Thank you for the advice. My DB coach has given me similar advice. Funny thing is I always forget when the moment arises... Next time, I think I will go to the bathroom and silently scream into a towel.
I wish my H would see OW for the losefest that she is. No such luck. We have to attend a wedding that she is also attending late September. That should be interesting. I actually found the last face-to-face encounter with her to be pretty revealing about where she is mentally, etc. I'm trying to use the wedding also as the stick to get me back into going to the gym on a regular basis. Nothing crazy, just putting some fire under my a**. Also, I will have been meditating all morning at a Zen retreat so that should help with my PMA, I hope.
My H says the same thing about OW. That he spent so much time with her because theor R was easy, whereas as he puts it "nothing about you and I is easy." I see this actually as a good thing.
You are right, my going to H for validation needs to end. I'm working on this separate of my DBing through therapy and attending Al-Anon meetings. I'm finding both to be very helpful but the work itself is hard and pretty painful. It's many, many years of abuse and low self-esteem that I am undoing.
I think I'm going to send my H an email about last night. A more detailed explination of why I acted as I did. My H seems to like that.
I've come to the realization (yet again!) that I am trying to do this all in one shot and way too quickly. My Dbing hasn't been consistent and I haven't set down concrete, doable goals for myself. I'm going back to the drawing board and letting go, letting go, letting go....
Did some good DBing last night both for myself and H. Spent some time by myself to work on some freelance projects. I know this isn't like a night on the town or anything but it was just as good to spend several hours by myself quietly working and actively NOT thinking about my sitch.
I apologized to H for a convo I had with him last weekend where I "jokingly" said that I wished he was more forthcoming to the public about how much he enjoys being with me. This is another extension of how I criticize H for talking the talk but following up with actions. Right or wrong, it is a fact that H talks a lot but doesn't have much follow through.
This is a sore point for H because he is intimidated by me and that I do everything I set out to do. H is insecure about it and my convo about being more forthcoming about his M or love for me(born out of my insecurities because he won't say this to people like OW) obviously compounded the problem.
I apologized to H last night because I had remembered a really beautiful post he wrote about me on his one blog (although not the one OW is on). I told him I was very sorry and that I do know that he loves me and is forthcoming.
I realize that he is trying to move forward and that he would most likely continue in that direction (I hope!) if he were encouraged and not criticized.
Anyway, I seem to miss the mark big time sometimes with DBing but am very good at repairing the damage. I hope that by making these changes, I can start to move our R forward and away from the lingering bull***t of OW and our other problems.
Had a very long and relaxing weekend with H. Coming back to the city is soo hard! I love being around H and how we are when we are relaxed. Then it's back to our real lives and responsibilities.
I had a MAJOR realization today. A personal project I'm spearheading took a bad turn today. Work-work and personal life have been pretty stressful this past year. My personal projects are my sanity or so I thought.
The issue with my personal project isn't entirely my fault but I am to blame for some of the problem. With everything else compounded in my sitch and my life, I was devastated by the news and was this close to becoming a WAW myself!
First instinct was to go to H for him to comfort me and tell me that I will be ok. Reasonable enough, right? That's what spouses do. Howeever the realization is this- I have serious self-esteem issues. My dad was pretty emotionally and verbally abusive ( something he picked up from his Dad). Well this has lead me to place a lot of my emotional self-worth onto my Rs with men.
In the beginning of my R with H I thought that this time it is different. However, I'm finally becoming aware of these deeprooted problems in my M. I finally realize this may be why my H says that he is always afraid to disappoint me.
I constantly take on things with every good intention in mind but I don't take the time to think what they might really need or what I may or may not be able to bring to it. I finally realize that I look to these situations to provide me with a sense of self-worth and when it blows up, it only confirms my already existing negative feelings.
In fact, I see that I often perpetuate these cycles of seeking out approval and then dashing my own hopes because that is what I am familiar with!!! I need to find a way to be able to break this cycle. This is something I CANNOT do with H's help. It just took my R with H to finally see this for what it is.
I'm scared that I won't be able to have an R with my H. I'm afraid that we are both hardwired for some pretty self-destructive ways of life. I feel like I am doing a lot of work and some days I can't see how our R will work out.
I don't see my H doing this kind of self-exploration at all.
I had a conversation with my friend this afternoon and we discussed how my H, in all likelihood, needs to have the attention of myself and OW. That he isn't even aware of the need to have this, the support it provides him, the control it gives him within our R. (H and I are both control freaks) How can we possibly move past this while still being in an R together? Isn't this something that really needs to be done alone?
