Lockout King

[LustForLife]

Morning Globule
Sorry you had such a bad weekend
Mine was good and bad.
I need to get ready to drive H to the airport now. He's going to Houston for 4 days for work. Sad part it, I kind of like having the time alone. Don't really miss him when he's gone.
I'll write more in a bit. Maybe you will be around, if you're not busy groping your W. (That story sucked).

Oh well, a depressing rainy Sunday morning to fit my mood.

[snookchaser]

"Grrrr!"

I see that the regularly scheduled meeting of the Grrr Club for Hopeless Romantics is STILL in session. Being a card carring member I thought I'd add my take on this. Being my first stab at something other than a one line interjection, bear with me.

"So I came up behind her, grabbed her, started rubbing on her legs and stomach, and even picked her up a bit"

Given your current situation, this approach (the direct approach) was probably too much ( way too physical). I understand your feeling for wanting to do that, really I do (BTDT). However a more gentle (i.e. loving, romantic) approach might have been to simply stop for a moment and watch her in the mirror. When she noticed your presence, a hand on the shoulder and a kiss on the neck and the simple words "I love you, Beautiful" might have been a more effective way of conveying what you were feeling at that moment. Understand that the grabby, feely stuff can feel like too much "pressure" to her. Especially if it is the way that you usually communicate these feeling to her. So, I have to agree with Chrissy here.

"Your wifes response was simular to mine when my H does these king of things. My H always feel it is based on I don't want him to touch me. But really it is how he touches me."

The important word there was "HOW he touches me". I think that we as guys tend to overlook this important message. I too have had to unlearn this habit. That although this is may be exactly how we feel on the inside (Man, She looks so HOT, I just wanna grab her), its not the kind of message that she may be ready to receive (save it for latter). Hence my script above and Chrissy's

"Had you have walked up behind your wife and rubbed her upper back or upper arms first while telling her how hot you thought she was you may not have gotten the same response from her."

My point exactly. And.

"When my H and I have had no contact and he immediately makes contact in a sexual nature. It is a automatic turn off for me. It is not loving in nature it is pure he wants sex in my mind. I feel used."

See, there's that "pressure again" and a response/feeling by her that I'm sure you really had no intention of conveying. Your touches and hands are dangerously close to erogeoness zones. You've got to build up to this point and your simply just not there yet. My point here is that I understand your approach but it was not not the best of timing. If you are in fact looking for a "180", your answer should be quite clear. You wife has already shared this clue with you.

"She said, "well you do it all the time so ..." I got a little more miffed and responded "well I won't do it anymore then." She responded, "yes you will" and kept on putting on makeup."

Your first 180. I think that she's called your bluff, so now's the time to step up to the plate hold back on the grabby stuff (at least for now). You'll earn a few integrity points along the way. I think that the 180's that you come up with should be internalized and not openly shared with her. Like Michelle say's, "Just do it". But not in the context that she usually referrs. Just take notes and see what happens.

Looks like my 2 pennies worth should be adjusted for inflation.

[chromosphere]

"Sorry you had such a bad weekend"
Started about 2:30 on Friday and just got worse as time went on. Man I SOOO tried to be happy and cheerful when I went home. I guess I shouldn't expect 180s to be easy or to happen right away. I just hope I'm not digging a bigger hole for myself each day. I guess to my wife it is just more of the same though.

"Don't really miss him when he's gone."
I'm about half and half with the wife. I definitely hate all the feelings of rejection I have when she is home, but I feel really lonely for her when she is gone. She is almost never gone from home though.

"if you're not busy groping your W."
NOPE! No more of that!

[LustForLife]

I definitely hate all the feelings of rejection I have when she is home, but I feel really lonely for her when she is gone I used to be this way too. Was kind of forced out of that way of thinking when he left, obviously, but it still sticks with me. I'm much more confident, less lonely, when he is away now. That part is good. But, I sometimes feel too detached, you know what I mean? It's hard to find a happy medium between too enmeshed and too detached. That's where I am struggling now. That fact of the matter is, I feel like would rather open up to you than have to deal with all of these feelings with my H. What is wrong with this picture? Sincerely, thanks for being there..here..wherever

I'm going to respond to your other posts now.

