Learning to trust myself III

[heatherg]

You know, I was just thinking. I'll probably address this one issue with him tonight. My need for him to be supportive to me while I was sick. Did he realize it? Did he hear it in my voice? Did it come natural to him to want to support me and because of our circumstances he just witheld it, or did it not even occur to him? Maybe he thought he *was* being supportive?

It needs to be addressed. This is how things start to build up and I react to my perceptions of how he was reacting to me. Hmm. See where that would not be healthy?! LOL.

I'll just tell him how I feel and ask him how he feels. How normal is that? So normal that it almost didn't occur to me as an option.

[Jabez]

He just doesn't get it why I would need to be a 'woman' in addition to a 'mom', and why that 'woman' likes to feel taken care of and protected sometimes too.

Ya know this same thought hit me a while ago. After we became a family, I started seeing "US" as WAW, me & DD's. I stopped seeing WAW & I as a entity that needed time and nurturing in order to keep the 4 of us together. I didn't ignore WAW, I just saw her more as a mom than a wife, lover, woman. I loved her as the mother of our children rather than focusing on her, her thoughts, her ambitions, her feelings. I could see how an OM w/o all those other ties to kids, house, etc would focus on her and not be distracted by other things in life.

Thanks for sharing your introspection.

Have a good weekend!

[NYsurvivor]

I'm not stupid, I don't need to be told that this is what being a parent is about. I know that... I just want a safe place in the world with someone that I can confide in

You're right, Heather. And your post made me feel for you. I hope you're feeling better... it's tough being a mom.

I guess what it is, is that to most guys, were they to feel overwhelmed by their fatherhood chores, they would tend to suck it up and say to themselves (or to other guys), "well, that's what it means to be a dad!" And he applies the same to you, perhaps not understanding that a women's needs are different there. "Men are from Mars", after all.

So, to answer your question NY, when someone actually hears what I am saying and validates it, I just feel, well, good. And then I don't feel the need to keep saying it in a multitude of different ways

So it's like tears of relief?

I suppose for you, if your WAW feels at all like I do, her comments would be a good thing for you. Because it means she's emotionally deprived which doesn't say good things about the status of her R with OM.

That's what I suspected as well. Thanks for taking the time to answer me. I don't know, if that's what's happening with my ex, if it constitutes a "good thing" for me or not... I'm actually more sad for her that she's in such a state than what it may portend for me.

[Dmsw4]

I guess what it is, is that to most guys, were they to feel overwhelmed by their fatherhood chores, they would tend to suck it up and say to themselves (or to other guys), "well, that's what it means to be a dad!"

I know it's sad, but in my experience, guys that get overwhelmed with fatherhood chores, just disappear into their caves and don't come out til the dust has settled.

I know how you feel Heather. I remember one time I had strep throat. I felt horrible. It was a chore just to ask H to watch the kids while I dragged my tired, sore aching body to the ER. When I was finally seen by the ER doc, I sat and cried silent tears because someone, a complete stranger, cared for me more than H did at that time.

NY, could it be your x feels unworthy of your continued support and understanding? She may feel that she has burned her bridges, hurt you horribly, and still you reach out to her with validation and caring.

[heatherg]

I missed you guys this weekend. I dismantled my home computer some time ago and my laptop is having some rebuilding work done, so I was without a computer at home this weekend.

(Jabez) I didn't ignore WAW, I just saw her more as a mom than a wife, lover, woman. I loved her as the mother of our children rather than focusing on her, her thoughts, her ambitions, her feelings.

I can see where this would be an easy transition to fall into, I don't blame H for this. I just wish that he cared enough about me to listen when I told him I needed more. I know everyone makes mistakes with their partners and I'm not one to purposely hold onto hurt. Did your WAW ever specifically tell you what she needed from you and, if so, how did you respond to her? THAT is the key.

(Jabez)I could see how an OM w/o all those other ties to kids, house, etc would focus on her and not be distracted by other things in life.

At the age I'm getting to be, I'm surprised all OM don't already have kids, divorces and other major problems of their own!

(NY) I hope you're feeling better... it's tough being a mom.

I am feeling much better, thank you. I know there are a lot of Moms out there who have it harder than I do. So, I'm ok. Thank you so much for thinking of me!!

(NY) So it's like tears of relief?

I think it's a combination of things, probably relief included. It seems to be sort of letting defenses down as you allow someone to briefly enter your world. It is a connection between two people in my opinion, although it's typcially not as cryptic or as dramatic as that may sound, lol. And connecting with people feels good, particularly for people who aren't happy in their marriages since they tend to not be connecting with their partner. I go through my days without that feeling of having that someone in the world who truly wants the best for me (besides my parents!!). And when I get that feeling from an unexpected source, say a stranger, it can be almost sad. In your case, your WAW may feel that you are an unexpected source because of all she has done to hurt you and here you are, comforting her. It speaks volumes about the person you are.

(NY) Thanks for taking the time to answer me. I don't know, if that's what's happening with my ex, if it constitutes a "good thing" for me or not... I'm actually more sad for her that she's in such a state than what it may portend for me.

Are you kidding?! Anytime! You're right. I'm glad to hear that you are more concerned about her state than about what it means for your future with her. I just meant that it was good for you because you made a connection with her. A good one.

(Mel) I know it's sad, but in my experience, guys that get overwhelmed with fatherhood chores, just disappear into their caves and don't come out til the dust has settled.