Oh Sikan.. what a post. Glad though that you had a good time with H! You mustve read my self fullfilling profesy comment in my recent post
Hardwired.. and yet you found each other. There is a reason that we are attracted to certain people. By your relationship with H, if you are able to weed out the habits and attitudes that aren't healthy you're making personal progress. I feel the same as you much of the time.. you could we ever make this work? It's just too big. Im too co-dependent and so is he. Im too controlling and he's too passive. Im too angry and he's a feeling-stuffer. He likes to manipulate me and I like to nurture and fix. It goes on and on and on.
We can only work on ourselves and see what happens. Admitting what the problem is will help. Seeing what needs to be changed can be turned into goals and with work, progress. Good for you realizing some things you want to improve about youself! If you can look at what you just wrote.. can you set some goals in order to start changing the behavior? If you are constantly taking on things and not realizing that you might not be able to accomplish it.. how can you avoid that in the future. And, what can you substitute for those projects that will give you a sense of accomplishment and self-worth?
Thanks for stopping by. I just had another lightbulb go off. I realize one of the reasons why H and I are so relaxed when away is because he and I are together all the time and that makes me relaxed because I have him and his attention and focus and there are no distractions, OW, work, etc.. to keep him away or distant. So, when I am relaxed I don't bring up R talks or have R talks in my head (me being quiet and distant). So although this is an unrealistic ideal, it does have elements of what we are striving for at the very least how we would like to feel around each other.
This stage of DBing is very hard. Most of the work is on the LBS and patience is key. I'm confused. I don't know if my DBing is helping to move things forward or keeping them the same.
Piglet, you are right. I do need to set out some goals for myself both longterm and shortterm. I got the KLA tapes as part of signing on for 3 counseling sessions. It came with a workbook which looks like it should be helpful for me to write them down and refer back to when needed.
Still working to develop trust with H. Last night, he asked me to come keep him company at his office. I used to visit him alot at his old office but that changed when he moved into this new place.
When he told me he was working late, I thought it might be a way for him to hang out with OW. Work was an excuse he used a lot to cover up the fact he was spending time with her. I partly feel guilty that I am still so very suspicious but when I really think about it, it's going to be a long time before the trust is firm between us again.
It was nice to meet up with him and catch a late meal. H is in the process of putting together material to send out with his resume for new jobs. H even had me look at his cover letter yesterday for my feedback. This is a huge difference from last June, when he applied to a job (one that I had found for him in a location where I wanted to move) with the most disturbing cover letter I had ever read. The letter should have been a serious warning bell but I didn't see it that way. I was more disappointed that he wasn't where I wanted him or our life to be.
What a huge difference now! I still forward H jobs, because I like to do that. It's part of my personality. I forward everyone I know jobs I think they would like or would be good at. But now, I work very hard at backing off from pushing H to apply. I'll nudge but at a normal level.
So, I'm plugging away. Minor triumph for myself with OW. I used to obsessively look at her through postings online. She has a lot of things online. I used to look at pictures of her, read her postings, etc... I have completely stopped reading her postings with H and looking at her picture. I simply find it to be not worth my time. I finally am able to see that it doesn't matter anyway and staring at her unattractive face isn't changing the sitch at all. It's kind of like when I quit smoking. Sure I have the urge every now and again but when I actually think about putting one into my mouth I become physically ill.
I think I'm starting to move past her, which is necessary. The work lies between H and I, she's just a variable.
H and I have a good weekend planned. We are staying in town and have some loose plans, maybe a movie or a club on Saturday. Sunday, H said he wanted to hang out with a friend. I'm not going to stress if it is with OW. I have plenty of other things to do and will act very much "as if" when and if he hangs out with friend.
The weekend was very nice and relaxed. H and I had a talk on Sunday during our walk about how we need to continue to actively keep our weekends loose and open. It does so much in keeping our stress levels down.
On Sunday, H and I went into his office so that he could send out resumes. I told him I would keep him company and do some work. He sent out 15 applications! I told him later that I was really proud of him and that I though his portfolio looks excellent. He was happy to get it done and over with. His workload was making it hard for him to send out things during the week and I also suspect that he was insecure about taking the first step and applying at a new company.
