Stig,

You meant Jeremiah, I meant Alexander. it happens. we are tired and all emotionally juiced up. No fair throwing scripture at me, Ill sit up and pay attention to that everytime.

Gosh long reply or short....<jeopardy music plays>

Thanks for the calming words. Necesito mucho.
and
Chromo, you too

the Dune references gave me a smile. after reading HD thread my thought was What a bunch of geeks we have running around here.

This will respond to a couple people. I have said it over and over. Then mans mental state controls the R... to a very very large extent. My Adam should not have blinked and walked away from her. Adam didnt have to partake, he was not fooled. He chose to. Its over though, not beating myself up over it anymore. wow does that feel good.

as for ruining my well-being, it was at a all time high in many ways because of and during our M. Being M was good for me, very much so I believe. she hasnt ruined it, it just ceases to have any value or import to me when single. With exception of rebreather incident, all my other apparently self destructive behavior was pre M. I will get alot of protests to the contrary here for this statement, but I dont consider myself egotistical. Rash, Reckless, Overconfidant, and Brash. Only where it concerns my safety, and by default hers, yes. (I have a very healthy amount of Life Insurance though. she would have been a lottery winner ) Still it's a lack of well being. The scripture treat your spouse as yourself does not apply to me. LOL, comeon I have to laugh so I dont go crazy.


GEL

I have a question. Why didnt your friend tell her H that she was falling for the OM? Why did she let herself get thrown together alone with OM? FWIW, and not an excuse, but I never put them together alone. It unavoidably happened twice.

Included him in very nearly everything (no not that sheesh) yes.

Primarily the one where OM was living under your roof.
I may be waaaaaay off base, just throwing in my 2-cents....or really my observations

Dont you dare go back-pedaling on me. I've earned a much harsher verbal beating then I have gotten around here.

You are absolutely correct. I set her up to fail letting him live with us.

LIL
Does this have anything to do with your attraction to your assistant? If you can be allowed to believe that your W acted out of some innocent miscalculation, does that make you "innocent" too and diminish your responsibility for the emotional involvement with your assitant?

NOOO. I claim zero holdings in the innocence department. I fell for my assistant despite my ethics and having a lot of knowledge about The Alchemy of Love and Lust In my defense I did control my actions, even if I lost control of my thoughts for a while.
I spent much of my education thinking outside the box to figure out ways to make this work for me, before this book was even out.

Here is where you ask, why didnt I share this stuff with my x? ummmmm. I dont normally talk ABOUT attraction with women. Much more effective to just be.

What would it mean to you if you gave up the idea that "you ruined her"? I'm curious what the payoff is in that belief? Does it preserve a shred of her innocence if a combo of you and OM did it to her instead of accepting that she was a Big Girl and made this choice of her own free will.

I did, I know it, I allowed it, I enabled OM to do it also. Initially. Cobra may know of what I speak but in many ways she was 15 Relationally speaking. Also I completely agree innocence is neither healthy nor confidance inspiring at all in a M.

She is a Big Girl after the fact, absolutely the second time around and not acting a victim, which she had stopped and reversed 2 weeks ago was part of what was necessary for me to contemplate anything with her.

She never did the whole will we or wont we, had no ring on her finger when she finally 'did' the second time. The first time she went there partly according to her, then ran away from it. The PhysicalAct always kills it for her, though she of course does still have feelings for him.

I hurt her, during reconcil, she assumed I couldnt/wouldnt ever forgive her, so she went looking for love and comfort where she knew it could be found. Is that so strange? No, but no excuse either as she obviously hadnt really made up her mind. I was emotionally unable/unwilling to fix it, play the game, however you want to word it and actually did things that prompted her to run further, rather then show her otherwise.

As my mom says, we are two idiots, too emotionally tied with each other to stop hurting each other. Mistake after mistake. Not very manly.

Karen,
I own mine. I am not owning hers anymore, though I was a lot for awhile. I feel very peaceful at the moment.