Yeah, I would have to agree that that seems to be a common response with many guys. In your case, someday your girls are going to be old enough to see this as well and they will recognize their father in those words. We all reap what we sow....sometimes where it seems there is no justice, one day it appears.

(Mel) I sat and cried silent tears because someone, a complete stranger, cared for me more than H did at that time.

Yep. That's the feeling.

[Jabez]

Did your WAW ever specifically tell you what she needed from you and, if so, how did you respond to her?

Not that I can recall. At least not before the bomb. After the bomb, I received a list of "things we never did" as the reasons why she was unhappy and why our R/M was over and we needed to move on.

After the "pre-bomb" in the summer of 2002 when WAW said she was not happy but wouldn't leave, I read 5LL and His Needs, Her Needs and unfortunately went over board guessing LL and acting on them. I guess that's part of my frustration, from my recollection and my perception, WAW did not reveal what she needed from me and give me the opportunity to meet those needs.

I'm actually more sad for her that she's in such a state than what it may portend for me.

I feel the same way about my WAW. She told me that she knows about love and knows what she is doing. She may be right, but I disagree with her. I feel sad that she has terminated so many of her friendships as a part of her "new life".

We all reap what we sow

I hope that the love and attention that I am sowing in DD's lives germinates into healthy relationships for them in the future.

Thanks for your reply. Believe it or not I am learning from you and others on the BB for a future relationship either w/WAW or someone else.

[Dmsw4]

Yep. That's the feeling.

Sadly, I know what you mean. Love Ya Heather

[heatherg]

Thanks Mel. Too bad you didn't live closer or we could cry tears in our beers. But only for a little while and then we'd be ok again.

(Jabez) I hope that the love and attention that I am sowing in DD's lives germinates into healthy relationships for them in the future.

I'm sure it will Jabez. If being crazy and demented can ruin your children, then surely being sane, grounded and moral can make them grow happy and healthy.

I had my healing touch session today. It was interesting....relaxing. I think I would have preferred a massage, which I intend to get this weekend Really though, it made me feel very grounded and very loving and accepting toward myself.
Since I've been sick I haven't quite been able to shake myself out of this negative attitude. I feel like I've taken giant steps backward....or perhaps I feel a little like H has come home, but he hasn't.
We had sort of a R discussion Saturday afternoon. He still stands by the idea that I am not sorry to *him*. And maybe he's right. Maybe I'm still too angry to be sorry to him. I'm angry at the way he continues to treat me! I can leave the past in the past, but for crying out loud nothing changes with him, so his disrespect just keeps on goin like the freakin energizer bunny. I mentioned that I will be going to DC on a business trip in December and that it was a good opportunity to talk to someone in particular from our public accounting firm's sister firm about the changing environment in our industry (our accountants have arranged dinner for all of us that night, so I get to talk to him off the record and specifically about my topics) and H said "Yeah, sounds like a perfect opportunity for something else too". Sarcasm. WTF?? And since then (two days ago) he has stopped calling me during the day like he was doing everday. Distance.
I just cannot shake the feeling that this is never going to work for me. This just isn't where I belong. So then I think about just moving on without moving on. Emotionally moving on. So I ask myself, what things can I do to reflect that to myself? And the first thing that comes to mind is moving back into my bedroom. Why does the fact that I am sleeping on the couch or in another room haunt me like it does?? So what, I'm not sleeping in the king sized bed that used to be mine. The couch is actually super comfy. WHY DO I CARE???? I have the feeling that I'm making it a much bigger deal than it needs to be and if I could stop stressing about it, maybe it would change. Sleeping anywhere other than my room just feels too much like a punishment and it is a constant reminder that I'm not calling all the shots in my own life. It would really help to hear different viewpoints on this. Does anyone out there think it would be totally beyond my rights to move back in my room without an invitation from him since it's been a year and a half? Would that be totally insensitive to his feelings? Please help!
I need to DO something. Allowing this all to continue on and on even when he's gone just feels like I'm going to jump out of my skin.
Today, I've had ENOUGH. Maybe tomorrow my resilience will kick in. Let's hope so.

[Dmsw4]

Sometimes I think you're fighting it just to prove to him that he's wrong. Does that make sense? He thinks you're going to stray, to leave him. You want to fight harder to stay just to prove him wrong. I've seen how hard this has been on you. I feel for you, I really do....

You know, when we were talking about the crying unexpectedly, my counselor once told me I should take time for a massage, but to be aware that I might start crying, just for the reasons we've talked about, having someone touch us, caring for us, releasing all the tension and ugliness.....I never went just for that reason, I was afraid to be a sobbing heap on the massage table....I should have gotten the massage

Take care Heather.

[koshka]

Heather,

I just cannot shake the feeling that this is never going to work for me. This just isn't where I belong.

What do you mean by "work?"

Why does the fact that I am sleeping on the couch or in another room haunt me like it does??

Because you are allowing yourself to live like the guest who's one too many for the number of beds? In your own home. In front of your kids. To appease H.

In a year and a half, has it gotten you closer to H emotionally? Has it made you feel better about yourself? Does it make you feel better about your M? Does it at least make it easier to get up for work? Hey, I like looking for silver linings, but that's a joke.

You asked yourself a question about why you care. Have you written anything poetic lately that might help you get clarity?

Does anyone out there think it would be totally beyond my rights to move back in my room without an invitation from him since it's been a year and a half?

It's been all night and there's not a lot of hands going up, Heather. More importantly, what do you think and feel about it?

Thanks,

K