Thanks, all. How many times have I read congrats to other people for how they finally changed the dynamics of a relationship? How many times have I congratulated those people, and yes, envied them.
The most illuminating part of this morning's conversation was when she wrote down what she thought I had said. Even after I wrote down what I really said, she would misquote and mischaracterize it, and I would have to go back to the paper, point at it, and read it. Whether this is an intentional thing on her part, or some emotional/mental short circuit, I am not sure. I'm glad I know it, however.
I feel like I've been in a parking lot, trying to get to the exit, onto the road towards marital happiness. All I want to do is get on that road. I know that we'll likely never reach the destination, but being on the road, headed in the right direction is enough. We're not to the road yet. We may just be moving to another level of the parking garage, and we may get lost there for awhile, too. But I am finally aware that the exit is ahead.
Add my conga-rats (picture a line of rodents in tall, fruitbowl hats-- BUM-pa BUM-pa BUMP-- OH!) to the others. Way to stand your ground!
You wrote
Quote: Even after I wrote down what I really said, she would misquote and mischaracterize it, and I would have to go back to the paper, point at it, and read it. Whether this is an intentional thing on her part, or some emotional/mental short circuit
I'll bet that it is not intentional. I'm surmising that her past issues with men, combined with her present career where she makes a living being adversarial and uncovering-- or imagining-- hidden malice in other people's statements has made this a habitual way of thinking with her.
Her stance seems to be "this man--any man-- is out to get me until proven otherwise, but if he tries to prove otherwise, he'll be lying, so the original statement applies in all cases."
Does she mis-hear and mis-understand statements made by women also?
Mr.Pot misunderstands what I'm saying frequently. And as you said, I can iterate and reiterate the exact words I used and he will continue to think I'm saying something else. I used to think he was doing it on purpose but I don't think that any longer. I think two things: First of all, we are so different in certain aspects that he just cannot see things from my perspective. This is not limited to conversations--sometimes we can read articles and get two totally different things from it. "He was saying this" "No NO, he was saying this" The other thing is that when our convos get heated there is a good bit--on both sides--of us assuming that the other person is speaking to us in a negative way. So every word is interpreted in the worst way possible.
Last night we were discussing our frequency and he finally said, I hate it when you talk mean to me! I said, H!! What have I said that was mean? What are you talking about? After a minute he said, Well I guess nothing but you USED to get mean when we'd have this discussion. I said, Yes I did and I'm sorry for that but I'm not doing that now.
And the whole dynamic of the discussion changed right then.
I think you did good in writing down the exact words and going over their meaning. Too often, our real meaning is lost to each other. That is a good exercise.
When we took our pre-marriage classes we got a D minus on the Communication portion. At the time we thought it was hilarious. About a year ago, MrPot found that test and we got it out and looked at it. Hairy, we weren't laughing this time when we saw that giant D Minus. It's been the source of much pain since that time and we aint nearly as bulletproof as we felt during our engagement.
Hairy, I saw on Journey's thread where you said you "had" to get a V so that you didn't get wife pregnant. Why was this?
For ethical reasons (I don't want a child of my own when there are so many out there in need of a loving home) or is there a deeper aversion to bodily functions, such as pregnancy and lactation?
just a thought I had. I know people have advanced some crazy theories about MrHP and I just say, Nope not the case...but it's interesting to see what people come up with.
Anyway, I have this new idea that a piece of the puzzle is she has an aversion to sex due to its very nature...getting close, sharing fluids, and that this is reflected in her non-desire to carry and birth children. I mean, NO woman is particularly wild about the idea of a human being coming out of her vagina--what a horrifying thought!--but most are able to come to terms with the yuck factor. There is a yuck element to many human relations--sex, childbirth, childrearing, caring for the elderly--does she have an aversion to this type of stuff?
I have thought this about her before, that she has an aversion to the yuckiness. As I mentioned about a week ago, she surprised me (although I shouldn't have been surprised) when she said that she doesn't like french kissing because tongues are "icky." And, because tongues are icky, she doesn't want them in her mouth, in her ear, on her boobs, or in her vagina.
HP, who knows why she has an aversion to sex. It could be for one or many reasons. The deal is, she is not making any sort of visible effort to overcome it, or deal with it. She would rather, it seems, not do it with me and put forth gigantic efforts in justifying this behavior. If we had spent the past 8 days making love instead of making war, my penis would be about ready to drop off from overuse, rather than it's sorry state of atrophy right now. (Oops, did I overshare?)
She's eventually going to have to deal with this, because I am in her life on a daily basis, have just declared I am not leaving, and have told her that I can not be quiet about not feeling loved anymore.
I got a V because I did not want to get her pregnant as a result of the bi-annual sex we were having. You know, it only takes one of the little buggers to increase your tax exemptions for the next 18 years. I didn't want her taking the pill any more, and she said she didn't want me to wear condoms. I had no problem ending my fertility.
HP, HD That does seem to be a common thread. MrsGGB and I both are guilty of reading (well listening) between the lines and insinuating meaning that wasn't there. Now I don't think we have our pre-cana papers, but I do remember we both kinda blew it off and took it lightly. I remember us having big communications issues then, and both of us tend to clam up rather than be adverse, so it is a big problem with us we are working to overcome.
The writing down thing is good, in fact WWME has you write your feelings in a love letter so that it is on paper and doesn't get whitewashed over in the discussion.
I think this is why NOP and I were able to use email to move things along furher, faster and more peacefully.
Not that email can't be misunderstood, but that sort of misunderstanding usually comes from missing the possible inflection. Doing it verbally, it seems that we hear it through a filter that distorts the words and we end up retranslating what was said into something it was not.
Did your C ever have you guys doing "active listening" exercises? You say something to W, she is supposed to listen, then repeat back what you said, then you correct or clarify as necessary. My wife never did get the hang of this. She is too busy reading between the lines, or anticipating what I'm going to say before I say it, or exagerating what I said, or thinking about what she wants to say before I finish, and so on.
This is every C's favorite tool in their tool box. I'd be surprised if she hasn't brought it out yet.
SM
"If we will be quiet and ready enough, we shall find compensation in every disappointment." Henry David Thoreau
