"Your affair and Glob's aren't similar. Your husband had abandoned you and the marriage. I believe I recall you saying that you had mutually agreed that you both could see other people. That's puts you at a different starting point. Glob and his wife didn't have such an understanding."
I never said our affairs were similar, or never intended to anyway. She did not betray her husband, I betrayed my wife, plain and simple. Although I felt abandoned emotionally and physically, I did not have a permission slip to "fill my love bank" outside the marriage.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
Quote: I never said our affairs were similar, or never intended to anyway. She did not betray her husband, I betrayed my wife, plain and simple. Although I felt abandoned emotionally and physically, I did not have a permission slip to "fill my love bank" outside the marriage.
Glob, I didn't think that you had. I was responding to LFL.
It would be nice if relationships were easier, wouldn't it?
I do hope that your wife can hear your heart and respond soon.
Yeah, I guess I was sort of saying that as a "for anyone who is listening." I didn't want people to think that I was equating my affair with LFLs.
Yes it would. If the good times weren't so good in a R, they definitely wouldn't be worth the bad times.
Unfortunately I've got a lot of waiting to do, and not a lot of patience. And you've seen what happens to me when I get impatient, my mind goes all over the place. Or is it the lack of sex or physical affection that is just driving me crazy.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
LFL You are very correct not all affairs are created equal. I am not judging others, Judging is not in my personality type at all. I dont remember anyone here judging you. Mrs.Nop restated what I have said to you before, you were abandoned and then started your new R. I would be perfectly 'justified' if I were to start a new R now also. I havent because I dont want the confusion, dont need the validation, am not sure what I will do if she stops divorce, want to make sure jealousy is not a motivating factor for her, etc.
I want to make this crystal clear, it is the lying and the deception that I abhor and the need by the affaire to be vicious, vindictive and hurtful fueled by their guilt and shame. Telling someone 'This M is over' and then moving on is perfectly above board, and I have no problem with that either. Though I do think in most situations it is immature.
Im really going to shock some people now.
I am perfectly ok with those who choose to swing in their R's, (though most of them have phsyc issues, but then again dont we all) and perfectly ok with polygamy. It is done openly without lying or deception. I am no serial cheater, LFL married or not. I have been a parallel dater, but I was honest about it. I would not lie to my spouse or disrespect another persons personal boundary or right to choose to be in a situation like that. The personality traits I project here are by no means my complete personality. They are me trying to teach and make a point. You came close to pegging my MO last week. smarty pants. It was funny because I have made no attempt to be subtle about it, hence the teasing that you figured me out.
I have not commented much on Globules affair other then to point out the things he did that were attractive so he can pull them into his new M. I saw the other things but I did not feel attacking those points was useful, at the time, and others are pointing it out in a kinder, more tactful way then I am prone to.
If he had still been in the midst of it I would have put some smack down. His first post implied that it was over, so its time to get to work salvaging and rebuilding not focusing on the past. I was getting ready to bring it up and I am glad others did first. Globule is all over the place right now (sorry, buddy you are) and I have not even discussed being attractive since all the other more important convos and issues you and HP and Mrs. Nop, Cobra too are discussing and starting to work on.
LFL you feel for other people, its cute, I like you lots because of it, but all our sitches are different. Yours played out how it did and you both are trying to make the best of it. Awesome, you both have shown your true love for each other and commitment to the M. nonetheless, you still have some residual confusion and longings left over because of OM.
I AM sick of affairs being considered a harbinger of good. GEL and HP -HDW--are having some good progress without them. The nops, I think? and I believe GGB --HDH--is having some success also.
"When someone loves you despite the fact that they can see all your flaws, that is reality-based love
I had this for my x, and was hopinng she would have it for me too. Its painful to love someone this way and know it isnt returned and find out it never will be.
Globule, I never thought you had equated them either. Your biology is running amuck right now, and I do empathize with the turmoil you are in. For the sake of your M and the long term goals you want with your W, you gotta get a hold of it, whatever it takes. I encourage you to at least ask about some anti-depressants. preferably libido killing ones.
Quoting Cobra
Quote: I bet that if you gave her the silent treatment and just walked out without telling her where you are going, and stayed gone without any communication at all for several days, you would see a different reaction in her. This may be hard for you to do (and I’m not necessarily recommending this specific act, but something along these lines), but it could help to empower you. You may return to find out that she is very PO’d at you and has started to feel her vulnerabilities. For my wife, the only way for her to understand what I am feeling is for her to feel it herself.
Globule,
Normally I would have encouraged you to seperate temporarily for two reasons. (although I would advocate telling her that you are leaving, to think things over, find yourself, yada yada.)
One is for you to get a grip on yourself, so your W isnt seeing you all over the place like this. You need A LOT of silent introspective time, to make solid decisions, mentally recommit to the M, and set goals. It is killing her respect and further demolishing her attraction for you watching your current actions.
The other is so you could get some power back in the R due to the reasons Cobra stated. Like HP has stated your timing is so terrible what with the newborn that I simply cant recommend it.
I suspect the ladies will chime in her with a denouncement of that idea also. They like to seize any opportunity to KMA.
FWIW, as part of our reconciliation process, the C gave W a homework assignment to write down a list of at least 10 positive things that came out of my A. She had no problem coming up with that list. I think we all agree that any A, be it an EA or PA, is a bad thing. But what got us off on this track was a simple statement that an A isn’t necessarily all bad. Good can come from it. I agree with that. That’s not condoning having an affair. Neither is it recommending having an affair. It is what it is: a simple statement that good can come from something bad – that in our corporate condemnation, we shouldn’t overlook that fact that good can come from it.
