Learning to Trust Myself

[Burgbud]

Maybe lack of self confidence, so maybe pointing out that OTHER people think he's great, which would honestly be hard to find an example of, would be a good way of bolstering the self confidence which in turn would make him feel better about himself and more manly???

I really appreciate how hard you're trying for him. But pointing out that OTHER people think he's great is still outside affirmation. And he doesn't have to think he's great. He has to think (and believe) he's a man. He thinks that now but he doesn't believe it. Look how childishly he's acting. He hasn't grown up. I didn't grow up until I was 37 and my wife "left" me. I was basically responsible and I didn't do crazy stuff but I wasn't a grown up.

I'll bet you've heard of that stuff where a bunch of guys go out in a teepee and beat drums all night? That's more what I'm talking about, goofy as it sounds. Some cultures have done a good job of transitioning boys into manhood with appropriate and meaningful rituals. Sort of the idea of a bar mitzvah, but I don't think boys today believe they're men at 13. In our culture it's really up to the dad. But that transition and acceptance of the son's manhood rarely happens. One of Deida's bits is "Live as if your father was dead". If you had asked me what influence my father had in my life I would have said almost none because I've always been very independent. But guess what? The idea of "live as if your father was dead" was liberating to me to an extent that gave the lie to the idea he had little influence in my life. I realized I had a very hard time treating my wife better than he treated his; I almost felt like I was showing him up. Or that he'd think I was some wussified, sensitive new-age man if I was openly affectionate and put her first. He didn't treat my mom too badly but he has the same "Get over it" style, along with the implied "because you're incompetent if you don't", that I had. Very little affection between them. You get the picture.

Speaking of Deida, perhaps The Way of the Superior Man would have a chance of getting through to him. You could tell him it's a sex book, which it partly is.

My H doesn't have faith in anything or anyone except his children.

It's really good that you recognize this. You should also recognize that as long as this is true he won't significantly change.

His manlihood is being what he thinks is a great father. I'm just an ornament.

I can almost guarantee that's not true. He takes you for granted and treats you like an ornament but you still define his manhood. If you were merely an ornament to him he'd be happy to go look for a new ornament if you're going to cause him all this trouble, wouldn't he?

In one of your posts you talked about how "abuse" is such a loaded word. I completely agree. That words has been hurled at me and I hurled it right back at W. She's even said our kids are abusive to her. Perhaps that's true if you define the word right, but there's such an overpowering link between "abuse" and "he beats the [censored] out of her" that using the word is troublesome. A lot of my sharing the similarity between how H is and how I was is an attempt to show you that H is probably not a cold, warped abuser down in his core who just wants to use and discard people to accomplish his own twisted ends.

But NYS brings up a lot of good points and I don't want to mislead you. You're not dealing with the guy he may be deep inside, you're dealing with his behavior. Don't let him continue to hurt you while you search for his inner man. I know you love him and you want to give him every chance. W was the same. But she took it until she broke and believed there was no chance we could ever be together. That's no better for a M than anything you might need to do at this point.