Kismet - yeah... I do agree that sometimes when the WAS lies is because they think that the truth would hurt us more. I do feel the same way, ie. to tell him.."It's okay. I know the truth. I am soooo detached. You can tell me the truth!"
The problem with him bringing up the OW bit...is that everything he does it, he will say "The fact that I am telling you, means we are going to be okay". I somehow agree in a way. Before, he hides everything, and I see a shift of him telling me things and answering my questions without any hesitation (whether lies or not, that I don't know). And he does it all so calmly. No anger at all, which IS a baby step from 4 months back. Also, from some other DBers who are over at piecing...they did say that the WAS needs to condition their heads of slowly phasing OW out of their minds, and a lot of them need to do this by talking about OW to their spouses. I do sincerely hope that this is true and feel it is true.
hi YoYo, just wanted to let you know that I'm lurking and thinking of you. don't know that I have a lot to suggest, I think you're doing a great job.
A couple of thoughts came to my mind though, that I might share: My H told me not to long ago that he went through all his elaborate schemes and lies to protect our relationship...and he said he was terrified he would lose everything, meaning home & us....
I've also found that when H would bring up ow, I got the best results by just looking calmly straight at him and not saying a word. he always responded in one of 2 ways when I did that: he would sometimes start talking about her/them, which gave me a clue about what was going on, or, he would shut up already! about her which meant I didnt have to listen to it. either way, I figured I gained.
The tampon stuff is weird, smells pretty fishy, I have to say. wierd no matter what was going on with/between them.
I still see many positives in your sitch, and feel that his talking to you is a very good thing.
Hi! Deb... Thanks for dropping by. Have been keeping up with your sitch too. I guessed we are all treading on thin ice?
I've also found that when H would bring up ow, I got the best results by just looking calmly straight at him and not saying a word. Yeap! Have been keeping MUM when he brings them/her up. Most of the time, he continues to talk about them/her. I only interject when I feel very strongly about something (like the part he told me that he brought OW's mom to our house...a joke to check out my reaction???). Mostly I shut my mouth quite well in these episodes.
The tampon stuff is weird, smells pretty fishy, I have to say. wierd no matter what was going on with/between them Yes...it is very very fishy. But he is not saying anything more. I really do wonder. If he feels he is gonna go the other way, might as well tell me all?
Journalling.. I received a receipt for H's car yesterday. It indicated that his loan was paid by a cheque from Bank Y which he doesnt' have an account, which means that it was OW's cheque. I texted H "Wow! She paid for your car. Does that mean that you are the mistress and not her? Ha Ha Ha". Well, I have to say that I got a call immediately (in RECORD time, I might add) from H. He was soooo shocked that I knew about it and he kept insisting that he paid her back and he didn't have a cheque blah blah blah so had to get her to write a cheque (I was thinking..hey, we do have a joint checking account! Why can't you use our cheque?). I went on and said "Hey, since she bought you a Prada wallet for your b'day, and you being the mistress and all... Maybe she should get me a Prada handbag for my birthday next month". He said "Don't be silly. It's nothing. I paid her back!". So, what do you make of this????
H then came back really really late, past midnight and showered. I stirred and mumbled something to him. And then he just came by and initiated s@x. I was not really in the mood.... and he said "it's gonna be a long time" to which I replied "It's okay". But he was insistent We did it and somehow I bled I thought it was him? But turns out to be me. He was really concerned and said that I should go check it out. In my heart, I was thinking "well, if it's anything sinister, it would be to your advantage, wouldn't it? Me out of the way. You can have OW and the boys"...but of course I kept that to myself and just answered "I'll see over the next few days". Then our convo: H: I am soooo unfit. Can't even last long in the game. 15 minutes and I almost died. I have to quit smnoking! Me: So, I guessed you drank more than you played. You went drinking after, right? H: Yeah.. we went to this yuppie coffee shop. Me: C&S? (I was just guessing...) H: how do you know? Me: Told you...I have sixth sense...nothing can escape me. H: Tell me....how did you know it was her cheque? Oh..is it from the receipt that was sent? Me: (Grinning....) Of course..otherwise how would I know, silly! H: Anyway, I paid her back, okay. We then went to make supper together (yeap..in the middle of the night!) , had a little chat (about cost of things in Country X, him not being fit..him giving up smoking blah blah), and then watched telly abit before bed.
