much longer you're willing to stay in the R with no change and then leave if there are no changes
No changes?? That is not a difficult question. The tough question will be, I make changes. Will BB's changes be enough to keep the R, from either partner POV, worth while.
If everything would stay the same as today and I had my part of the R in order, my part of the house junk free, my business wrapped up, I might see you at the next Michigan DB meeting. I can drink "A" beer, eat, talk, and bowl too. I think you group did that one time.
Jill, you asked if I was afraid to be alone=No. Afraid to date=no, Concerned that I might not find someone compatable=a big yes. I kind of qualify for the TV program "What Not to Wear", another TV program "Clean Sweep" and maybe one of the other "Social Skils Improvement" programs. Nothing drastically wrong with me. Not a redneck, but not Mr Refined either. Just a nice working guy basically.
I read your thread and see that you like guys you date but there is not much happening in terms of "he is the one." I see this quite often in posts. But that is getting ahead of the game I am in right now. That game is called fix what you can, don't expect too much to happen very fast, do my part as best as I can.
Am I happy with the resultas so far=no. Do I see some improvement in my handeling of the situation=yes. Do I still need to improve = yes and yes. Does BB need to change=yes. Has BB made some changes=yes. Are they enough=no, not for me.
BB's TV viewing habits have to be worked on next. She is queen of the remote. She likes sit-coms, I like something reality based. Time to change channels or turn the TV off. BB is not much for going out except to eat or shop. That is another item on my near term change list.
I have to replace a strip of wallpaper. Bye for now.
I hooked up my old HP 4 ML laser printer to my laptop and it works like a champ. If you'll recall, when we first discussed this months ago I was obsessing on the fact that I had used this with my Mac and I wasn't sure how to connect it to the PC. Well, today I popped off that cover where the connectors are and lo and behold there was the parallel cable connector. I went to Wal-Mart and bought the cable, plugged it in and viola! it works great! My PC recognized it immediately, like an old friend, although I don't think they'd ever been formally introduced. I can't believe the toner is still there-- I haven't used this printer in at least six years-- maybe more.
P.S The trip to Wal-Mart was not a total success. The cable was only $12.00, but I bought three pairs of shoes and in all spent as much as I would have on a new printer! Oh well, there's a bit of BB in me, too--
Thanks for your encouragement. If we hadn't had that convo way back when, it probably would never have occurred to me to use this old (and very good) printer.
Good job on the printer. I thought you wanted a color printer to replace bf's DJ-712? I wondered what happened to the LJ-4L but was hesitant to ask. I just assumed you didn't like it, I guess. Sometimes I encourage people to hang on to things and sense they have some aversion to older things and are afraid the old things having some expiration date so I don't push to hard about the old equipment they have.
The LJ-4L is a good printer. Many of the ink jets, especially Epson’s, don't work correctly if they sit for 6 months.
After about a year of just sitting and the print drum in the toner cartridge not turning, sometimes the drum gets to print a line on the paper where the drum and PCR (electronic image eraser) touch each other. A new toner cartridge or just a drum replacement at a cartridge rebuilder will make everything like new again. You should get 3,200/3,500 from a LJ-4L toner cartridge.
Quote: but I bought three pairs of shoes and in all spent as much as I would have on a new printer! Oh well, there's a bit of BB in me, too.
I expect people to have things they want and don't absolutely have to have. I think some of what you did is called normal. Call me when this happens a couple times a week or you get deliveries from some of your favorite vendors 3 or more times a week, BTDT. I can give you my opinions then, but maybe you already know what it is.
Try not to get to the point of having a [brand name] collection, like a pair to go to the mail box, a pair to walk in the front yard, a pair to wear to walk in the back yard, a pair to walk on a path in the field, a pair to wear when the temp is below 60, a pair to wear when the temp is between 60 and 80, another pair to wear when the temp is over 80. I am over stating the example, but I hope you get my point.
I have been told to lighten up by more than a couple of people but difficult to change my mental thoughts of what is practical after so many years having to decide if item “A” is more important than being concerned about how to pay for the other things in life.
The donation stores have so much donated to them I am going to have to wait 3 weeks before they can take some of the furniture BB replaced so I put it on a “free ad” on the Internet.
Lou wrote: ----------------------------------------- I was wondering how you would have felt or what you would imagine if your LM was frequency was only every two weeks. How would that NOP act, feel today? What would you keep doing, what would have benn an "I tried it and it did not work so i quit." -----------------------------------------
We went through a period when the frequency was not at a 'NOP sustainable' level. I was still cranky although less so than before we started to recover our relationship, but the blowups were fairly frequent. It is documented in postings here, although I don't have a good search term for you.
Before we started resolving issues in our relationship. I would have answered you with "I would have walked". As we started addressing issues in our marriage, that attitude and the decision I had made and was prepared to see through, was altered.
My steadfast refusal to continue on as before, and MrsNOP's decision to address our marital issues with me, altered both of us, and the course of our marriage. We both ate a lot crap, and a lot of crow, but we gained our marriage back.
I don't know if I have answered your question, but I can tell you that your marriage, even if it fails, is worth fighting for. If nothing else, you will be a better person for the effort. You will also be less likely to repeat the same mistakes with a new partner.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
Quote: Try not to get to the point of having a [brand name] collection, like a pair to go to the mail box, a pair to walk in the front yard, a pair to wear to walk in the back yard, a pair to walk on a path in the field, a pair to wear when the temp is below 60, a pair to wear when the temp is between 60 and 80, another pair to wear when the temp is over 80. I am over stating the example, but I hope you get my point.