[LustForLife]

perhaps I overstated how comfortable we really were with our decision to not make it physical. There were several times when I know in my mind I was inches away from giving in. She admitted on several occasions that she felt the same way. I'd like to think that we didn't give in because we were both "strong" (in that regard anyway), but it may have been just dumb luck that we both weren't on the edge at the same time.
I doubt it was dumb luck. It was interesting that you said you both weren't on the "edge" at the same time. I think that makes sense. When one person let their guard down the other one put it up. That's what kept it safe, comfortable. You both wanted to express those feelings but knew that it was going to lead somewhere even more dangerous so you both consciously and subconsciously reacted to each other in ways that prevented it.
I guess I've been eating angel food my whole life That was a good one.
Still legally separated? Yep. Another Mexican Standoff, lol. Neither one of us have brought it up. I think we are both assuming we will wait a little longer to make sure everything is going fairly well. It's still all so fresh (the reconcilation). Honestly, I don't want to deal with it right now. It makes it so "official." For some reason I like the fact that the clock is still ticking so to speak, towards the OPTION of divorce. Crazy isn't it? If we take the paperwork off the record (at the courts) that's that. In NY, you need to be legally separated 1 year before you can get divorced (unless you have grounds such as adultery, abuse, etc). I guess I'm not as invested/committed to the M as I thought. Although he's being no different. All of our finances and everything are still separate. It's hard enough dealing with all the emotions right now. The paperwork is just not a priority. So far things have worked out ok so we'll see what happens. Guess I better address it sooner or later. Choosing later for now.

[LustForLife]

Man I SOOO tried to be happy and cheerful when I went home. I guess I shouldn't expect 180s to be easy or to happen right away. Forgot to comment on this. I know that feeling of coming home in a good mood and it turns to sh*t in about 5 minutes. It sucks! As for the 180's, I'm not really one to give advice here. You have received some great advice already on this topic, especially related to the "groping incident". Lay low for a while. Make her wonder. Being predictable is never the right answer. How are things going today? Any better?

[chromosphere]

"Given your current situation, this approach (the direct approach) was probably too much ( way too physical). I understand your feeling for wanting to do that, really I do (BTDT)."
Agreed.

"stop for a moment and watch her in the mirror. When she noticed your presence, a hand on the shoulder and a kiss on the neck and the simple words "I love you, Beautiful" might have been a more effective way of conveying what you were feeling at that moment."
I do that at different times. For some reason, despite the fact that I knew it was stupid, I did the other more physical thing anyway. Perhaps it was because I had backed off the more loving/romantic stuff because it seems like I am doing that too much, i.e. smothering her.

"Especially if it is the way that you usually communicate these feeling to her"
Not usually I don't. As a matter of fact, her comment that I "do it all the time" was not true. Maybe she also sees the other things I do (what you called the more loving/romantic gestures) as also being grabby. If that is the case, I have NO IDEA what in the hell I am supposed to do other than completely back off.

"its not the kind of message that she may be ready to receive (save it for later)"
I agree with that. The problem is, THERE IS NO LATER!!!! Right now there is just this open ended "we are not going to have sex" situation going on. Part of my problem is I am horrible at bottling up my feelings. And my feelings are mostly that I want EC, affection, and sex (in that order).

"step up to the plate hold back on the grabby stuff (at least for now)."
OK, will do. No more grabbing until I get the OK from her.

On a side note, I did take the more gentle approach this morning. While she was nursing, I sat there looking at her until our eyes met. I then told her, "You always look so beautiful in the morning." She looked away and said "I don't know why you think so, my hair is all messed up, no makeup, feeling tired." I just stared at her till she trailed off. When our eyes met again, I smiled at her, then left the room. Better, or still needs some work?

Oh, and it didn't change her attitude toward me, she's still stand-offish.

[chromosphere]

"That part is good. But, I sometimes feel too detached, you know what I mean?"
Unfortunately I do. I am really beginning to feel detached from her, and I don't want that. I know the MC session is not going to be the holy grail, but it can't come too soon. I think if I have to wait much longer to at least start airing some of this stuff out, I'll either go crazy or just completely shut off.

"It's hard to find a happy medium between too enmeshed and too detached."
You are too good at succinctly describing exactly how I feel. Should I go talk to her or just leave her alone? Should I tell her how I feel or just bottle it up? Should I show affection or will she just think I am smothering her? Should I say nice things to her or is that just being to pushy?

"That fact of the matter is, I feel like would rather open up to you than have to deal with all of these feelings with my H."
I echo the feeling that it is nice to open up to you. I feel comfortable talking to you about these things. One difference between us (OH NO!!!) is that I want to deal with this issues head-on and start fixing them, but the conventional wisdom is that I need to just back off.

"Sincerely, thanks for being there..here..wherever"
Your welcome, and thanks in return. I probably wouldn't mind being wherever you are, but you'd hate it out here. Remember, no coffee shops.

[cinemanymph]

globule said,

So I came up behind her, grabbed her, started rubbing on her legs and stomach, and even picked her up a bit

Just had to give the LD perspective on the from behind hug; for the hugger, it feels great, for the huggee, it feels somewhat like being tickled when you don't want to be tickled. As I did the work of exploring my sexuality, I began to enjoy and even look forward to hugging from behind.

[cinemanymph]

I seem to be a freak of nature who's stomach seems to reside right along there pelvic line.

Chrissy, you slay me, lol!