From reading here on the BB, I guess there are numerous answers to that question, at least in the HD spouse's mind. Low hormones, no hormones, tired, lazy, crazy, nasty, bitchy... take your pick. I've read them all, and I guess I don't see anyone really 'getting it'.
See, for me (and probably many, many others), there just isn't a reason. It just 'is'... like your shoe size or hair color. I'm not thinking of sex all the time because I'm not, and whether it has to do with hormones or feeling unappreciated matters not. I can wear shoes that are a bit too small for me, or dye my hair a different color, but it all boils down to one thing, I still have size 7 feet and brown hair. Trying to change that is as futile as trying to become HD.
I'm certain that there are women out there that have managed to reprogram their heads to be HD (we have a couple here I believe), but I suspect the majority of us will always be LD. Does that mean we'll never lead a satisfying life (read: sex life) with our husbands? Gosh, I hope not! I do try very hard to keep up my end of the 'bargain', but that where it gets tricky. If I stop thinking about it, I stop doing it.
I'm certainly not trying to say that none of you HD individuals has any hope of a satisfying sex life. To the contrary, actually! But I read so many posts about the fact that desire is so important to ML, and to be honest, I don't always have desire. Not in the way that you HDs would like it to exist. I desire to make my H happy, and I desire all the things that come to me as a result of a good SL, but true desire, that thing that intrudes on your conscious, that wakes you out of sleep, that makes it hard to concentrate on your job, that doesn't exist for me in that way.
I often feel better after a couple of days of sex, and find that my thoughts are drawn to sex more often then, but again if there is a break in the 'action', then those thoughts fade away. It's really an 'out of sight, out of mind' sort of thing, whereas I believe for the HD individual, it's more on a cellular level. A true 'need' if you like.
We're not this way out of choice, nor are we trying to punish you. It's not because we love you less, or are less committed to your happiness. We don't want you to suffer, nor do we want your every day to revolve around the fact that you didn't get to ML the night before. We didn't hide this fact when you dated us, no 'bait and switch' was executed. We just are... like size 7 feet and brown hair.
Not sure what I'm trying to say in this post, but I did want to give some insight into my experiences as a LD woman, in case it helps someone understand their spouse. I'm also not speaking for all LD's, but I suspect there are more like me out there.
I have found that too, the thoughts are just not there. Too many other things to think about regarding running the house, kids, work etc. I don't consciously think about these things NOT to think about sex either.
Sex is not a need it is a want. Sure it's a need for the survival of the species but for the individual it is not. You won't die without it. Some of us just don't have that physical desire to be bunny rabbits. For the sake of my marriage I'm gonna try and find some though!
Thanks for your insights. I'm sure most of what you say is true -- and I was with you most of the way -- until you got to the "bait and switch" part. It is PRECISELY the "bait-and-switch" that has many HDs suffering. There are some exceptions, where I'll read a post where the HD says "I should have seen it coming..." or "there were some early warning signs ...", etc., but most of us did NOT see a lack of sexual desire in our partners when we were dating them, or even earlier in our marriage.
Ever play that game when you were a kid? The "if you HAD to be blind, would it be better to have ALWAYS been blind (so you wouldn't know what you were missing), or to have BECOME blind at some point" (so that the visual memories of beauty and of your loves ones' faces were forever etched in your brain).
I never could answer that one, but I'm sure leanin' toward thinking it's the former . . . at least for me.
I can't answer for everyone, but for me, it was not a case of 'bait and switch'! In the early days I did have desire, and I did want sex more. I just don't know what happened to it.
I truly believe that this is the case for a great number of us LD people, even if it is difficult to believe. Why would we intentionally marry someone with a HD knowing we would have to 'put them off' for the entire marriage? Wouldn't it make more sense to marry someone who matched us sexually???
Jen, Great to see you back. Have you been catching up on threads lately? You may want to read Lillie's "Schnarch on Steroids" thread. I found it most helpful.
