"He was obviously distraught over his LIFE not just OW." I truly do think that if my marriage was stronger, if I had felt a strong connection with my wife, and if my self-esteem was a lot stronger, the loss of the OW would have hurt, but it would not have produced the same ultra-strong reaction that it did. Of course, if I had a strong connection with my wife, I probably wouldn't have had the EA (not blaming wife here, I am to blame for the lack of connection), so I guess it is a moot point. Oh well.
I think that mix of low self-esteem, troubled marriage, and strong EC with OW that is suddenly broken can be more devestating than most people think. Let's just say when I hear stories of people starting down that same road I went down, I can already see the tears starting to flow.
But as we have so often talked about, there was some good. I have some evidence now that my long-held low opinion of my physical self is not true. And I have a much better idea now of what I want out of a R. And I truly do think that if the EA had not happened, our marriage was heading for divorce. I look back now at some of the thoughts I was hiding from myself, and I am amazed that we weren't already there before the EA happened.
For example, and you will all probably think I am absolutely awful for thinking this, but I am going to tell it anyway. Do you remember that great line from "As good as it gets" where Jack Nicholson tells Helen Hunt that "she makes him want to be a better person." I can distinctly remember thinking once or twice earlier this year that I felt like my wife "makes me feel like a worse person", the exact opposite sentiment. I'm glad I bit my tongue and never said it, because I now know it was just resentment over years of physical rejection. But that sort of stuff was building up inside me, and it wasn't until the EA that I started thinking outside the little box I was living in and started really researching this relationship thing. And I ended up here.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
I'm sure my H felt the same way that you do. I remember once thinking that he had given up OW and he was just moping around the house. I had done some reading, so I recognized this as his grieving process, and at the time, I tried to give him some extra loving. I was also taking most of the responsibility at that time for the troubles we were having. Had he not given into the feelings he was having, and had he really given up OW at that time, when I was still motivated to keep our marriage from failing, I really think we would have stayed together.
I know it's hard to give up that emotional high of being with ow. Being recreated in our lover's eyes. We are new and fresh and unspoiled. Given that chance to start anew is hard to resist. But think of the benefits of staying; your family intact, your R with W strengthened by the ordeal, coming out the other side stronger and happier. It is possible, you just have to work for it.
There are several space based interferometers planned by NASA in the near future. For those who don't know, an interferometer is a device that uses the combined light from multiple telescopes and analyzes the resulting interference pattern to deduce even higher resolution images of the source. The first one planned is SIM Planetquest (the space interferometry mission) will have the capability to determine parallax of stars out to several 10,000s of parsecs which will greatly enhance our ability to know the true distances to all objects in space and perhaps find some planets. They also have planned the TPF (terrestrial planet finder) an interferometer that has the capability of resolving Earth-like planets around other stars. Finally, they have planned the PI (planet imager) which will have the resolution to actually image the surface of those Earth-like planets. I CAN'T WAIT!! How cool will it be to possibly see oceans and continents on distant planet and wonder about the possibilities of life there.
It will take a lot of money for sure. The idea to put it out past Jupiter is just one of several options. The technical limitations are enormous. You have to know the distance between the various telescopes down to the nanometer or better to get the resolution they want. They are using what is called laser metrology to get that accuracy.
Oh my gosh! Ummm, let's just say those 6.5 meter scopes are pretty cool. They are very modern. The Chilean government has put a lot of effort into building good relationships with advanced countries to boost their economy and the Las Campanas, La Silla, Cerro Tololo, and Cerro Paranal observatories are a big part of that partnership.
Hubble has much higher resolution than the 6.5-meter scopes, due to the lack of atmospheric interference. Although, the 6.5-meter scopes do use what is called active optics to increase resolution. Basically the mirrors in the scopes are segmented and can be adjusted individually by mechanical actuators. Essentially, they can adjust the mirror shape many times per second to try to correct for atmospheric distortions. Pretty cool. The space interferometers will be much higher resolution than Hubble.
I hope I don't have to wait a year, but I am in this relationship fixing mode for the long haul. I haven't set a timetable at which I may give up if things seem untenable, but it will be much longer than a year for sure.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
Well, I certainly hope that the W is not taking all the responsibility for the troubles in our marriage on her shoulders. I definitely have not tried to give her the impression that I feel like she is solely to blame for our problems. I know that the path to where we are now is riddled with my own mistakes. Maybe I should take the time to point out to her what mistakes I made so that she will know that I am taking blame for this.
