If you ever want to really know what the state of your marriage is, go to Disney World with two kids. We were there last week. Very hot, very crowded. Wife complained from the start about the crowds, son complained from the start about the heat and just wanting to go back to the hotel (he is 8). For the past 8 months, I have been trying to be more tolerant of others and not judging others because of what they do or the way they act. I guess this was just too much, because when she started up about the crowd and then my son started, then my wife started getting upset about him, it just started a meltdown. This is not the place to go if you have kids under the age of 11 or 12. Even the rides that they say are ok for kids above 48 inches are, in my opinion, dangerous. A kid freaked out on Mission Space when I got off of it. I had to hold my son's head on the Dinosaur ride so that he would not bash his head on the side of the car. My advice is that unless your marriage is bulletproof and you are getting laid at least 5 times a week, do not go anywhere near there. Spend your 5Gs on something else. Now to the relationship part. It was as if the past 6 to 8 months had never happened. For starters, my wife says that we have been getting along great. She, however, has not really made much progress on the sex issue. She keeps saying she needs to work on that, but does not. So, I figured that since she would be in MOM mode this week, I should not count on much togetherness. I do not understand why she can not be a wife at the same time she is a mother. My relationship with my wife is first and formost over my relationship with my kids. I feel that if the kids see a loving mom and dad, then they will be ok. One thing throws everything back to the feelings of doubt I get about our marriage. She can say some of the most hateful things to me and then act as if she never said them or act like she has no clue that what she said affected me at all. She told me I had been an [censored] since the trip started. I took a few minutes and then told her that I did not think that was fair. I ask her to tell me instances of when I was being an [censored], and she said nothing. She later apologized blaming it on the stress of the trip. The next day, she was back to being distant. When I asked her why she was being distant and pissed, she said she was not. When I told her that if someone thought she was being that way, that she might want to look at the possibility that she was being that way, she went back to name calling and blaming. I do not think I am perfect in any way, especially with the kids. I tend to be on the strict and careful side of things, but have been really working on it and am much better than I used to be. I try to not let people affect the way I react. I have found since I have been working on this, that I really do not like being around people who bitch all the time. I also do not know how much longer I can live with trying to be a couple only to have to still make it an issue to have sex with my wife.
God is love, love is blind, Ray Charles is blind......so there.
Ah, yes the millin dollar queston, why can't these women be wives rather then mothers. Probably one of the biggest problems in marriage today, women who can not put their husbands first. Women want a great family life for their kids while at the same time DESTROYING their kids chances of being in a great family as they totally ignore the father. Welcome to the club!
This was one of the most helpful posts I've ever read on this bb.
Plus, it was really funny. You really have a killer sense of humor, even when you are not trying to be funny. Ok, so the kids need to be older, the marriage bulletproof and stay away while it's hot. Check check check. I will hereby pledge to wait many years before we attempt this, thanks to you.
I'm sorry your wife was a big fat crab the whole time. That certainly puts a damper on things. Say, have you read Passionate Marriage? This is a really good book and gave me the conversational skills that I needed to have, in order to talk to my husband about our sex life. NOT that I always use them, but I do know the right way LOL. You might want to look into it. I think you are on the right track, with getting along better and being the best H you can be. You may need to kick it up a notch, is all.
Thanks HP, I do have that book, but have not started it yet. I tend to slow down on the reading when things are getting better. I guess people can be lulled into a false sense of security as long as all is going relatively well.
God is love, love is blind, Ray Charles is blind......so there.
I don't think that your wife is really aware of the road you are travelling and what is ahead if things don't change.
I think MOST women complain naturally. My little girl does! Somehow each one has to see themself, what they are doing, and how it sounds!
People have to CHOOSE to be happy and upbeat. And like Bambi said for a Disney Movie, "If you can't say anything nice don't say anything at all."
I agree about spending the $$ at Disney. Been there done that!
My realization of complaining came in 3 ways 1) I saw other women to it...UGLY 2) I heard myself...UGLY and then 3) My H pointed it out....in my Opinion very hurtfully...nonetheless..got the point across.
