I honestly don't know what to do from here. I feel so WAWish it scares me.
I got up early, answered a post on here, then had a nose bleed and felt terrible so went back to bed. Andy and the girls woke me up and I answered the door in my PJ's - thankfully they were satin ones and not horrible ones.
He rushed off to his meeting and I had the girls for several hours. They told me about the baby's funeral and the tiny white coffin.
I showed them pictures on my computer of our town in 1890 so DD1 asked when the car was invented. I told her it was brought to the UK in 1904, at a guess. I looked it up on the internet and it said 10 October 1904 - that was a good guess. So we looked at photos of Model T Ford and stuff.
Then we looked through this history book (photographic history from 1900-1980) and I showed her the chapter from the 70's when I was born, and also from the 60's when they first invented yoghurt!
Then we did Muzzy Spanish because their dad does Spanish lessons with them.
After that I did housework whilst letting them free play and run about in the garden, and basically trash my house faster than I was tidying it!
After I finished my chores, I got them all colouring with crayons. Then their dad came back from his meeting and had to fight his way through all the toys littered on the floor.
He hugged DD4 and then asked me how I am. Then he made himself a coffee in my kitchen (I was already drinking one). We spent the rest of the afternoon sorting out disputes between our children and these 2 boys of the neighbour's. Then one boy threw eggs at our girls and left egg yolk all over my garden so Andy went mad and went round to the neighbours house to inform the parents.
The little brat had disappeared so the mother went off in her car searching for him while Andy and I stood on the street waiting for him to be brought home so we could reprimand him.
Then DD1 kept crying because one of the boys kept hitting her, so I told her to either play in the neighbours garden with her friend, or to play in my back garden where he couldn't go. She refused, she wanted to play in the street. I said no, she kept crying and wouldn't listen. Then Andy got mad at her and started shouting and she started shouting back at him and the 2 of them were having a screaming match in the hallway. I just said to her 'DD1, just do as your father and I have asked.'
Then I gave Andy a box of chocolates.
Then I went and cooked the dinner while Andy was supervising the kids and spending time with DD4. He carried the plates and things when it was ready and we all sat and ate together in peace, for a change!
After dinner we asked them to tidy away the toys which were thrown all over the house, in every room, and this is always a major operation with them as they just will not tidy!
Andy and I chatted in the front room while they were doing that - about the baby's funeral and the meeting he went to and what I'd been doing in the last few days. I told him I am going away on 16th December (it would have been our 10th anniversary if we were still married), to this campsite where they are having a Christmas Party for the kids and we talked about him buying a day pass so he could come and meet me on site for a few hours, with the other kids!
We got physical (not ML, but almost) and that actually felt great at the time (not like last time) but then he said afterwards that he felt we were rushing it too much and as he had only just dumped OW2, he needed a bit of time to breathe. He said that first we were together, then not, then there was OW1, then me again, then OW2 and now this and he feels as if he needs a bit of time to re-group so he can 'give me his best in a R' (his words exactly).
I questioned him on whether it was fear of commitment - I am much more direct this time, no hiding away like before. He said no, it isn't that, he just needs time to get all the previous BS out of his head so he can concentrate properly on our R, as it wasn't fair to only give me half an R and he wanted to do it properly this time and that meant dealing with his issues first.
I said Andy, I've been at this for so long I am tired. I need romance from you. I feel like a dying flower. What happens if my heart just dies and I can't do it anymore, when you want to?
He said that he didn't want that to happen and he likes my personality and loves my sex etc and he just wants a few weeks of 'him' time before he plunges head first into this R with me.
I said that we had got together and broken up times before and how do I know this isn't more of the same?
He said it's not like that this time because I do still want you, I just want this to be slower. I still want to come round here and visit and chat and stuff. I just think we should wait a few weeks before we get into regular ML, because so much has happened between us and I deserve better, and next time we ML he wants to be able to give me his best.
