Still trying....

[Jet]

JV,

Your last posts reveals a stronger conviction than the one previous to it. I sensed some doubt from that post and as a result I posed those rhetorical questions.

Families often will look at a situation and speculate on the effects divorce will have on them. Perhaps your mother is intentionally attempting to guide you to help her cope with some underlying fears. Some probing questions about her feelings might reveal what these are.

I continue to admire your strength and courage. Will be back to listen to how these conversations went.

Take Care!

Jet

[ValerieA]

Hello again, Jet. I think I know why it's so important to my mother for H and me to reconcile because I felt this way myself -- we believed it would be beneficial for the kids' sake...for their future and well-being...if we stayed together.

My oldest sister T's kids (she has a D18, a S17, and another S15) are dropouts and "flunkies" -- I hate to say that because I was one, too. My sister P has had the same problems with two of her children -- D17 and S14 -- and my sister J had trouble with her S17, but luckily, he seems to be straightening up. All of these kids don't have their fathers around. They go to visit with them from time to time, but their dads weren't in their day-to-day lives.....just like my biological father. I haven't seen or heard from him since I was about 5 or 6 years old.

My mom believes the reason why my nieces and nephews (and myself) have had their problems is due to the fact of not having the father in the picture. It makes sense to me. H and I used to talk about this stuff. He would actually be the one to bring it up. He once said, "You know why they're so messed up, don't you?....It's because their dads aren't around. Look at our kids, look at XXXXX (P's D4), and look at XXXXXXXXX (J's D12). What's the difference between them and the rest of your nieces and nephews?.....They have Mom and Dad TOGETHER, and the others don't. They have stability, and the others don't."

So.....I feel like I'm being told to "stay together for the kids". I love my boys so much......but should I stay with their father for their happiness? For H's happiness because NOW he says he doesn't want to break up the family?

What about MY happiness? What about what's right for ME?

I want my children to be happy and to have a good life. I want them to know and understand the importance of having a good education -- I talk to them about this at least 4 or 5 times every month. Not EVERYDAY like it was done to me (I felt that ='ed pressure). Is this something that's not possible if H and I don't stay together?

In the beginning of this mess, H said he only wanted to stay together for the sake of the boys, and I agreed....but back then, I would've agreed to anything if it meant that H wasn't going to leave me.....but now, I don't feel the same anymore. I want the best for my children, but that's not going to happen if they have a miserable mother, and that is what I'll be if I continue this M to their father.

I've been happy lately. VERY happy. The thought of H being back in this house with me does not make me happy.

(Sigh)...We had our talk. I'll post later about it. Gotta start dinner.

Thanks for listening.

JV

"I can't change the direction of the wind, but I can adjust my sails to always reach my destination."

[ValerieA]

Well, there's not much to add to today's R talk. It was more or less the same as yesterday's.

H said to just give him another chance, and I told him I had. Many times already....and I'm not talking about the last 7 1/2 months. I'm talking about over the last several years.

Just more begging, pleading, etc, etc from him all afternoon. He must have said "ILY" about 20 times throughout our talk, and he asked if I still cared about him. I told him yes, I do. I can't just stop feeling for him, if that's what he was thinking, but I don't have that "love" for him anymore.

OMG, this is sooooo.....what's the word I'm looking for???.....Has this ever happened before? Where the LBS turns into the WAS?

Anyway, there were moments where I felt like he was trying to manipulate me with flirting, but I wasn't falling for it. H kept asking if I still found him attractive. I told him yes, he's a good-looking guy, but when I look at or think about him now, I don't feel it anymore. I used to when he was away on his long trips, etc, but not anymore. Then he tried to get a little further, if you know what I mean , but I said no. It wasn't going to happen. I didn't want it anymore.

H left to pick up the kids from school then came back. We talked a bit more, and he asked me again to just give him the chance to fix everything. I told him "you can't". I told him he can't fix it. He can't make it better. He can be the sweetest he's ever been, the nicest, the most loving, blah blah blah....it doesn't matter anymore. He can't fix it. I can never look at him the same way again. I can never feel the same way about him again. Never again.

H began crying and said he couldn't believe I was saying all this to him. I told him I could hardly believe it myself, but I've done a LOT of growing up inside, and now I know what is right for me. This R is NOT right for me, and probably not for him either.

