thanks WCW...It has been a long, long hard haul, and there were many times I couldn't tell which end was up. If my sitch gives a bit of encouragement to anyone, I'm thankful.
I hadnt thought too much about how the animals were when things were so bad, but as I reflect back, I swear the ones who live most closely with us were depressed! guess I shouldnt be surprised. They were also clingy
I read some of your thread today, but havent gotten through too much of it yet...I'll try to get caught up tomorrow. I take it your H is away on a hunting trip?
yesterday when I was grousing to H about where monster parked, I got these 2 emails from him:
"Well monster may have parked by me, but she is so avoiding me in the halls, etc. In fact I saw her in the hallway once, I turned and went the other way and so did she. She isn’t accidentally showing up at my lunch time or coming back into this section of the building. I told her I wanted no contact and so far she has really honored that, no e-mails, nothing. I love you, quit stressing!!! Your D and: You just need to get hot stuff mounted in the window. I suppose I parked actually in her area today. I just hate being half a mile away over in the other lot. I guess I could go back to parking there so this doesn’t come up again. I really don’t think she is in the in the face mode. She really has done her best to interact only when absolutely needed and we always CC MAC in our e-mails so there is a third party always and nothing just between us and nothing but business and that is rare. You may not get it, but she is way through with me, off to greener pastures. Well, I got to go! Later D
So, I guess I really do need to work at accepting it at face value and letting it go, it was just so hard yesterday on the "Bomb Day" anniversary. I believe H is doing all he knows right now to be reassuring.
I was thinking about JJ's post about doing something loving, so when I got off work, I rushed like mad to the store and got some "quick to fix" stuff that I know H likes, ran home, fed animals, fixed supper, and made a center piece with silk flowers and candles for the table, set it nicely, and had it all ready when H got home. He was about 20 minutes late, in a foul mood from work, so we talked and talked, and by the time we ate things were kinda dried up; When we got into bed, H apologized for being so grumpy and worked up, and said "thanks for the supper, that was sweet". I've had a couple of emails w/ILY in them today. those are such lifesavers for me. I cant believe how much they mean. Gotta run, need to post something else, I will try to stop back and do that later this evening.
ok, a few minutes to post. our D and SIL are looking for jobs to move back to our area, which is good, BUT, they may need to stay with us for a while. I am kinda scared that the "pressure" could set H off again, I'm not 100% sure how "cooked" he is....I think he's pretty well done, but it's hard to predict. We don't have a large house, but what we could do is finish off a part of the basement really quickly which would give the kids a bedroom and a sitting area plus H's workout area down there.
Last night he commented that he wasnt looking forward to it because he felt like they would be intrusive (I think he just means he wont feel like he has as much privacy, they arent intrusive) but that if it was what needed to be to get them where they need to go, that was ok....for a short while.
I think as well it would be hard, but I can't, and don't think h could either, turn them down, for the simple fact that it looks like SIL may be the one who finds a job first, and I don't want her staying where they are now by herself, it is in a kind of "rough" part of town in a big city. Guess I'm an overprotective mom....
I just hope and pray we can find a way to keep from having it put too much strain on our hard-earned new M....
Of course, SIL hasnt even interviewed yet, so I'm putting the cart before the horse worrying about something that hasnt happened yet (can you say "crazy-making? I can!)but still...
Has anyone dealt with this? we have a good R with the kids, and I know they want to be on their own and have their privacy.
I am surprised at what a hard time I still have; I must keep my focus on doing what works to bring about the M and R that I (we) need and want. Even after all this time I find my self going back to focusing on the a and all of the grief and pain comes swirling back over me. I don't know why it's so bad right now, other than the anniversary of "bomb day"...I'm sure there will be more anniversaries.
This morning before work, the subject of monster came up, I dont recall how or what was said, but I do know H brought it up and it was light-hearted. when he was leaving for work, I said something about how much he means to me and that it bugs me that there is nothing I can say that she didnt already say. H said I should have said it 1st....I told him I thought I had, and he said "no you didnt"....I started to feel really sad....then I saw the opened cell phone bill on his dresser, I could have looked at it but didnt....I had a really really tough time with that. I don't know if he calls her or not, he says not....I do know our home phone bill is much less, and last month he told me I could look at it if I wanted to...I told him I didnt want to....but still I cant help but fret. I don't know why I can't stop fretting. I do ok until I see the phone bills, or the entry in the check book where he's paid them.
As I got to work, I pulled into the parking lot at the exact same time as monster, who parked in the place just across the walk way from me. As she was crossing the parking lot with the person who rides with her, H was going to his vehicle with another coworker to leave for out of town. I got this email from him when he got to the office:
Quote: Dang; What are you and monster calling each other so you arrive at work at exactly the same time, and parking right next to each other? I swear, you just are going have to find another spot I guess. Any way, I love you and I hope you have a nice day and don’t dwell on monster, I can assure you she isn’t dwelling on me or us. Your D
At the same time he was sending me that, I was sending him one telling him I'd felt sad after our discussion this morning, and that I was sorry I had let him down before by being so cool, and that I hoped he'd forgive me someday. I got this one in response from him, which made me tear up, I thought it was really sweet:
Quote: I have forgiven you a long time ago. I think we just need to look forward and stop spending so much time in the past and on the monster, no good will come from focusing there, hope is in the future and joy in the present. I love you too! Your D
Frankly it makes me tear up again just reading it. Why, now am I having such a hard time letting go of all this??????I truly believe H is sincere when he says such things, he may have had an affair, but he is not a "gamer" or "womanizer", if you know what I mean....so why so these things still haunt me????? why is it taking me so long to move on?
