JUST BEGINNING

[TSinAtlanta]

Also had OM wife not found out after 12 years would your wife had of ended this relationship?


I have thought of that, but can't see any point to going into what might of beens. The best I can hope for is moving forward, making sure our relationship is different from what it was before, more open, my bringing up things that bother me, which I do. The MC hasn't brought up the what might have been; he may think it is important, I don't know. So far it hasn't bothered me.

[Chrissy]

It does not bother you that the only reason your wife ended this relationship was she was caught not because she loved you and wanted what was best for you?
It sounds like your wife did not choose to end this the choice was made by OM to save his marriage. That does not bother you?

Your name should be Tsaint if you can truthfully say it does not.

[KimDownUnder]

TS - Just letting you know I am still lurking around and watching....I do feel Chrissy is touching on some good points, think about them a bit before answering....KDU

[TSinAtlanta]

Once again, we are seeing an MC who seems to know what he is doing. I don't specifically remember if I told my WS that if I find out that she has cheated again, then we are over, but I am sure she knows that that would at least cause us a great deal of trouble. I could, in the most non-confrontational way I can find (you all know here how diplomatic my manner is) repeat what I said above to her. That is about it. Worrying about what might have been or what might be, or what she was thinking or might have been thinking is a waste of time, as far as I'm concerned. All I can do is move forward and hope that my WS is as committed to the marriage as I am. If I find out different, then I am f*cked. But, again, that's a what if? As far as being saintly, we have sex just about every Sunday. We are looking for ways to make it closer or more exciting (fantasies, Tantric, etc.). I have several martinis every Friday and Saturday night. I am mean to our cats sometimes (well, she says I am; I think I am just teasing them). When we are in the Chancel Choir loft on Sunday, sometimes I find myself looking at the young women in a, I guess you could call it, with lust in my heart. What's saintly about that?

By the way, does anyone know what Eeyore type comments means?

[blackfoot]

Eeyore is a character from Winny the Pooh. He always has a negative outlook, the glass is less then half-full and anything that can go wrong will. He lets everyone around him know that. His physical demeanor is dejected.

I see you make comments like this. If you are generally like this, I am telling you - if female attraction were a poison this attitude is the antidote.

Chrissy has a lot of pertinent questions. They are hard to deal with and answer. I know because I brushed to many of them under the rug myself.


I have fought with this all my live ("You're supposed to be the macho man; you're supposed to be making the big bucks; you're supposed to drive the pickup truck and fight with other guys in the honky-tonks to prove your manhood; you need to be the football hero" - "This will attract the girls to you").

None of these things are necessary to appear strong, confidant, or earn respect. That comes from inside, feeling you have value, and demonstrating that by not allowing others to disrespect you. The things you gave as examples are caricatures, and outward manifestations of our societies perception of these qualities.

Now I have a question. Why do you fight this common belief? Why do you dislike the fact that the man should be the head of the house? That the women should be submissive to his lead?

I have a problem with it because I see so many men abuse this 'privelege', this biological imperitive to the detriment of the womans well being.

But that doesnt change the fact that it does exist and I have to 'play by the rules'. I can only do it to the best of my ability in a way that is good for both of us.

I messed up. I am paying for it, and so is x, though that is not my burden to carry.

[TSinAtlanta]

I messed up. I am paying for it, and so is x, though that is not my burden to carry.


You mean you messed up because you didn't act as the head of the household? X is your ex-wife? You should have been more dominant, because your x wanted it that way, and she told you that?

My WS makes more money than I (it is 60% her, 40% me). I don't feel comfortable making the important decisions about her money, and I think she would fight that anyway, and I don't want to fight about it anyway. So I guess if I don't act more dominant (your word), then I guess I am f*cked, since I don't want to and it doesn't feel right from inside of me, anyway.

You also said something about dominance/submission being proven by biology. One of your minions ("What BF means . . .") said you meant human biology, not general biology, so what human biology proves your point about male/female dominance/submission? Is it biology is destiny (man is on top during sex, therefore should always be dominant)? Is it men are traditionally hunters; women usually gatherers, homebuilders? Is it that men have more physical strength? That women are incapacitated 9 months during pregnancy? Or what? If human biology proves dominance/submission, it also proves the value of choices. In other words, as humans, we are aware of the existence of freedom of choice and of the future consequences, unlike most animals, I suppose. So, how does biology, human or otherwise, prove your dominance/submission theory?

[KimDownUnder]

Guys I do not understand why you both keep coming back to this ridiculous male V's Female thing. I think that could be one of the problems, who cares who is dominant, we now live in a world of freedom and equal rights. A relationship is made up of 2 partners - Partners being the word, meaning partnership that is 2 equal parts.

No one person needs to dominate another and if they do then they are the person with control issues. This goes for both sexes no one person needs to be dominant it is a partnership and you should be able to work together or else the R is doomed anyhow. There may be area's where one dominates but you should find that there is another area where the other one dominates.

Like a man is usually stronger than a woman, therefore they can do things a woman cant.....A woman is often gentler than a man so there are times that the womans gentleness can do that a man can't, not great examples but you should get my drift.

Again this is just my opinion but for what it is worth I would give up superior and inferior scenario's and go to trying to work as an equal in everything you do and you may find you have more luck.....KDU

[blackfoot]

Hey KDU.

I know your from the land down under and dont speak proper english and all, but what I discussed in another thread is not man vs woman. It is not about superior vs inferior. It is about differences. not better or worse.

This is a negative way of looking at it, and truthfully superior, inferior are not even synonyms to dominant and submissive.

As to why we keep coming back to it... not sure. It was a topic I directed at women, that TSinA agrees with me on, but does not want to have to deal with even though the ladies agreed with my view point. I havent decided if TSinA motive is confusion and wanting to understand for a better R or attempts to pick at me yet.

Well see.

[blackfoot]

I dont think calling someone my minion is a good way to get off on the right foot TSinA. I am not a king, I have no servants.

You pick on people and wonder where they all go. With this attitude I dont think I have anything to offer you.

I am not going to address your questions on biology, they are not going to help you with your sitch.

I will comment on your sitch.

My WS makes more money than I (it is 60% her, 40% me). So what? its both of your moneys, if you believe in the partnership you claim too. Does this bother you?

I don't feel comfortable making the important decisions about her money, If you made 100% of the money would this change? how about 75% your and 25% her. Why does who makes what percentage change anything. Is it in your head or hers?

and I think she would fight that anyway
do you think or know? has she ever fought you on it truly? or just made token resistance.

I don't want to fight about it anyway Under what circumstances do you want to fight? What do you argue about? Do you always give in to her? Do you ever put your foot down and say no. or jsut act passively aggressively.


So I guess if I don't act more dominant (your word), then I guess I am f*cked, since I don't want to and it doesn't feel right from inside of me, anyway.

Why dont you want to? What would feel right to you? Do things feel right currently? or do you feel out of control?

[blackfoot]

again