H asked if we could go away next weekend -- just the two of us. I looked at him like he was crazy. Didn't he hear a single word of what I just said to him??!!! He said, "Don't give me an answer right now. Just let me think for a while that you might say yes please....but if you say yes, I guarantee we'll have a great time together...and no gambling. I promise. I don't want to do that either. I just want to go away and be with you, JV. You're all I ever think about every day and every night. ILY more than anything or anyone else. Please just think about it."

I just kept quiet and didn't give him an answer.....I really don't want to go with him.

More hugs and "attempted" kisses on his part throughout the convo. Lots more. He finally left and took S9 and S6 to MIL's for the night.

I need a break from him for a while. I'm not calling him. I haven't been. It's been all H for the last month. He just shows up when he wants and calls when he wants. I've asked him not to, but that's how well he listens.

Alright. Time for the baby to get to bed. That's all for now, so thanks for listening.

JV

"I can't change the direction of the wind, but I can adjust my sails to always reach my destination."

[dodgermf]

Just more begging, pleading, etc, etc from him all afternoon.

JV,

You know there's this book I read awhile ago that your H might be interested in reading. It says that begging and pleading is exactly what you SHOULDN'T do if you are trying to get your spouse back. I forget the title but it has something to do with "Busting A Divorce" or "A Remedy For Divorce". I'm sure if you did a Google search, you could find it ...

Seriously, if you are really at that place where you are done (and people, I'm not saying that's where she should be, it is her decision) then stick to your guns. I've said it before but you've sure grown in the last 5 weeks or so and I'd hate to see you backslide.

Damn, that book talks about backsliding too. I wish I could remember the name of it ...

JV, be strong Sacto girl!!!

DMF

[Scottisheart]

Hey JV. First thing. Thank you for going back to school! You making that decision was the catalyst for me doing the same. You inspired me and I thought "I can do that too!". This past Tuesday I signed up for the first two courses leading to a Web Design certificate. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Secondly, ((((((((((((JV)))))))))))). I know that the decision not to have your H back wasn't made easily. Your sitch has been anything but easy and I really do applaud you for having the strength to do what you have done. Now, having said that (yes there is a "but") I thought I'd throw out another possibility....and I say this only because I suffered with this and didn't even know it.....is there any possibility that maybe you could have post-partum depression? Let me try to explain myself - if I can. After I had S3 I thought I was fine. I carried on "as usual", Happy Scotti! but looking back I know I wasn't fine and I wasn't happy. Because I wasn't "well" my M suffered big time and I believe that is part of the reason I'm here on the BB. Your sitch has been going on for a long time and having a baby on top of everything else isn't easy. I'm just saying that maybe it might be a good idea to speak to your GP. Geeeeeezzzzzzzzzz, I'm really not sure I'm getting across what I mean.......I just want you to be ok JV, with you, with H and with any decisions you make. I know I could most definitely be WAY off but it was just something that occured to me and I hope you don't take it the wrong way. I guess I just want you to be very sure. You've worked so hard at DBing and inspired so many of us.

[sigh] I hope this all made sense. Take care of yourself. Please understand that I'm not pointing fingers or suggesting that you are making a bad decision. Only JV knows what's best for JV.

BTW, dodgermf, seems to me I've seen that book too...

Cheers, Scottisheart

[Hopeful_Future]

JV - You have to do what's right for you or you'll never be happy. Either way, you are a strong woman and I know you'll do what's best. *huge hugs*

[BeingMe]

JV, with my first M, I just knew when it was over, after giving my XH so many chances. He, too, was abusive, physically and emotionally. However, I am a strong person, and after 3 years of giving him many chances, decided, enough was enough. I also got the begging, and promises of change, but nothing could dissuade me. It is the best thing I have ever done. Abusers never change, unless they actively seek to change with professional help. They destroy any respect, and love you have and then think that a few kind words and tears are going to turn you into mush, when you in actuality have finally seen the light.

If you have truly decided it is over, then stick to your guns. Your children will not benefit from growing up with their father disrespecting their mother to the level of abuse. Perhaps, once you are D'ed, he may find the help he needs, and then you can re-evaluate if you want, although that did not happen in my case.

Although my present H has put me through a lot, I know that he is a good man who temporarily lost his way. We have had 20 mostly good years, so I feel he deserves a second chance.

So, my advice, stick with what your gut is telling you. Ultimately, you only have yourself to rely on. Family and friends are great, but they are not the ones that have to finally live with the decision.

Good luck, whatever path you take.

[ValerieA]

Hello, everyone .