I said last time we ML was a problem and I was upset afterwards. Am I doing it wrong? He said it's not me. I am great at sex, that I was just picking up on the insecurity in his head and that's why it was different.
I said okay, we'll wait for a while on the ML, if that will help it improve and for you to have sorted out your BS, but know that this can't go on forever. I can't keep my heart open forever.
He said he only meant in the near-term future, because he was always rushing everything and making a mess of everything.
I said okay.
Then he asked if I would look after the girls tomorrow because he has another meeting. He said I didn't have to if I didn't want to, but he would appreciate it if I did. I said yes. He said he thought the activities I'd done with them were 'really great' - that's a turn up for the books, he actually complimented me on my parenting!
Then they left and he smiled at me and said see you tomorrow.
I am caught between feeling WAWish and feeling as if I have achieved something, and at the moment I don't know if I am upset or happy, or which feeling is the strongest.
I think you need to "Act as If" everything is going to be OK. When I do that, it takes me further than I ever expected. Negative thoughts are creeping into your head. Don't let that happen.
Also, trust what he is telling you as the truth. I think he is being sincere. Don't give him a reason to do what you are scared he may do.
What do you got to lose, really? Let's just say he is dragging you along. What--you'll lose three more weeks. Does that really mean anything compared to the time you have already invested. I know you are afraid of getting hurt again, but you can't live the rest of your life protecting yourself from something that may never happen. Trust that he has learned something from this whole ordeal just as you have. Think positive thoughts, think positives thought.....and remember time will heal all the wounds eventually.
I try to act 'as if' but also if I have questions I want to be able to ask them, because I didn't all the other times and he didn't respect me because he thought I would just agree to whatever he wanted.
That's why I am more direct with him if something concerns me.
But I should have been more light hearted about it. And you're right. It's definitely a trust issue. Because he has repeatedly left and come back, I want to make sure he's staying this time.
I THINK he's sincere, as he said it all very gently and in a really thought out way and he was holding my hand the whole time and saying this time it is different, I still want you etc etc.
I've got to find a way of trusting that he's telling me the truth - because then I wouldn't mind. It's not really the ML at all. I can go without that for the time being, it's learning how to enjoy this R without looking over my shoulder all the time.
I want to leave him. I just can't bear it anymore. My heart is just breaking. My kids are playing in the garden and I'm sitting in here, in tears. I just want him to take them back because I'm so upset, I can't stop crying and I haven't even spent any time with them since they got here. I can't get a grip of myself long enough to do anything with them, and I've got another 6 and a half hours before he gets them
I just can't stop crying and it's been an hour so far.
I already felt bad yesterday because no matter what improvements there have been, and whether he loves me or not, it just doesn't seem to be sticking. On previous times I always felt happy, felt as if it was flowing properly. Now I don't.
He's said he loves me for the first time, he said he wants an R, he's been buying me presents etc, but I am not getting the same connection I felt with him in these past 3 years.
He's ashamed of me as the mother of his children, I am just a babysitter to him and third choice at that. If he had anyone else to help, he would sooner get them. I am always, always last choice with those children
He hates my work - he said he was proud of me for doing that book but he's not really, because if ever it gets mentioned, he is always really negative about it. He never asks any questions about the charity or the helpline or anything, yet I am supposed to listen to his home ed stuff and his computer jobs for hours.
The new cover for my vaccination book just got finished last night and I was really excited about it so I told him about it briefly when he dropped off the kids, but he doesn't like the design idea (me, him and the kids against a backdrop of viruses) - it was not my idea, it was the graphic designer's idea. He didn't say he didn't like it, but he just rushed off, mumbling about why did I do that in an 'off' tone of voice. He's ashamed of me, of us, and especially of me being mother to his children If he wasn't ashamed of me, he wouldn't care what the design was - and he put photos of our kids on the previous 3 editions of that book, so I didn't think he'd mind.