Minor DB triumph for me. My DB coach has suggested that in order for me and H to be able to address OW topic, I cannot react in a way that will make my H not want to talk about things. Of course, it is the most normal way one would react to that sitch- getting upset at H and OW. But in order for me to open that door again, I need to let H see that I can discuss this without blowing it out of proportion, letting my emotions get the best of me or judging H. So on Sunday while in H's office, I notice soem postcards on his wall. I asked where did he get them? He said, "Oh, OW sent them to me when she went away." I calmly said Oh and then without missing a beat talked about something else. As if he had said that his sister or someone like that had sent them to him.
I hate the fact that there are no pictures of me in his office and that there are two pics OW took plus her postcard up on his walls but I'm after bigger things and this is a battle I needed to pass over.
I'm struggling with the fact that although many things are good between us, I still see aspects of my H that concern me as much sometimes more than OW sitch. For instance, he is incredibly negative in his thinking, depending on his stress levels more times than not. He is also very insecure. We went to see a farm demo this weekend, run by people close to us in age. H made wisecracks during presentations that were pretty inappropriate also he wouldn't stand near anyone. He made me stand away from everyone with him.
I'm afraid sometimes that these are permanent parts of his personality and can set the stage for things like OW sitch to occur. I'm trying to find the words to describe an example. I think that OW is attracted to H because H has a similar "I'm pissed at the world" attitude but unlike the rest of those people that share that kind of negative thinking, H actually thinks very much about the world in a very constructive way. H is very smart and talented. However, I have long suspected that H gets a lot of his positive, proactive ways from my influence in his life. In fact, most of his changes for the better (his addressing his alcoholism, his looking for new work, his addressing his longstanding personality issues) have come about while he has been with me.
People like OW see H as (she has described him more than once) the amazing one or a real man. To someone like OW, who obviously isn't particularly evolved, I see how that could be the case.
I guess where I am going with all of this is that there is still a very big part of me, (in spite of all of the changes) that is still very concerned with the fact that H is a negative and insecure person and I sometimes think that no amount of DBing will change that.
What do you other DBers think? I don't want anyone to think that I am not happy with the changes in my sitch, I very much am. But I want to know that I am not crazy for being fearful about this.
I calmly said Oh and then without missing a beat talked about something else. As if he had said that his sister or someone like that had sent them to him.
Great DBing! Im going to have to practice that "Oh" and use it! I always learn something from you Sikan. H and I have been discussing the significance we place on things in our life. Basically, I make OW more important than he does or ever has. We're the women that they want to spend the rest of their life with.. so the "Oh" is definately enough attention to OW on our part!
I'm struggling with the fact that although many things are good between us, I still see aspects of my H that concern me as much sometimes more than OW sitch. I understand that. Our pastor said a few months ago "he can get help and change, but there will always be part of J's personality that he cant change. Can you accept that?" Ive thought a lot about that. And about H telling me that he does need my approval and acceptance. Why do we focus on the negative times and give them more weight than the positive? Is it because we've seen the past and want to be prepared for the future? H said that he was attracted to OW because she didnt know his faults and he didnt have to deal with them. I've been asking myself more and more "Could I live with me?" When my H is with me, do I encourage him, or am I a mirror of his faults constantly? Could I live with that? I couldnt.. it would be frustrating to try and know I need to change, and to see that reflected in the person I love the most.. never good enough. So, I'm wondering if we cling to the positive changes.. the good moments and accept that they'll be a part of our future, wouldn't it be easier to get through the bad times and realise good things are ahead? Why must we get through the good times, waiting on bad times ahead? Just some thoughts. Visit my thread soon and you'll see the chaos I created today by counting on my H's faults to shine through.
I think it's natural to fear. As long as we don't let fear control our lives. Me and H are there right now.. fear controlling us. We need to break free from that. That's one of my near term goals. To count positive in the day. My D11 used to come home moaning and groaning about every little thing that went wrong. I had her start journalling and listing all of her blessings. I told her that she only had room in her day for a couple of bad things so just write down the top two or three and spend the rest of her time counting the good. A couple of weeks of that and she stopped complaining and journalling. She either realized she has a blessed life, or she got tired of writing! I could take a lesson from that myself. Focus on the positive and only let the negative have so much room in my life. 20 minutes a day. I bet I could cover it in that amount of time.. I mostly just turn the bad over and over and dwell on it anyhow.
I didnt mean to ramble on your thread. I just wanted to encourage you (and me!) to accept the good things... the nice, relaxing weekend. The work you accomplished and your mega-DB moment.. give the bad thoughts just a tiny bit of time, and remind me to do the same!
How did the loosely planned weekend go?