I am pretty darn sure that if our marriage fails it will not be because of OW. I mean, she has her own marriage, so there is really no temptation for me to leave W for her because she won't have me (not to mention that I don't want to leave W). Maybe my W sees it differently, and she will never be able to get over the EA, who knows. I sincerely hope not.
Thanks for sharing your story with me.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
At our first MC, the C took my wife aside and spent most of the time talking to her. The wife seemed happy to do it. I hope that it will continue to be that way. I have no problems with my wife getting individual C.
I guess it has been a little over a month now. I do appreciate that she didn't immediately just leave me upon hearing about the affair, and I do take that as a gesture that she loves me. I honestly do believe that my wife loves me, its just that I have a hard time feeling it because she doesn't show it to me, and hasn't much our whole marriage. I have no delusions that the change would be immediate. Right now I just wish she would talk to me. If she would just tell me that she is withholding affection and sex because of bad feeling from the EA, I could understand that. But of course, the witholding of affection and sex has been going on before the EA, so there is something else there too.
You mean your husband came back after an affair, expected you to welcome him back, and then wasn't even nice to you. I can't say I blame you for wanting to leave. Believe me, I have TRIED to show my wife I love her. I have tried all of the love languages, I say the words to her, I do things for her, I give her gifts, I am affectionate toward her, and I make time to spend with her.
Well, I could find another job, but the job I have is the one that my W wanted me to have because it allows us to be close to her family. There really isn't another job I could get that would do that. I think I am making myself an open book, but maybe I'm not. I am definitely trying anyway. I help out with the kids more and help around the house a lot.
I do understand that it might be hard to embrace the new me. But the problem is that the old me was the person who made all the relationship mistakes that led to the EA. The new me may want a more sexual and affectionate relationship, but I don't think that is an bad goal, despite its origin. It may be hard for her to accept that and thus take time, I agree. One thing is for certain, I cannot go back to a permananent non-sexual non-affectionate relationship.
Thanks for your words.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
What are you doing up posting at close to 4am? I thought you were near the east coast but maybe I was wrong? Actually I was up later than I usually am. H is off to Boston so I was up late watching bad tv and reading the posts. I really wish he was here right now because he usually gets me my coffee and chocolate chip muffin from Dunkin Donuts. So I am sitting here cranky without my caffeine and don't really feel like gathering up the kids and driving there myself. You know what this means don't you? I might get a little cranky in my posts but I will try my best to find coffee/chocolate asap
Seriously though, I wanted to comment on this: I am not suicidal anymore, and I am actually ashamed that I even was for a short time. It was a cowardly response not worthy of me, and extraordinarily unfair to my wife and children and everyone else in my life. Thanks for caring though. I just wanted to say that MANY people have had those feelings even if they don't admit to them due to shame or whatever. You are brave, not cowardly. I had those feelings myself when my H left suddenly. I specifically remember the next day. My friend came over to try and console me and I threw myself on my bed balling my eyes out and told her I just wanted to die, kill myself, end it. Looking back I can't believe that was me. That is so not like me and luckily I bounced back pretty quick but the feeling was there even if for only a few hours. It was real and it was terrifying. I couldn't see the future in front of me. No H, no job, two kids, you get the idea. I felt so alone. The "one chance at happiness" comment comes from my fear that I will spend the rest of my life trying to have the relationship I want with my wife and never succeeding, the passion hovering just out of my reach. I think this relates to our feelings of desperation at the time. It is hard to see other options when you are in the midst of such turmoil. You do have choices Globule so don't forget that. Of course you hope it will work out with your W. I hope it will work out with my H. I think it is too soon for either of us to know if that will be the outcome. Our wounds are too fresh. We are wearing our hearts on our sleeves like you said and are in ultra-sensitive mode. The thought of no passion the rest of our lives makes us insane. I understand! That's why I was encouraging taking it one day at a time. If I look at my future with H and see the kids grown and us still in the same old M, I get totally depressed. But who can say what will happen tomorrow, next month, next year. Our future isn't set in stone even if we stay in our M. I guess it helps to have a new perspective. This is me being miss optimist right now You know I waver back and forth several times in one day so my next post might be totally melancholy Speaking of melancholy, it was past midnight last night and it was just me and the dog (kids asleep), sitting almost in the dark listening to "We Might As Well Be Strangers" - the saddest Keane song for sure. Can you say "Glutton for Punishment?" Where's my coffee!!!!
Hi Globule...Regarding your sitch, part of me relates to your wife's LDness ( especially in my early marriage/ young mother days) and another part relates to the urgency you feel to have a sensual marriage. You are still adjusting to " OW withdrawals"...in time you will calm down to fully embrace the challenge to get your marriage to a more intimate place. I feel the need to throw in here that it's going to take some time...if you can channel your energy to see this as a challenge, it may help with the sense of urgency you feel. It's like you and W have to build your own marital interferometer to chart out new territory...the C will help to provide a clean lens, but there is going to be a lot of trial and error.