Also...what is she doing with the kids and no sex...killing your M. Can you tell her that? Can you tell her what it has done to others?
How about taking her away a few days. Women are connected to their environment. Or send the kids to a friends house or family for a night. Just have fun and Sex too.
I think that you are trying to be Mr. Perfect and speaking from a woman who has been where she is...DON"T just try to be Mr. Perfect hoping that she'll want to do differently.
What I would have wanted was 1) You trying to be Mr. Perfect but then 2) Make a point to have a heart to heart talk. Not in passing. At dinner with the 2 of you. And keep doing that until she hears you. Tell her how much you love her, how much she means to you, ...she NEEDS to talk to an older and wiser woman that she respects to clue her in on your S desires being good,great, and normal. I don't really know that she'll hear you about it. Not where she is at. But, anyway you do need to C with her about it. I'd talk about what I read that happens to other COuples going down the road you are on...what comes next and how you don't want that to happen.
FInd a lady somewhere...do you go to church? That would be a great resouce...or a friend or neighbor. A woman who can clue her in!!!!!!! Then she does need to hear from you too.
Oh, well. I sure don't have it all together. I just know what I wish I would have had to make my road easier. But I'm going to make the best of the one I am on and enjoy my ride! It is the only one I have!!!!
I have done these things. My wife seems to have a habit of ignoring what she does not like about herself. She has made the comment in the past that she thought 'things would just work out' (regarding our relationship). She tells me she wants me to help her at the gym and for her to lose weight, but then when I try to get her to go with me, she does not feel like it and gets pissed like I am bothering her. I am getting to the point that this is starting to not hurt me as much as really just becoming a drag to deal with. I mean, I could be in another relationship with someone who wants me, physically and emotionally. It just sucks that it would involve breaking up my family, hurting my kids, and in the end, being blamed for the whole thing. All I am looking for is a loving marriage with a real hug, a good kiss (not a peck, I am so tired of pecks or the cheek being turned towards me, I could spit!) I can't tell you the last time I got a little tongue. How sad is that. A good kiss to me is as good as sex sometimes. Getting really frustrated and tired.
God is love, love is blind, Ray Charles is blind......so there.
I am so sad for your situation. I am sure my husband would have said he felt just like you too many, many times.
She probably has lots of logical complaints about you too!
If you'd hear me talk about my H and how I see it you'd be on my side. Then if you heard my H and how he sees that I treat him you'd be rooting for him. Funny...we are all like that!!!!
Our differences cause us not to really HEAR each other.
Your wife married you and obviously gave you some pretty great kisses! Or you wouldn't have married her. What has happened over time? Taking each other for granted? Not treating each other with the same kindness and courtesty as early on? I don't know. But there are things that can creep in on all our marriages. INdiviual issues yet many are the same.
Have you asked her (kindly and lovingly) why she doesn't want to kiss you anymore? And don't defend yourself at the answer. What if she says because of how you talk to me? Will you listen to her "beef"? Will you hear her? Will you then FORGET what SHE IS DOING WRONG and just hear what she has to say about you. Show her you are open. Tell her you are sorry. Ask for specific things.
Or will you blame her and point a finger at what she is doing wrong.
I am not saying you do this I have no clue!!! So thanks for bearing with me. My point is that WE ALL defend ourselves and BLAME the other one. Change has to start somewhere and we are all waiting for the other person to change before we change...because of course they are more at fault that we are! ha ha.
I'm just giving an example of listening to each other. Someone has to swallow (their pride) first and reach out to the other person with real compassion.
We are all human and make gigantic mistakes! We have to try to help each other through our weaknesses.
Oh, well. A few thoughts. Hope one of them gives you something to ponder. Don't give up.
RE: nicegal My point is that WE ALL defend ourselves and BLAME the other one.
I just wanted to pop in and say how much I like your post, seeing both sides of a R and trying to get people to open up and listen w/o being defensive.
To me, there are too many LD spouses don't want to have sex with their HD spouse until the HD spouse is about to leave. I would like the sex to increase for all HD spouses before they are in that "ready to leave" position. I will be reading your posts and see ways for this to happen more.