Hi Lou, The above cracked me up!!! I just got back from FL with 3 new pairs of shoes too!!! I'm going to wear one pair when I wear my white capris (but only if I'm wearing a blue shirt), another pair will go with pretty much everything cuz they're flesh colored and the third pair will have to go with something green, which I don't have so will have to buy something. The bad thing is, they're all sandals, so I can't even wear any of them until next summer!!! Good thing.....they were all on sale!!!!
When the going gets tough the tough go shopping. BB's just a little tougher than most of us.
Quote: MrsNOP's decision to address our marital issues with me, altered both of us, and the course of our marriage. We both ate a lot crap, and a lot of crow, but we gained our marriage back
I am working on addressing issues fairly but don't think we are there. We both say some similar things but some how they sound like one sided or accusatory.
Quote: I can tell you that your marriage, even if it fails, is worth fighting for. If nothing else, you will be a better person for the effort.
I agree. I need to make some changes in me, practice supportive behaviors towards BB but not be a push over. Improve my skills when to say yes and when to say no with out being controlling.
Quote: You will also be less likely to repeat the same mistakes with a new partner.
The process helps with the current partner too but it is so draining sometimes. And yes, I don’t want to do this again with so much invested/dreamed for/ hoped for. I also don't want anyone I live with to have to go through what BB is feeling now. Not fun for either of us.
Quote: I don't know if I have answered your question,
The answer I read into your answer is you would have eventually walked if both of you had not started to make some progress in some areas of the M.
Mrs. NOP said she felt she was not being heard but when it happened, she seemed to drop her resentments / flip a switch ( chose your word Mrs. NOP) and was willing to go the faster path towards making the M work more smoothly.
For me, I see some progress but not enough. I see some progress but new problems come up. I see an onion but don't know how many layers it has and how many layers are good, know many layers are repairable, or how many bad layers are not salvageable.
Improve my skills when to say yes and when to say no with out being controlling.
This struck me since I can’t recall reading anything in your posts that I would remotely call actively controlling. Are you talking about passive controls, such as not clearing out your stuff? What are you referring to?
Quote: I'm going to wear one pair when I wear my white capris (but only if I'm wearing a blue shirt),
I guess my brain must be wired to the stone ages. I believe in color matching coordenation but I don't let colors rule my life.
I have one pair of shoes with yellow and blue paint on them from when I painted the outside of the house. They have white and lilac paint on them from when I painted inside. I scraped off the wallpaper bits after I finished the bathrooms. What do I wear with these shoes Jill?
I must be doing something wrong because I imagine you look so much better than I do. I guess I should look at the men's clothing sites on the Internet for clues. Don't ya think?
My shoe rules. Nike (any comfortable, safe footwear) shoes for all workers who have to stand or walk most of the day. High heels for date/classy type outtings, not for working in an office or bank.
BB's "a pair for" were Birkenstock's so they mostly only get worn in the summer.
Keep up the retail therapy Jill, at least you get something concrete for your money. Could I be a 4 times a year handyman? I could haul all of your old stuff to the donation store. I have experience in that area. On second thought I have enough to get rid of here.
Thanks for posting miss almost retired but counting and counting. A little teasing is good for the soul.
Quote: I can’t recall reading anything in your posts that I would remotely call actively controlling
Well BB thinks of me as her dad sometimes and tells me I don't allow her to buy the things she wants, when she wants them, with her money.
We have different wants and ways to look at life. According to the co-dependency books, she should be allowed to have most of the things she wants and I should go along with it and I should do my own thing.
Maybe we were too emeshed but this separate, my way, your way model is not working for me as well as it does for some people.
Quote: I guess my brain must be wired to the stone ages.
Well... maybe the Bronze Age or the Iron Age...
Just kidding, Lou. BB goes overboard, definitely. That she should be paired with someone who is so retail-istically conservative is a great irony (and something Jung would love). BB is showing you your shadow-- a part of yourself that you are positive is not there. But she's showing you symbolically-- in code. Do you have your Captain Midnight Decoder Ring?
Maybe somewhere inside you is a Little Lou who wanted things but wasn't allowed to have them, didn't have the money, parents wouldn't buy them... so he taught himself not to want.
My late husband was like this. When I met him, I had to show him how to want stuff... to teach him that it was okay to want.... His mom used to criticize him by saying, "You've got the willies and the wants," like it was a bad thing. And his first wife carried on the tradition. She handled the finances and gave him $10 cash allowance each week for 25+ years. She was a SAHM and never worked outside the home (although she had graduated from college in three years magna cum laude with a double major in math and chemistry ).
It was so much fun for me when we first got together for me to buy him nice things... a leather briefcase, nice slippers, etc. One day we received a check for several thousand dollars in the mail unexpectedly (bequest from a great aunt) and I insisted he fulfill one of the wants he had talked about for years: we built a pottery shop and he took pottery lessons. He became quite a good potter during the last four or five years of his life. But I digress (as usual).
I'll bet all the while Grown Up Lou is annoyed and irritated by BB's irresponsible "getting" and "buying" and denying herself nothing... Little Lou is secretly delighted and envious and wishes so much that he or someone could be so generous to himself.
After my husband died when I reflected on how I showered him with whatever he wanted (not just stuff, but I was committed to making his life wonderful), I realized that while I loved doing these things for him, what I also wanted was for someone to be that committed to making MY life wonderful! He loved me, but he did not express his love in that way. My bf IS and Acts of Service guy... but lacks the sexual interest... and the wheel goes round and round...
I think you group did that one time.
Oh well, there's a bit of BB in me, too-- 
I scraped off the wallpaper bits after I finished the bathrooms. What do I wear with these shoes Jill? 
I have experience in that area. On second thought I have enough to get rid of here. 