And then what with the sexual aggression the first time we ML, it didn't feel like ML - he was really rough and very directional and then of course he had to tell OW2, so I felt as if I should pass that one off as a bad job.
So he breaks up with OW2 and says he wants me, so I think great - maybe we can concentrate on us now. Then we get close again and it's actually great and I'm relieved that everything was okay, then he hits me with the 'I need more time' speech. Well, it's ALWAYS something. First he used to deny he wanted me, then it was OW1, then he said he wanted to 'take things slow' and was worried what the family would say, then it was OW2, after her he said it was the kids and when I asked him if I could have them, he just said I had 'no authority' and that they 'didn't need anyone new to cope with right now' (as if I am new! I am their flippin' mother!).
So then he gets over that one and asks me to have them and I have to fight back my resentment etc but nonetheless, we have a nice time as a family and he makes more loving statements towards me and acts like my partner, yet it seems to me with a total lack of desire for me.
I cannot tell you what it is like trying to stay positive and loving towards a man whom I love, who says he loves me, who professes to want me but then doesn't.
As a woman and a lover, I feel as if I have had my wings clipped off - if I cannot elicite desire from him, even if it's only hugging, what does that say about me? All of a sudden I just feel like the world's worst lover and I hate the feeling.
I don't know why he didn't stay with OW2 if he is that bothered about breaking up with her. I am hurt, since he was only dating her for 3 months and I have loved him my whole life so you'd think I would rank slightly more important. I met him in October 1987 - that's 18 years now - and it seems to me as if all that time counts for nothing in his eyes, if he can get so flippin' morose over a woman he shagged a few times since May of this year! Even though she's not there any longer, she's still there, getting in the way of my R with him and the kids. I now have to compete against a fantasy, a memory!!
And I'm so sick of it. I can't tell you what this is doing to my sense of attractiveness and my SD. It has plumetted through the floor since we first slept together this latest time, and it hasn't recovered. I am struggling to want a man that doesn't want me.
Anyway, after his grumbling remark about my book, I just shut myself in the bedroom and cried, and I hadn't even seen the kids yet.
I sent him a text message to say I would have the kids ready with their coats on at the door at 7.30pm (i.e, that I didn't want him to come in the house).
Like that song says, he does all this stuff and then comes back and tries to save it with a kiss, and I always have half a heart to love him and half a mind to leave, torn between what I want (him) and what I need (a proper family life).
I really can't get up the strength to see him unless he commits properly. I am exhausted, I'm out of love, I'm tired of DB'ing, I'd rather walk away from him than carry on like this.
He has to do something, and he has to do it now, or I am gone.
(((Jo))) Calm down. You've worked so long and hard to get to this point with Andy and D's. He's not moving at the pace you want. Slow down. Give him the space he needs, enjoy spending time with D's. He is secondary. You're doing exactly what he's been afraid of by becoming to emotional.
Honestly, he only appears to want you when he thinks he can't have you. Don't be mean to him, just "act" a little more indifferently. This is a stupid game in my opinion, but seems to be, he likes the chase. So go back to letting him chase you.
Yes, you deserve better treatment, but you also need to prove to him that you're the "best" choice to watch the girls regardless if there's 120 OW in the future.
JO, wipe those tears and go have fun with your D's. When he comes to get them, act like you're getting ready to leave and don't let him talk to you other than polite necessities as you're running out the door.
Hang in there, sweetie. Wish I could give you a hug.
I want to second what Jill said. IMO you are ready a lot into what seem like subtle cues. He wants you! If he didn't he would be with OW2, but he's not. He took the step to reach out to you. Now that you both have what you want, I think you are both scared. He's keeping you at be because he's threatened by you as the mother of the children (the OW were safe because he could truly feel they were essentially just a babysitter) and he's down on some of your successes and achievements while what does he do that's so great.