This morning,...he seemed cheery when he got out of bed. And I was still spotting abit and he said that I should go check it out again. I just answered that I'll give it a few days. Then H left the room. Not long, S8 came to my bedroom and told me that his dad has asked them to THROW all his cigarettes! We'll see if this giving up cigarettes will last....
Sh#T! I have to say "Mentioning OW" is my WORST unattainable DBING. REally REally have to stop. And let him bring her up himself and not instigated by me.
One Day at a TIME!!! ZIPPING UP MY MOUTH! OR STOP MY FINGERS FROM TEXTING??? REALLY!!! STOP MENTIONING OW
And I was still spotting abit and he said that I should go check it out again.
And he was right (for once!?) It's no big deal but don't muck around with it. Please?
The tampon stuff is weird...
Okay, I apologize if I'm out of line here, but that tampon stuff is indeed weird and is one of the funniest things I have read on this board. She hands him tampons and he sticks them in his briefcase? Is this some sort of bizarre ritual? I do not get it at all. I mean, tampons are intimate I guess, but not sexy. Sorry, but the vision of a dude with a briefcase load of individual tampons makes me chuckle.
I have to say "Mentioning OW" is my WORST unattainable DBING.
At the risk of being banished from DB land, is this really as big a thing as you're making it out to be? It seems to me you want to avoid OW talk if you're criticizing and he's feeling the need to defend her, or if it's dragging down your PMA. I don't see examples of him coming to her defense so it seems to mainly be a question of how it affects your PMA? Is it bothering you, outside of the fact that it's a DB'ing no-no?
I mean, I doubt if it's helping you any. But if it's not hurting you I don't think you need to beat yourself up about it too much.
"Wow! She paid for your car. Does that mean that you are the mistress and not her?"
I don't care who ya are, that's funny right there . Especially paired with his reaction. He seemed to want to clarify what happened and didn't get defensive with you. Is that about right? If so, we might want to start calling you YoYo of the Poison Tongue . Heh.
Stop WaitingFeel EverythingLove AchinglyGive ImpeccablyLet Go
And I was still spotting abit and he said that I should go check it out again. Yes, I did go check it out today. The gynaecologist said that it's fine, and continue to have s@x. Nothing sinister, but on the safe side did another PAP smear. Need to call in a week's for the results.
The tampon stuff is weird... Yes...Everyone finds it weird and bizarre except my H. I wonder, when his brain is UNMUSHED, and when he thinks back to this episode, whether he will feel silly and stupid.
I have to say "Mentioning OW" is my WORST unattainable DBING. Actually, b@tching about OW to H and him not defending her gives me great PMA (especially the other time when he sort of acknowledge that she is a LOW LIFE). But I want to avoid it because, yes...it is a DBING NO NO, but also I think that it may not be good in my sitch in terms of H SEEING that I am not sooo sweet and understanding. So, I want to stop it. Okay, I won't beat myself but I must have stronger control in doing this. But the 2 days, I have been quite good, I think. I wanted to ask him some stuff but kept quiet instead.
Wow! She paid for your car. Does that mean that you are the mistress and not her?" Sadly, I have to admit that I DO have a Poison Tongue. Tend to be very sarcastic. I have tried to do a 180 of not being sarcastic. Not very successful, but managed to do it in a more teasing/joking tone than one with spite.
Journalling... Wasn't feeling good yesterday. Left work early and went home. H was already home! He said that he had some errands to run before his departure next week. We had a brief chit-chat (about car, his planned poker game blah blah). Well, we arranged for dinner with another couple for tonight. And a poker game with the boys at our home too. H left to go back for work about an our later. He didn't come back till about 10.30 pm. Actually, called me about 10.10 pm to talk to me about his car, and then said that he'll be back soon.
This morning, nothing much. Usual dash to work. IMed abit about my bank account so that he could wire money to it.
Feeling a little shitty after my telecon with my MIL. H had lunch with her and apparently he is still very confused about us. H told her that he would be better than his father (who also left the family) by providing $$ for his kids, whereby his own father did not. Apparently, H also told my MIL that I am very strong and steady. And H also denied that I was very HURT by it all when my MIL brought it up that he had hurt me sooo much. Does that mean that he FEELS that he can leave me since I am sooooo independent and strong??? Also, MIL told me just before she ended the call "well, just be prepared". Gosh, what does that mean ???? Did he say something to her that indicated that he is going the other way?