On the other hand, maybe it isnt taking me all that long....it didnt really end until the first of June, and I don't think H was REALLY all the way back until the end of August, after our vacation when monster started dating again.
It is so weird, I can pull it together and pick him up and comfort him, and then when he turns to me with reassurance and support I feel like I fall apart. I'm sitting here now with tears in my eyes, and I just feel worn out. exhausted.
on a brighter note, this past monday morning before he left for work, he said "I guess my ring (wedding ring) is just going to have to be resized so it's bigger, I just can't get it on this finger"...(he jammed a finger playing catch just before vacation)....actually, this is kind of a big thing, because he's resisted and resisted that when I've suggested it before. I have made no mention at all about his ring for a LONG time, other than I've said how nice it is when he does wear it.
Also, this evening before he left the office, he was still talking about driving over to show me the pretty trees in the town where his other office is, having lunch, and then showing me his office so we can decide where to put the electric fireplace. That is all good. I have never even been in his office. Still hurts to know monster has and I haven't, though.
I just had a thought. i know H is reading not just friends, and it talks about "reclaiming territories"....I wonder if maybe that is part of what has inspired him to talk about going to his office this weekend. I hope so....
He's also starting to talk about looking for new places to vacation. he used to refuse to consider it. I wonder if this is part of his focus on the future and rebuilding for us. I hope so on that point to.
Meanwhile, I need to focus on getting back to my weight loss program (NOT doing well here lately) and exercise (ditto) and decluttering the house and straightening out our finances. It is amazing how much goes to "pot" when an affair happens. I can't decide if it's "because of" the a, or just a whole syndrome.....I'm guessing they are all part of a syndrome, MLC maybe, for both of us?
i havent posted for a while...things have been going really good. last weekend H took me and S and one of S's friends to out of town office...I had never seen his office! then he took us to lunch at the little cafe he used to take ow to! yay! H initiated ml 4 times over the weekend, every day....he's been pretty positive and loving and cheerful.
monster still drives me nuts though, or at least i have a hard time not letting her do that....today again she was parked by H's vehicle....I was doing ok, giving myself pep talks that she's not worth getting upset about, and that I just need to keep focusing on making us "great" and "greater"...I had a couple of emails with ILY in them this morning....then this afternoon I get this forward from H: (caution, you are about to get to read a fight between monster and H)....
Email from H to me with his correspondence with monster attached: (this will be confusing, as it ends at the top and starts at the bottom) Man; I had a hell of a fight with Monster. She pisses me off so bad!! Tell me if you don’t think I’m right. I’m really ready to take this to HR and company. She just always has to be a snot, a damn excuse for everything! I love you! Your D
From: H Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 2:44 PM To: monster Subject: RE:
Frankly I may just do that. Your e-mail was out of line and you know it. All you needed to say was that yes, you were going to call and discuss her medication issues, period end of message!! The agency policy is that e-mails are checked regular and responded to, you didn’t do this. I don’t think you want this going to HR. I well know I am not the only person here unhappy with your responses and performance. For your information happy faces are inappropriate, no body else in this agency does this, for good reason! Perhaps all this should be addressed at your next yearly review in November? I generally address my questions directly to (monsters supervisor)with a cc to you so that I know they will be addressed, I shall continue to do so and will be glad to explain to her why I’m doing so if you wish me to do so. I am through with your poor, uncooperative attitude. I consider it abusive and uncalled for. I expect professional, polite and accurate information to be exchanged from this moment forward! If taking this to everyone concerned is what it takes then so be it!!
From: monster Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 2:04 PM To: H Subject: RE:
Anymore of these type of emails will be sent to (monsters supervisor), (H's supervisor) and (HR).
-----Original Message----- From: H Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:58 PM To: monster Subject: RE: Importance: High
Please; I don’t want or need a lecture from you for your inattention. I’m sick of your excuses, personal and or professional. I just want a response from you so that I know my client’s needs are being addressed. Calling her later today is fine. I just need to know that you are acting on the e-mail, if I don’t hear from you I can only assume you are not and so I e-mail (supervisor) as well. Funny,(supervisor) responds to my e-mails in a timely manner, even though not marked “High Importance”.
From: monster Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:44 PM To: H Cc: monsters supervisor Subject: RE:
Yes, I will call her and address her issues w/ her medication. I did not see where you marked your email as "Importance: High" so it was view along w/ my other emails in the order they came. When you are needing a response prior to the end of your session (in this case, 20 minutes), please mark your emails as "Importance: High" and I will do my best to address the issue prior to the patient leaving. Thanks
-----Original Message----- From: H Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 12:57 PM To: monster Cc: monsters supervisor Subject: FW:
Since I received no response back regarding this e-mail can I assume that you will contact P by phone?