I think it's probably natural to have second thoughts. I've never gotten nearly as close as you and I've had them myself. It's fear. Fear of more of the same and being hurt again. Don't let that effect how you read into everything.
Jo, YOU ARE THOSE KIDS MOTHER!! Nothing he can say, do, or think will ever change that fact. Take this excellent opportunity to renew your relationship with them. It's a blessing.
I sympathize Jo. It's got to be really hard. Hope you can find the patience to wait for things to progress at its own rate. You can't just jump right back into "madly in love".
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
You need to suck it up this very minute and go enjoy the day with your kids. Stop letting your emotions control your actions.
When you get some free time after the kids leave you need to find some information on forgiveness and learn to forgive Andy once and for all. Do it for yourself. You deserve it.
Every single person in this world has been hurt. If we all sat around and felt sorry for ourselves and our past pain, we would never be anywhere. Everyone would just sit around trying to get even. There is nothing Andy can say that will make you feel like everything is going to be OK.
You have to start focusing on the future and let go of the past once and for all. The only person you are hurting by holding onto all of this is yourself.
What Andy did was wrong to you? That is a fact! But...You must forgive the hurts from the past and move forward.
There are no guarantees in life. There is no guarantee that he won't hurt you again. But...if he does, you will be OK. Thinking that it is just a matter of time before he hurts you again is a sure way to make it happen.
People hurt people because they have been hurt. Andy hurt you because of something you did to hurt him. Who gives a rat's a$$ who hurt who in the first place. Should he have been the bigger person and stopped the get even cycle--Sure. But he didn't. Now you have the great opportunity of letting it stop with you.
Now suck in those tears, put a smile on your face and do something to shift your mood towards the positive. I'll be thinking about you today and sending you positives vibes. Best wishes!
P.S. As I write this information to you, I am telling it to myself.
I've stopped crying now because writing it down seemed to help. My kids are playing in the room with me here as I'm calm now, and I got all of them food etc. I haven't done any activities with them (I normally do a lot of home ed stuff when I have them) and it's easier with them if I structure set times for set activities. Since they don't go to school, we don't have 'weekends' as such.
I just feel psychologically worn out so I'm not pushing it for today. I will just let them play and watch DVD's. I will do something more interesting with them when I feel better, another day.
I know I'm being too emotional. I have just heard it all before and I am so skeptical, it's hard to believe it or live in the moment and I know he likes the chase, I used to like the chase - but after all this time I'm sick of the chase.
The chase is fair enough if it actually leads anywhere but what if it doesn't? I am getting turned off to him chasing me, actually thinking I would prefer it if he didn't, because I feel like he's just keeping me as his part-time partner, unhappy and unfulfilled, while he doesn't have to make the effort. I want the chase to be over, that's why I know he has to be serious this time because I honestly don't want to waste anymore of my life trying.
I previously advised people to DB for as long as they were comfortable with, and I am definitely getting to a crossroads where I am no longer comfortable continuing with it unless I have some more favourable results from it.
He didn't see me in tears - that was after he left. I was pleasant to him at the door. The kids didn't see either as they went straight to the neighbours kids to play with them in my garden and didn't come and say hello to me until afterwards. I have been a bit snappy with them, but otherwise normal.
Tonight I will just hand them over and close the door. I know I am supposed to chat to him but I'm really not in the mood.
You're right, I am scared to death, and I had never thought of it like wanting to be straight back in the 'in love' phase.
We always were 'in love' before, even after the split - I have never done 'tame'. I don't know what I'm doing here, or how to act, and I'm petrified this sitch will just go on till I'm 80 and I'll be DB'ing with white hair, false teeth, and arthritis, whilst telling my grand-babies about the Gulf War!
Thanks for the kind remarks about me being my children's mother - I don't feel like I am the majority of the time and that was nice to hear. DD4 doesn't realise I am their mother. She says I am hers and not theirs and when I say I am their mummy too, she says 'No you're not!' She truly doesn't get it.