I don't mind the sun sometime
The images it shows
I can taste you on my lips
And smell you in my clothes
Cinnamon and Sugar
And softly spoken lies
You never know just how you look
Through someone elses eyes
BHS-"Pepper"
I can't answer for everyone, but for me, it was not a case of 'bait and switch'! In the early days I did have desire, and I did want sex more. I just don't know what happened to it.
In the early days I to had desire and wanted sex more. It was all much easier then. It was carefree in aspects. Then life and all its ups and downs twist and turns Sucesses and failures and responsiblity came along and stomped out the fire of desire. And want of sex dwindled as my thoughts of it did Why? Having sex was put on the chore list right below vacuming and above sorting the socks out. Sex became a responsibility of being the wife. The same as changing a dirty diaper was of being a mother. Sex did not seem as important as getting up with the baby in the middle of the night. Sex did not seem as important as sitting up and watching a disney movie for the 80th time with your child. Sex did not seem as important as the housework that needed to be done after the kids went to bed. Sex did not seem as important as sleep after two days staight of vomitting,feverish,wailing kids. Sex did not seem as important as getting the kids school cloths washed and H uniforms cleaned for the next day after working 10 hours. Sex did not seem as important as sitting up worrying about your 16 year who is not home yet. Sex did not seem as important as a late night phone call from your child away on vacation wanting to tell you what they did that day. Sex did not seem as important as sitting down and writting that letter to your grandmother while all was quite to thank her for the $20.00 she sent you and tell her how much you missed her. Sex did not seem as important as taking that long bubble bath to relax and gather your thoughts after a long day of yard work followed by making dinner. Bathing the kids and doing laundry and finishing the project that you did not get done at work. This list could go on forever. So that is why I no longer have much desire.
All of those things say to me that you feel that they are all more important than giving your husband what HE needs, at least from time to time.
At any given moment, any ONE of these things may indeed me the most important thing to be done. But OVER TIME, to continue to do ALL of these things, and put off speaking to a spouse in their primary love language, says to the spouse "You are last on my priority list."
I'm sorry if that sounds crude, but that's how many of us feel.
Quote: At any given moment, any ONE of these things may indeed me the most important thing to be done. But OVER TIME, to continue to do ALL of these things, and put off speaking to a spouse in their primary love language, says to the spouse "You are last on my priority list."
Choc,
The job doesn't become the most important thing to do during our day, and it certainly doesn't mean that we have actually put sex on the bottom of our 'list' according to priority. What all these jobs/expectations do is destroy desire. It kills that part inside us that feels carefree, fun and sexy. It makes us feel like we are a machine with just too many jobs to do, and yes... sex just becomes another job at that point.
It's not a choice, and that is where I see so many HD individuals missing the point. We're not sitting there trying to add to our list of jobs! We're not hoping that the toilet overflows so that we can use that as an excuse to avoid sex! It is just a case of desire getting burried under expectations and other commitments that perhaps can't be put off at that moment. Or it gets burried under resentment and anger... difficult place to dig it out of at times.
Now, I'm not saying that folding socks cannot be put off for a bit, or that any job is more important than having sex with your spouse, but often it's not that you are actually replacing sex with another job. You are just too 'used up' to give any more.
I really find that when H encourages me to take time out to relax (tub with a glass of wine for example) that I can connect with the sexy side of me, and 'wash away' the mom side for a bit. But if I haven't had a moment for myself, I find it really difficult to 'switch gears' and so I tend to avoid it at that point. It will take way, WAY too much time to get in the mood and actually 'finish'! I usually also end up worrying that H is either getting tired, or that he is getting close to 'finishing' on his own, and then end up not enjoying it as much as I could be. Not exactly a great motivator!
I guess I wanted to help you understand that we aren't here trying to find reasons not to have sex. It's just not one of our LLs so that it becomes something we can go without in order to accomplish something that may actually fill our tanks in a different way(I actually love to see all the socks folded! Gives me great satisfaction!). I just don't have the need for large amounts of sex, so the motivation is not there.
are all more important than giving your husband what HE needs, at least from time to time.