Did you have a post some where that describes what might have worked with you? I think this question applies but I have not read all of your posts.
My H will say that nothing would have worked until he chilled me out. He may be right I don't know. I can't know for sure.
I do absolutely know that had I truely understood and realized what was going on I would have at the least communicated more to try and understand his needs. But, I was an idiot!!!!
I think when you realize you could lose what you really love you stop taking it for granted! Sad but true. Tell some of our stories to your wife. Ask her if you guys really want to go down that horrible hellish path.
I am an Italiam background...dramatic, firey, emotional. My H an English...hide their feelings, reserved, etc. So the few comments he made to me about someday I'll quit coming for you and then you'll be sorry. I remember him saying it maybe 3 times. I didn't know what it meant. I thought he was just talking. Honestly!
For my personality I need to be taken to a restaurant looked at in the eye and had a detailed converstaion (with kindness and love) explaining what was going on. Things like "You are the woman for me. I love you. I adore you. I know we are different. That's ok. I need you to know that emotionally and/or biologically I need to have sex with you maybe x number of times a week. If I could make us both want it the same I would. This is just how I am made. I want you! No other woman. Just you. But you need to know that because I am not having sex as often with you as I need it presents a real temptation to me. I don't want to be tempted and I don't want to succumb to it. But I am just a man. It is real."
Something along those lines. Spell it out. Make it clear. Give details. Tell her you want to be with her...not another woman. etc. etc. You love her. She is beautiful to you and etc.
And if you do that once and it doesn't change. DO IT AGAIN> Don't get angry!!! Have the talk with her again. If things change for a while and then digress. Have the talk with her again!!!
I remember my H giving me a book underlining what he needed. It was a great book. Looking back as to why I didn't hear that as it was BLARING...I think I was defensive and that was why I wouldn't hear. I don't think I felt like I was enough for him sexually or ever could be. When I go back there now, it gets all over me. I cannot even go to that thinking or I'll digress. My H looked at porn...before meeting me. I felt less sexy, inferior, and however much I'd do it it would never be enough. I think this is HUGE for women and it could be a factor in why some withdraw. It did me. I felt inadequate physically and sexually. Now I realize that you are only inaduquate if you think you are. And if my H had thought that I was (he says he didn't) then it would be his problem because I decided that I was a catch. I had to change my thinking for me.
This, I really think, would have worked for me. Why? I love and adore my H and him communicating WITH ME about HIS NEEDS rather than someone else is what I want.
I think guys think that if they say it once it is good for all time. Women have a short "rememberer" ...at least some do. Until we get it right. But you know I think men are the same. LIke how many times has a wife asked her H to just call her in the day to say Hi....to say how much that means to her. But he doesn't remember.
Seems simple huh? Yet I have told my H that hundreds of times. Does he do it. Occassionaly. I used to get so mad...thinking he MUST not really love me and on an on.
Now I realize, you know it is just him. It is not important to him and he forgets. I am not going to get what I want with vinegar but with honey. I want him to be understanding of me so I have to FIRST give him UNDERSTANDING and some space to just be who he is.
I said all that to say that just because a W doesn't get it the first or even 5th time that you talk to her....DON"T QUIT!!!!!!!!
If she meets you with resistance...DON"T GET ANGRY. It will kill any words you have said. DOn't defend. Ask her...why are you so opposed to sex? I can see that so many of our troubles were caused by defensiveness rather than really just listening to my H. I wanted to have my say, rather than just listen to him.
When we want to be heard more than hear noone hears anything and our R go down the tubes. I need to remember that one!
nicegal Re. to this post:My H will say that nothing would have worked until he chilled me out.
Thanks for the reply above. I guess I will have to do some more of the things you suggested. I have done most but can see where I need some modifications to what I say and not be as defensive or try to explain my position so much when BB tells me what I am/was she did not like. Kind of difficult to do when accused of doing some things for reasons she invented in her mind. I gusee I need to say "If that was the way you felt" more times instead of saying what my real motives were.