Something I'm curious about that hasn't been touched here yet...you say that your W is close with her parents. What kind of influence does her mother have on her? Does W feel pressure to live up to some " good mother" expectation? Somewhere she has internalized the message that it's reasonable to give up a sensual identity...I can tell you that underneath, she is not happy about this. Your changes will help to create health within her, a win-win situation for the whole family.
Anyway...congrats on the baby! And btw, you have great taste in music!
Quote: neanderthals (sp?). Yes, that is spelled correctly and it is pronounced TALL not THAL at the end (I almost majored in anthropology).
Once you’ve been here a while, you’ll know that part of my job is to be the resident teacher. I know I can be annoying, but I can't help myself.
Neandertal and Neanderthal are both technically correct spellings. The Neander is a river and “Tal” is the German word for valley. But when the first fossil was discovered in 1856, the word for valley was spelled “Thal”. Neanderthal man was named for where the fossil was found – in the Neander valley. (Just like Clovis man was discovered near Clovis, New Mexico.) In any case, there were numerous spelling changes in German in 1904 to make spelling and pronunciation more consistent. At that time, the spelling of valley was changed from “Thal” to “Tal”.
So you have your choice. At the time the name was coined, it was spelled “Neanderthal”, so it would be quite correct to use that spelling. But since it’s a German word, it would also be correct to use the current German spelling: “Neandertal”
What that has to do with anything, I don’t know, but I couldn’t resist.
Quote: But the question I have is what is my strategy? Wait for her to get the anger out of her system? Try to prod her into releasing her anger? How do I encourage her to communicate?
Your strategy right now should be to allow her to heal from the birth of your newborn, all the while being loving and charming and all the things that you want to be.
I think you are being incredibly unfair to your wife. She is certainly guilty of ignoring you but your timing is SO awful that it will only set you back farther and farther and, yet, you keep plowing ahead because you are distraught over the OW and want to have the feelings back that you had with her, yesterday.
I'm telling you this so that you don't lose your marriage, ok? Women are extremely intuitive. If you think that your wife has not put 2 and 2 together and know that your sudden desire to work on the M is due to an influx of OW-related emotion, you are vastly selling her short. She knows it. She is also calculating exactly how far along in her pregnancy she was when you began the affair and how far postpartum she was when you began pressuring her to be a better wife.
Your timing is so collossally bad that I cannot keep quiet any longer! Glob, PLEASE for the sake of your M and kids, just chill for a few weeks and let the woman heal.
You have 3 weeks to wait until counseling. Surely you can work on yourself in that time and shelve any demands for how you would like her to be? This will do wonders in terms of how willing she will be to work with you, in the future.
It is not your wife's responsibility to heal the pain from your affair.
Now, having said that: How about some personal goals for YOU? Let's hear em!
"I almost majored in anthropology" What stopped you? The thought of spending long days toiling in hot deserts looking for a few shards of pottery? That would do it. I'm not a big "sleeping in a tent" kind of girl, although I love to travel so maybe that would have made up for it. I'll take a hotel (preferably with room service and pool, overlooking the ocean view) over camping anyday
Make sure you bring that up to the C." I will, and wish me luck. I just hope the C sees that I am nearing the end of a rope. This is why it will be important to go into it prepared so that you don't forget what you wanted to say. And don't be afraid to redirect the conversation back to something you think is important if the C is getting off track. You know what is important to the M more than they do so don't waste your time and money. Be pro-active. I was hoping that W would like the new me better, and she does like parts. Ok, so it's not all bad. She likes parts and may start to like the other parts (sexually in particular). Have you asked her what HER expectations are for your SL? Don't let her get away with "I don't want to talk about it." You need some specifics, even if it is not what you want to hear. If she tells you she has no inclination to EVER start having a good SL that at least tells you where you are working from. Maybe she wants once a month? A week? not likely. But you should feel her out about her expectations.
So I am sitting here cranky without my caffeine and don't really feel like gathering up the kids and driving there myself. You know what this means don't you? I might get a little cranky in my posts but I will try my best to find coffee/chocolate asap 
You know I waver back and forth several times in one day so my next post might be totally melancholy 
Speaking of melancholy, it was past midnight last night and it was just me and the dog (kids asleep), sitting almost in the dark listening to "We Might As Well Be Strangers" - the saddest Keane song for sure. Can you say "Glutton for Punishment?" 