I think I must stop listening to everybody and just to myself. Just keep quiet. Not have any external factors affect me. I really have to gooooo far far away with my mind. Really detach from it all. *sigh* Does "believe none of what you hear, and 50% of what you see" applicable here? Do you think what he tells his mom is nonsense at this point in time too? Shucks! Actually, it was I who kept on reminding him to call his mother. Geez...I am driving myself crazy. I just hope this will all end after he leaves next Wednesday. Then I go on a different set of roller coaster.
One Day at A TIME!!! Keep Calm! Breathe! STOP making myself Crazy! Think HAPPY Thoughts!!
YoYo...don't assume based on MIL conversation. She was hurt too, (you said H's father left the family) and may be assuming H will decide to leave based on that.
And doesn't it suck that since we are independent and strong, our H's think we can handle life alone? I know H told me that OW needs him, and I didn't - WTF! Which one of us is raising his kids??
Hang in there...in my case, a separation from my H was good to clear my head. You can stop focusing on where/what he's doing, and focus on what YOU are doing. It is easier for me when he is farther away. VJ
Amen to that VJ. If W would stop calling I could go dark and work on my dbing. Everytime there is a call, I get more information about W and OM that I want to know.
You start to process the encounter and then start thinking about her (or him) and lose ground. No contact means we can concentrate on ourselves and GAL.
yoyo, I agree don't take too much of what your mil says. She is basing this on her life's experiences. This is about you, so follow your instincts here. These thoughts will do your head in and are a waste of your time and energy (yes, do as I say, not as I do ) Keep on DBing
VJ38, Tambo, Kismet- Thanks for your advice. Unfortunately, I was kinda depressed by MIL's comments that after our dinner last night, I was still reeling from my emotions. We had a huge big discussion/argument that ended with H asking for a legal separation. He said "I am not gonna rely my future on your moods. I want a legal separation now." I was really up in my arms and was crying and all. About an hour later, H came to bed and asked how I was. I gently and calmly (with tear still streaming down my face) told him that I will give it to him but since he wants out, he will have to do all the paperwork himself. I am not going to do all the hard work to make his life easier. H: Sorry. I am very sorry. I know that I've hurt you. Me: No, you don't know. If you do, and you continue to hurt me, that shows how little I am to you. H: I really don't know what to say. (Inside me, I was screaming "Say that you will make it all right. You @sshole!" but kept quiet! I have to say that it really hurt like h@ll tonight.) Me: I will give you want you want. H: How do you know what I want? Me: You tell me. H: I don't know what I want. Me: You just sort out the legal documents, and send it to the house and I will read it. You propose how much you want to provide as a maintenance and your visitation. I will read and if there's anything I don't understand, I will consult someone. (H then kept quiet for a long time) H: You going to bed? Me: Yes H then left our room and I went to bed. I could hear him doing all sorts of things in the middle of the night. Leaving the house at about 1.30 am, and then coming back, watching telly in our bedroom, taking out my laptop and tapping d@mn loudly on my keyboard. Don't know what he was up to..think he went to bed about 3.30am.
Next morning, he came and caressed me, and we ended up having s@x. After that, he asked if I wanted breakfast. Told him I was gonna pick up the boys (boys stayed over at grandparent's house) and then go for breakfast. Picked boys up and S8 said that he wanted to have breakfast with his dad. Called H up, and then he did join us for breakfast. As usual, he had an appointment somewhere and was hurrying us up....and now he's out.
I am sooooooo tired of all this yoyo-ing about. Yes, I agree with you VJ38 that with H and I "separated" will give us time and space to clear our heads. Perhaps allow me to go abit DARK...or not. Somehow, when H is away or when I am away, we tend to talk more on the phone.
4 more days to go....
One Day at a TIME!! Have better Grips on my Moods and Emotions!!
I was not really in the mood.... and he said "it's gonna be a long time" to which I replied "It's okay". But he was insistent 
I thought it was him? But turns out to be me. He was really concerned and said that I should go check it out. In my heart, I was thinking "well, if it's anything sinister, it would be to your advantage, wouldn't it? Me out of the way. You can have OW and the boys"...but of course I kept that to myself and just answered "I'll see over the next few days". Then our convo:
. Especially paired with his reaction. He seemed to want to clarify what happened and didn't get defensive with you. Is that about right? If so, we might want to start calling you YoYo of the Poison Tongue 
. Heh.
. Nothing sinister, but on the safe side did another PAP smear. Need to call in a week's for the results.