D -- You're the greatest ! You're just too funny, and you always manage to bring more smiles into my day !

Scotti -- Your welcome ! Actually, I can't take all the credit. Many on this board are responsible for inspiring me into making this decision for myself. I follow many sitches and have found my way a little in each and every one of them. To me, it truly is all about GAL and doing for YOU .

I think I get what you're saying about postpartum depression. I honestly don't think that I am, but I'm sure it wouldn't hurt to talk with my doctor about it. Thanks, Scotti , and I don't feel you're pointing any fingers at all. Believe me, I can tell when somebody really is .

Hopeful -- Thank you so much. This is a BIG decision. One of the BIGGEST I've ever had to make. It's not easy to say the least....but it's right. It's right for me. Sometimes I doubt myself, and I don't feel very strong because of it, but I know this is the way. I think that doubt is just a fear. The fear I've had for a long time of being alone...of being without someone...but I'm slowly overcoming it. Little by little.

BeingMe -- I'm very sorry to hear that you had to endure such a R. I know what kind of he** I've been through, and I couldn't even begin to imagine what it must have been like to also have had the physical part in there, too.

Bravo, BeingMe. I applaud you for having the strength and courage to get out of that M. You are indeed a very strong woman.

You are so right about their crying and apologies. Their promises of not ever doing and/or saying the bad things again...and again...and again. I have finally reached that point where it all means nothing to me anymore...where I just don't believe him. Period.

Right again about my boys. I know they had to have heard H when he would go off on me, so I'm sure they heard their mother being called a b**** many, many times. Sometimes they don't listen to me very well, and I can see a little bit of attitude in them when I tell them to straighten up. With H out of the house these past 2 months, it has been somewhat easier......I certainly do not want my sons to treat their Ws or GFs the way their father has me, his mother, and even his sister. It's very sad....any female who gets to him is just a b**** or a stupid, f***ing idiot....I just don't get it. He REALLY needs help, and hopefully, he can someday see that.

Thanks again to each and every one of you . I will stick to my guns, I will follow my gut feeling, and I will listen to my heart because I know it's right.

Alrighty then.....Today is the baby's birthday ! He is now S1 ! He will be going for his first haircut this afternoon -- oh boy ! That should be fun !

Busy weekend ahead. Tomorrow my family is getting together to celebrate S6 and S1's birthdays then on Sunday it will be H's family. I was originally going to have one big party, but the more H and I talked about it, the more we thought this would be the best way. We'd like to avoid any and all possible "drama" between the two families . Lord knows I've had enough .

Again, I thank you all for the TREMENDOUS amount of support you give me . You are all TERRIFIC people ! Have a great weekend!

Thanks for listening.

JV

"I can't change the direction of the wind, but I can adjust my sails to always reach my destination."

[ValerieA]

I wanted to post this yesterday but didn't get the chance. I sometimes read my horoscope, and I did yesterday. What I read.....well I found it to be very interesting .

You have a tendency to try and accommodate everyone else in your life and not take care of your own needs, which leads to suppressed resentment. Why not break new ground and refuse to put your own needs last?

Hmmmm.....

JV

"I can't change the direction of the wind, but I can adjust my sails to always reach my destination."

[OCKim]

Hi JV...

Thank you SO much for the compliment on my thread!
I have always felt that your H's comments to you when he chose to put you and your abilities down sounded pretty juvenile. My H was known to belittle my interactions with my stepchildren down...
So, I asked myself when he was doing this to me: "How does it make me feel?"... "Do I feel supported?"...
Both with respect to me as an individual and with respect to my ability to help parent his children.
"Do I feel respected?"... "Do I feel that he trusts me to make decisions about life?"...
To be honest, he did NOT suppport my relationship with his kids... He was threatened by it...
He would put my abilities down and even question my ability to help him parent. I find myself asking if he was supportive of me. That is a big requirement for me.
When and IF I do ever get involved in another relationship, I will NOT even consider going out with someone that belittles me.
If it does not feel right, if I do not feel good about myself in the relationship... it probably is NOT "the one".
I know far more what is right for me than I realize.

So... ask YOURSELF the following questions:
*Did YOU feel supported by your husband?
*Did YOU feel respected by your husband?

IF the answer is NO... why is it then that we can still miss our husbands and the friendship we once shared together? I know that it is SO easy to get overwhelmed.
But, hopefully it will all fall into place eventually...

JV... You continue to be in my thoughts!
Have a wonderful weekend!!! -KIM