No my H was never completely without. Sex has always existed in my marriage. There where times it was scarce maybe four times a month. But never without. These are just a partial list of the reasons why sex is not always utmost on my mind. Why sex does not cross my mind often spontaneously. And I have to be reminded of my H and his needs. Some of these things on my list made my responsibility to my children come before my H because they are not capable of taking care of themselves. Like there being sick or needing feed. Some are things I choose to put before my H. Like watching a movie with them. And see to me as wrong as it may sound to a HD. I feel I can have sex for the rest of my life. But my children are growing and soon will be gone. Every experience or event I pass up with them cannot be done later. Sorta like the handprint on the wall poem. So do I find it more important to do these things then have sex with my H oh yeah. My H and myself should have years after they are gone to be horny old folk with nothing else to do but @@ck. ALL I will have left daily after my children are gone are memories to cherish. And all they will have left of me when I die is memories of me. I want those memories to be something that they cherish and can look back on and know how much I loved them. I have never made any bones about the fact that my children are my biggest responsibility and my greatest loves. With the exception of God there is nothing that I feel as strongly about as my children. I would die for them. And can easily cry for lose of them in my daily life even though that is years to come for a couple of them.
On the flip side of my list my H could probably write a list just as endless of why his want to do this or that lacks now. And since this seems to be my primary love language would that not say he puts many things infront of my needs. His list would read something like this.
Fixing the leaky toliet does not seem as important to him as watching tv Fixing the deck rails does not seem as important as taking the kids fishing. Mowing the lawn does not seem as important as going to sons baseball games Putting his laundry up does not seem as important as taking a nap and on and on also.
So it is a case of what goes around comes around endless circle neither is meeting the others needs and putting this and that before the importance of there spouses needs. Neither partner in the R is blameless or solely to blame.
This is a really interesting and insightful thread. I think the point Jen and Chrissy are making is a good one-- and subtle. On another thread someone talked about how HD/LD becomes part of your definition of yourself. I think over the years, as Real Life intrudes, there are other things that at one time were part of our definition of ourselves-- maybe even a cherished part-- and they get shoved aside because there aren't enough hours in the day to keep all the parts of us fed and maintained.
Jen and Chrissy have expressed very well the way that the stuff you have to do every day to maintain a life can cause sex to get edged out.
But think of the other stuff that gets edged out, too-- stuff that you've let go of and probably haven't noticed because it doesn't affect your partner, so there's no one to remind you.
In our younger days (pre-responsibility), maybe we played the piano or sang, or played sports, loved to go to foreign movies or art galleries, maybe painted or wrote poetry. If someone asked us, "Tell me about yourself," maybe we said, "Well, I love to take long bike rides, I paint a little, I'm almost fluent in French," (and then we think, but don't say out loud: "I keep in shape, I know I'm attractive, and I'm GREAT in the sack!").
Over the years, responsibilities take over and the married/parent self starts to push out the other aspects of our self-definition. Don't get me wrong-- I think people welcome it. They love parenthood and they love their kids. But sometimes there isn't enough emotional energy to be everything we once thought we would/could be.
I don't know about y'all, but I remember looking at the older generation and saying to myself, "Well, that will never happen to me!" Meaning I would never lose my drive, optimism, idealism, and I would always be able to keep a strong sense of that Girl inside who at one time thought anything was possible. (And I'm part of the generation that had as its motto: "Don't trust anyone over 30!" )
Anyway, I wanted to validate what Jen and Chrissy were saying-- that it's not a case of deciding consciously that laundry is more important than sex, but that as we become immersed in adult life, there are other aspects of our younger, free-from-responsibility selves that we let go of, and no one notices. We dust the piano and remember the musical aspirations we once had. Or see the sports trophies from college on the mantle and laugh when we remember how we once thought that would become a career.
I'm not saying this is right-- just that it's understandable. In the case of sex, it is one way to stay in touch with that vibrant, passionate, adolescent who thought all things were possible. But first we have to become aware that we have let him/her slip away.
As Chrissy said, when the kids are gone, some couples reconnect and rediscover those more carefree emotional times. Ideally, that's what would happen, along with taking up the piano and painbrush again. But I think the connection with your partner sexually has to be maintained in some way or you won't be able to get back there.
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