From: DD (H) Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 10:39 AM To: DK (monster) Subject:
I am presently meeting with P.. She is wondering if she can take (a med) with out interfering with her other medications. She is also complaining of tremors with the increased --. Her PCP said she was to mention this to medical staff. I don’t know if you would like to call her later, e-mail something back before the session ends or visit with her before she leaves. TKs D
Dang, what do you all make of this?????? It kind of concerns me that H is set off by her so easily, now I havent heard back from him since I responded, told him I got the impression she was baiting him, but didnt know if it was worth bothering with....
Jeez, Deb - doesn't your H have a clue how these things work??????? He should NOT be having these convos with monster in print!!!!! She'll end up filing a sexual harassment lawsuit against him if he's not careful. (And yes, the "poor woman" is presumed to be the victim in these cases!).
Let me break this down, so maybe you can explain it to him (and my H was forced to go to an anger management class by his work just because he called a woman into his office who had done something sneaky and underhanded against him, and asked her why she did it. You'd have to know my H, but he's the least threatening man, soft-spoken even when angry. But people know how to work the HR system, they run to file a complaint over the least little thing to protect their behinds, then the person complained against - especially a man - is forever suspect).
So - here's my analysis:
Quote: -----Original Message----- From: H Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 12:57 PM To: monster Cc: monsters supervisor Subject: FW:
Since I received no response back regarding this e-mail can I assume that you will contact P by phone?
The way I see it, your H threw the first stone by cc ing this to the supervisor. Looks like a deliberate attempt to get her in trouble. And jeez, people don't always answer their email that promptly. A nicer way to say this would have been to email: "Since I haven't heard back from you yet, I told the patient you would call her."
Quote: From: monster Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:44 PM To: H Cc: monsters supervisor Subject: RE:
Yes, I will call her and address her issues w/ her medication. I did not see where you marked your email as "Importance: High" so it was view along w/ my other emails in the order they came. When you are needing a response prior to the end of your session (in this case, 20 minutes), please mark your emails as "Importance: High" and I will do my best to address the issue prior to the patient leaving. Thanks
Sounds to me like she gave him an entirely appropriate and professional response. She likes urgent emails to be so marked. She will respond more quickly if emails are marked this way. Seems entirely logical and appropriate to me, and I guarantee you, it will seem that way to her supervisor too.
Quote: From: H Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 1:58 PM To: monster Subject: RE: Importance: High
Please; I don’t want or need a lecture from you for your inattention. I’m sick of your excuses, personal and or professional. I just want a response from you so that I know my client’s needs are being addressed. Calling her later today is fine. I just need to know that you are acting on the e-mail, if I don’t hear from you I can only assume you are not and so I e-mail (supervisor) as well. Funny,(supervisor) responds to my e-mails in a timely manner, even though not marked “High Importance”.
H goes off the deep end here. His response is completely inappropriate. She was professional, he gets personal - and notice, he didn't cc THIS to her supervisor - because he knows it isn't appropriate. He should never write anything he doesn't want the administration to see - I guarantee you she probably forwarded this to her supervisor as evidence of how he is "harassing" her.
I suspect his reaction was so emotional because she answered him so aloofly -
And your H is an idiot to threaten taking this to HR. Their only concern is with not getting sued - and they pretty well know he'd have no case for harassment against her, sad though that may be, but that SHE would have a pretty good chance against him (poor innocent girl, seduced and then harassed). This was a hard lesson for my H to learn - that even though it was a couple of women in his office who were harassing HIM, he was only reacting to their harassment, but because he was a male and their superior, as soon as they made a complaint, he was seen as guilty and a legal liability in the eyes of HR.
Another thing your H needs to know - he should NOT type ANYTHING on a work computer - even emails to you - that he wouldn't want administration to read. A lot of businesses now have keystroke-logger type programs so they can theoretically read everything you type.
Educate him, Deb. He's gonna get into a world of trouble if he doesn't stop this.
I've got to agree with kml on this one. Gently guide your husband or he could end up short stick. My impression is that this walking cancer (Monster) might still have a card up her sleeve, which doesn't need to be real, just implied. We are a society that buys into the poor, poor ____ story.
It's time to make that Monster a non-factor. It sounds like H has grown extemely tired of her and is now focused on you. Great, quite dragging in the dead dog, and focus on your R. You both seem committed to it, so enjoy each other and build. If your husband has to keep proving himself to you by slamming Monster, this will cause ongoing attention to her, which is what you don't want. Right?
Hi! Deb. Sorry, don't have any advice on the email issue. Just want to thank you for giving the invaluable advice on my sitch. I really do hope that the fog on my H will lift soon. I know the ride will not be a smooth one even if that happens. There is still so much more hard work that needs to be accomplished to get to where I want it too. Thanks again!!
