Kim - Thanks...but somehow yesterday floodgates were opened and we had a long long R talk in 3 separate occasions.
So, this is a loooong post.
Well, H was having dinner and we started talking about finances and that led to talk about us, our R, our M... The 3 separate occasions were 1) during and after dinner, 2) while showering 3) bedtime. Can't remember what came first but our convo started off something like that..
H: Would $$ be enough to pay for the investments? Me: Should be. You are so generous to pay for these? H: Well, if it doesn't work out between us,..we can split them. When I go to Country X, it would be a trial separation for us....blah blah blah.... Me: I may have to go to Country X for a work trip. H: When? Do you think you could extend a few days to go look for a house? Me: Why? You are not even sure that you want us to go with you. And you are talking about separation... Blah blah blah.... Blah blah blah... H: You know I am trying very hard to end it. We are both finding it difficult. But You know I am trying, right? With this new job and all. Don't you see the improvement in me? Few months ago, I won't even consider us. Me: Yes, I acknowledge your improvements. I do see that you are not so angry now. But I don't want to be hopeful of us being together and at the end of the day, we won't. H: What about if I say ALL of us move over next week. I give you the movers number and you all can start packing. Me: But you are not even sure about us. H: Yes, I can tell you I am not 100% sure, but perhaps with you all with me in Country X, it will force me to accept and try harder. Me: Well, we can't. Boys' school and all. Plus I won't want to - if you are not sure. I don't want us to move over there, and at the end of the day, you say hey I want her. And we (boys and I) have to come all the way back. Blah blah blah..... H: All I asking is for you to trust me one more time to make things right. Blah blah blah...
At one point, I did ask him what was it that made him so attracted to OW ( I know I shouldn't acknowledge OW - going against my own advice but I had to ask...). Me: What was it that made breaking-up so hard? Is it shared values? Shared interests? Shared goals? H: I don't know. But no...it's not shared interest. I find that you and I have more common interest. Me: Surely there must be something...can't be just physical attraction. H: I don't know...shared goal? I don't know..We did share the idea of starting a family. Me: You DO have a family. H: I know... Me: Is it that she is a good listener? and all? H: No..I don't know. (I know that I sound like the Spanish Inquisition...)
In one part of our convo: H: I know one thing for sure...if our M breaks up and we have a D, I will not be with OW. Me: But wouldn't that be a "waste"? If our M breaks up, it would be because of OW. H: I don't know. But I know that for sure that I won't be with OW. I didn't ask further....
Yes, he finally admitted that he was with OW on his birthday. I told him that he might as well tell me the truth because I am tooooo smart. He said "Yeah...I know. I know you are smart".
Another part of our convo: Me: If we do get a D. I don't want it to be ugly. I will be civil but I can't be your friend. H: You mean no f*&k f*&k or s&*k s&*k or l*&k l*&k? Me: Of course not!
Another part of our convo: Me: You said that you were so sure about OW a couple of months back. Why didn't you leave then? H: No, I was never REALLY sure. Reason that I wasn't hasty then was to give myself some time to cool down. To be able to think straight. These last 2 weeks away has made me think things a lot. I can tell you that couple of months back, I would tell you that I would marry her because of my strong emotions. But now, I am sure that if we don't work out, I won't end up with her. I also had some talk with few coworkers that had shared some insight. I have to say that the timing of their talk was right. I probably wouldn't have heard a word two months ago. They said that such a good wife is hard to find. Me: Perhaps you don't want a wife? Maybe she is just a tool to get rid of your wife?
Our talk was punctuated with me tearing but in a calm way....No shouting, no screaming, no anger. H was very calm throughout our convo. Our convo ended with him giving me a pat on my leg and said "Trust me one last time to make things right" which was nice in a way.
Anyway, it's another day. Today is S8's actual birthday. So, we are gonna meet for dinner.