I think I discussed this in another thread when I explained that I no longer feel guilty for having the A, but I do still feel regret for the damage it did to our R. Our R was forever changed. What I did can never be undone. In many ways the R is actually better, but there was a certain sense of trust and innocence that has been forever lost. The A was bad, no question. I wouldn’t recommend it as a way to achieve the positive changes that we saw in our M. But that doesn’t negate the fact that good did come from it.
This same reasoning applies to the Nazi experiments that keep getting dragged into this. What they did was bad. No question there. But the scientific knowledge gained from it is no less valuable just because the means of gaining that knowledge were immoral. The result certainly doesn’t justify the means, but that doesn’t negate the value of the results. We all agree that torturing other human beings “in the interest of science” is unequivocally bad. None of us would recommend the torture of other people to increase scientific knowledge. But it’s patently ludicrous to claim that nothing good came of it – that no knowledge was gained.
But that’s getting way OT. My point was that sometimes good can and does come from bad things. An A is a bad thing, but sometimes good can come from it.
"Globule, I never thought you had equated them either. Your biology is running amuck right now, and I do empathize with the turmoil you are in. For the sake of your M and the long term goals you want with your W, you gotta get a hold of it, whatever it takes. I encourage you to at least ask about some anti-depressants. preferably libido killing ones."
Yes my libido is rather high strung right now, but do you really think it is wise to just knock it out. I see that as a sure-fire way to go back to being old-Globule. Or are you just suggesting it for a few months to "get over the hump."
Don't most of the libido killing ones also tend to make you really sluggish, disconnected, etc.? I have heard some stuff about Prozac that makes me want to avoid it like the plague.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
I agree with everything in your post to me MrsNop. It is all about how the OP makes you feel, not always the OP themselves. I just wanted to add that the outcome of those feelings is the same whether or not the affair was in secrecy or not. Sure my H knew I was seeing someone and Globule's W did not. But the end result was quite similar. Feelings better about ourselves (with a little more guilt thrown in for Globule of course). But I don't think anyone who has had such a personal transformation would take it back if they could. I wouldn't. If that means my M is beyond fixing then so be it. I do not think that is the case. In fact, things are so much better in many ways. I have enough perspective and insight to realize that the OP was not a long-term R, reM situation. I worry about some of Globule's comments, as others do, regarding his continued fantasy that the OP will somehow work out in the end, or be there for him if the M's go south. You are totally correct that the "rosy feelings" of an affair wear off pretty quick, especially when an attempt is made at a "real" R. But, it is much easier to say that intellectually, much harder when in the midst of the turmoil. Globule knows intellectually that he needs to have no contact with the OW (even through the mutual friend) but he has to get to the place where he is ready to do it himself. All of us yammering about it through the keyboard and throwing in our 2 cents is really about making ourselves feel better, that We know the Right thing to do and he is being immoral, irresponsible, selfish, whatever. It is not for any of us to judge how he handles himself and his own M. He is on this board for support NOT his W. If she were here, that would be a different story. I know, I know, we are telling him these things for HIS OWN benefit and the benefit of the M. Maybe, maybe not. Only he knows what is best for him. Obviously we all come from very different backgrounds and have very different perspectives on life. I think we should respect that. That's all. Sorry to go on and on in response to you post MrsNop. That wasn't really directed at you
Hey Blackfoot Was glad to see your post to me this morning. Thought maybe I pushed you over the edge somewhere along the way but then I read this: LFL you feel for other people, its cute, I like you lots because of it Right back atcha big boy Just for that cute comment, I will refrain from saying you are judging others. Done. Now why haven't you posted more about your sitution? You mentioned in this post that she may stop the divorce. I've already told you I'm genuinely interested. Why are you avoiding posting it? I am perfectly ok with those who choose to swing in their R's I figured you were the "type". Loved this one too "parallel dater" Never heard that one before. Are you sure all of those women knew about this "parallel" situation? You are fun to tease, no doubt about that. you still have some residual confusion and longings left over because of OM. Sure do, not about him per se but the feelings I felt at the time, which are still present but muted a bit.
Normally I would have encouraged you to seperate temporarily for two reasons. (although I would advocate telling her that you are leaving, to think things over, find yourself, yada yada.)
One is for you to get a grip on yourself, so your W isnt seeing you all over the place like this. You need A LOT of silent introspective time, to make solid decisions, mentally recommit to the M, and set goals. It is killing her respect and further demolishing her attraction for you watching your current actions.
The other is so you could get some power back in the R due to the reasons Cobra stated. Like HP has stated your timing is so terrible what with the newborn that I simply cant recommend it. "
Almost missed that part of the post it was so long and I am so tired. You are right, I think some time away from the relationship would probably me some good, but it is just not possible now. In addition, I am just not very good by myself. My view of myself is pretty much completely tied up in what other people think of me (or at least my perception of those thoughts). Just the thought of be alone for a few days much less weeks or months fills me with such loneliness. The fact of the matter is I just don't like myself most of the time, and the feelings of guilt over the affair certainly don't help. Now there are new feelings based on what I am reading here on this board that it is my own low self-esteem that has driven my wife away from me. Her lack of attraction to me is due to her seeing me be a self-depricating wuss all the time. It is a vicious circle, because it makes me want to be even more of a self-depricating wuss just thinking about how I am a self-depricating wuss and what that has caused in my life.
I had another thought that will probably cause me to get lambasted. I think all of my hanging on to OW is an attempt to keep those positive feelings I had about myself during the EA alive. I can feel those positive thoughts slipping away every day as the memory of the EA fades and the reality of my marriage problems sets back in. I'm trying to convince myself that I need to find strength of character in myself and not in someone else's opinion, especially not OW, but it is just going to take time, if it happens at all.
OK. Moping and venting over for now. Gotta get to work.
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