Yoyo what are you doing girl????? Go back and read your last post but read as though it has come from someone else and you are reading it to give it advice....... "Trust me one last time to make things right" Did you not hear these words he is asking for another chance - how does that make you feel. Yoyo for goodness sake that was the time to take your R talk to another level surely you could have discussed what you would both do to truly give it another go, what H thinks would help, what H thinks needs improving blah blah blah there was the chance and you didn't take it - WHY!!!! He said it wasn't going to work with OW even if your M doesn't work, hello doesn't that mean he has realised she is not as good as he thought that you have come across looking the much better option your DBing has paid off. Why the hesitation????? Think about this YoYo what are you holding back for, O.K. you don't have to jump the gun and be all over him but in your true DBing style you could have made this a very big positive I am shocked. Not many of us get that kind of opportunity from WAS' and you have been after this for ages....What am I missing, boy have you confused me.....Really think about this Yoyo, I think you need the advice now of NYS, Anna, DMF and all those other leaders on these boards go and ask for it. Ooooooh I don't know whether to be happy for you or annoyed at you but you do deserve CONGRATULATIONS at least H is thinking of giving it another go he may need to hear some encouragement from you though. I hope you don't think I have just been really mean I certainly didn't intend to be I am just shocked at your reaction......Loving hugs (((())))to you and go back and read what you put and give it some thought then get back to me.......KDU
Kim - I know I know...but it's not so easy to dump everything here and move away to Country X with H. I mean, 5 months ago (before bombshell), I would have dropped everything and move with H. But I am not sure that I can do it now. I have a good job with good prospects. Plus I've got a company car and a perhaps a promotion at the end of the year (big boss already hinted about this) and all. My family is here. Boys are happy at school here. All my life, I have put myself second and H first - ALWAYS! I quit my job to be a full-time mom so that H could pursue his career. Everything about me was on a back-burner. As a result, I am soooo many years behind my career friends. And now, if I were to give up everything to be a full-time mom and housewife, I don't think I will ever have a chance to build up a career for myself. I probably can't work in the foreign country...What if H does it again? And this time, I don't have a job...kids are grown up...what am I gonna do? I value my M but I think I really need to think hard about ME and the boys. Boys schooling is of a totally different system and different language. It's quite unfair to uproot them for 2 years ...and then what? Can't come back to the local system, and we certainly can't pay for the International School fees on our own. It's horrendously expensive. I know that you would have jump on the chance to say "okay, I'm coming with you..." but he's only saying that he is TRYING very hard and will make things right... But you know how yoyo they can be as well. I just don't want to give up everything when he is not 100% sure. Anyway, he did mention that he wants to check out the country first before he decides if it is safe for us to go... Well, he said to give him 3 weeks to sort out. I thought it was already sorted out...but obviously not. So, Kim....you are shocked and surprised at me not jumping into the opportunity...but I need to be sure that it is safe to cross the road before I do.
Yoyo, I agree with you. I still would be cautious. Not to put a damper on a positive thing, however, my H said the some of the same things to me. After he told me he wanted a divorce I asked if he was going to be with OW. He said no, maybe he will date her on down the road. Well I guess that was one short road becuase he was with her within 2 weeks. I know you are apprehensive and you should be. I would just take one day at a time like you have been.
M:43 H:37 D14 (ours) D18 (mine) S22 (mine) S18 (his) S: 10/2004 Bomb: 2/15/05 In/out of home Living with OW #4 Talks of D for 2-1/2 years
Yoyo O.K. good explanation, I didn't realise how much you had given up previously. Well I guess if H asks you to go again you could say that you don't believe it would be the best of moves for the boys as they would have to learn a new language, make new friend etc and also that your not sure you want to give up your career when you have done that once to have your family that you dont regret but that you can't afford to do it again, when things are so up in the air with your M. Maybe if H is serious he will be then one to change jobs and come home. Maybe the break will make him realise how much he misses being married, especially if you go there for hols, this could end up being the beginning of the end and then a whole new beginning for your M.....KDU
Yoyo...good to hear that there are some positives in your sitch but until H is 100% sure I would be very cautious. You want to be certain before you move to another country. Believe me...it's no picnic being in another country away from your family and support group, different language...to only end up feeling stuck or stranded if your sitch gets worse again. It's not like your H is asking you to move back into the house ( or a sitch like that )...this is a drastic move, that even in the most solid of marriages would have to be thought out carefully and make sure both partners are okay with it, nevermind children. IMO I would give it more time and maybe a test trial...ie. going to the other country for a holiday or visit first with the kids.
Dear Fellow Sister Goddesses... Thanks for the support. At the moment I am still feeling rather emotional. Remnants from the PMS?? Haven't posted for a couple of days... I think the last one was about S8's birthday dinner on Wednesday.
Well, at dinner...all was fine until I got a call from work informing me of an incident. Called my boss to inform him, and he actually asked if I could go to see to it...The incident occurred in our factory located about 4 hours drive from my place. Was obliged to say Yes. And, so, dinner was cut short. Rushed home, showered and got ready to leave for work at 9 pm. When I left, S5 came out and cried "Mommy...don't go.." But when I called H five minutes later to ask how S5 was, he said "S5? Playing already!". Oh well....I reached the factory about 1 am and worked till 3 am. Got to the hotel and plonked on the bed. The next morning...was a busy full day...and so was Friday. Whilst I was away, H did call me few times each day. Thursday night...our teleconvo:
H: Need to check out what school to send the boys. Do you think A or B ? Me: Oh yeah...think there is B over there? H: Yeah...I know I saw, but I think
Dear Fellow Sister Goddesses... Thanks for the support. At the moment I am still feeling rather emotional. Remnants from the PMS?? Haven't posted for a couple of days... I think the last one was about S8's birthday dinner on Wednesday.
Well, at dinner...all was fine until I got a call from work informing me of an incident. Called my boss to inform him, and he actually asked if I could go to see to it...The incident occurred in our factory located about 4 hours drive from my place. Was obliged to say Yes. And, so, dinner was cut short. Rushed home, showered and got ready to leave for work at 9 pm. When I left, S5 came out and cried "Mommy...don't go.." But when I called H five minutes later to ask how S5 was, he said "S5? Playing already!". Oh well....I reached the factory about 1 am and worked till 3 am. Got to the hotel and plonked on the bed. The next morning...was a busy full day...and so was Friday. Whilst I was away, H did call me few times each day. Thursday night...our teleconvo:
H: Need to check out what school to send the boys. Do you think A or B ? Me: Oh yeah...think there is B over there? H: Yeah...I know I saw, but I think I have to go and ask company X which schools are in their approved list. (Company X paying for school fees) Blah blah blah... H: You remember I told you that OW bought a house? Me:....Yeah? So? H: Well, she wants to know where we made our kitchen? Is it at the shop called SK? Me: Yeah..but can we please not talk about OW? She's something to you, but not important to me. So, I would prefer not to talk to you about her... H: Well, you know what? She told ppl that I am dumping her for the money. Me: I don't wanna know... H: Don't be sad. Don't be sad because I bring her up. The fact that I am telling you things about her means we are ok, okay? Blah blah blah...we talked about other things like the incident at my work, our mutual friends, his other coworkerts...
Friday,...I came back late and was already sleeping in bed. H went out drinks with his pals. He came back with some supper. Offered to share the food with me, and suggested TV. But I declined as I was feeling kinda tired, and really didn't feel like it.
This morning (Sat) ...we had a long long talk again. It was kinda weird. I guessed I did blew the potential positives. H wanted to kiss me and said "let's kiss...havent' kiss you for awhile". But I pulled away, and said something stupid. And that started our long talk.
Don't know what happened to my last post...continue from last post...
I was swaying from validating to disagreeing with H. I know I know...I blew my DBING. But, I was so yoyo...
H: what is wrong? I am improving right? I am trying very hard. If things don't work out, at least I tried. Me: You know, most of the WAS would say that. Cause they would use that as an excuse "I tried but it just didn't work out" H: I won't say trying, then. I am saying I am forcing myself. The fact that I am going away to another country and all... Just give me some time. Blah blah blah... I know this is against my own better judgement, but I asked about OW again... Me: What was it that made you soooo in love? H: I don't know. Me: Is it something about me that made you run to her? H: No. And I didn't run to her. I was playing a fool, and then just got attached. Me: But what was it? Can't be just physical, so, what was it? I need to know ... H: I don't know. I really don't know. Wouldn't you think that this is a bigger concern for me? That I don't even know why? I swear to god that you are better than her in every single way. She may be slightly slimmer - well, that's because she has never give birth, but you are better than her in every way. I swear to god and at my grandmother's grave. Me: You are just saying that to make me feel good. H: You know me, once I swear at my grandmother's grave, I am telling the truth. Me: She's more attractive...that is why? H: I said she is slimmer. Not more attractive. Me: The sex is soooo good? H: You want to know the truth or the lie? Me: Of course the truth...I can take it. H: It is definitely not the sex. Blah blah blah..... H: We are not that compatible. She is this and that, and I am this and that. Plus I find that her family background is miles from ours. I can tell you something...even if we don't work out, and I marry her..we will definitely divorce in a few years. Me: So, you will marry her? H: Didn't you hear what I said? Don't you see improvements over the last few weeks? Me: Yes. Yes. But I just don't want you to help me build castles in the air, and then demolish it. H: Then? WOuld you prefer me to demolish it now, and then help you build it up later? Me: No...if you fully demolish my castle, then there is no way I want you to build it up. I will burn all our letters.. H: No no.... blah blah...blah%
He said "Yeah...I know. I know you are smart". 