Quote: I guess what I was getting at is you seem to be asking the question "Is it okay to be dissatisfied?".
No, that’s not the question. The real question is more like, “I feel like I should be satisfied, so why am I not?”. It’s just restating what I’ve said before, but I recognize that W had made huge changes in addressing this problem and I really feel like I should be happy with that. I think what I’m asking is if you agree that I should be satisfied with the progress we’ve already made or if you think there is justification for my creeping dissatisfaction. Part of me wants to keep pushing and keep pushing, even though I’m all but certain that the goal will never be reached. Another part of me says that an awful lot of progress has already been made and that I should just be content with the new and improved SL. The conflict avoider sitting on my shoulder keeps whispering the latter into my ear.
HD, Monday will be exactly 29½ years of M – and W has never attempted oral. I remember that I really liked it, but the memories are getting pretty dim.
HP, I have suggested a little variety. My suggestions are always met with refusals though. They’re not cold or mean, but they’re refusals just the same. As an example, I’ve made it clear to W that I like it when she’s on top. We’ve managed it a couple of times, but it always comes from starting in the missionary position and trying to roll over without becoming, shall we say, “uncoupled”. It ain’t easy, but it’s the only way we can get into that position. W is quite overweight, just under 5’ and somewhere in the vicinity of 200lbs (she won’t let me see her exact weight). I don’t know if it’s the weight or not, but we just don’t seem to “fit together” too well. Even in the missionary position, I always feel like something’s not quite right. It always seems like we’re at different angles or something. In any case, that’s the only other position we’ve ever tried. And it’s difficult at best. Generally, when I suggest something like her getting on top, she says something like, “Let’s just do this.”
That’s a long-winded way of saying that I already have tried suggesting a little variety, but I haven’t had any success. It’s very hard for me, but maybe I can flick the conflict avoider off of my shoulder and give it another try.
IHJ, thanks for the PM reminder. I do remember the growth and comfort phases. Maybe I need to read it again for a refresher.
Zufriedengestellter Bube
P.S. - HP, if you had a German keyboard, the y and the z would be reversed. That makes z much easier.
Quote: Yeah, an instruction manual would be nice. You know, I do appreciate the effort W is making. It’s a big, big leap from twice a year let’s-get-it-over-with duty sex to once a week where, even though she doesn’t appear to get any physical pleasure from it, she does seem to get some satisfaction from giving me pleasure. At some level, I really feel like I should be happy with that. And a lot of the time, I am happy with that. But I’ve had both, and sex with a woman who wants to please you isn’t even close to having sex with a woman who really wants to do it. KWIM?
I Know EXACTLY what you mean. I am happy too with the progress MrsGGB has made in this department, but I go through the same thing as you seem to be going through, that is she gets satisfaction from giving me pleasure, but it doesn't seem that it is something she really wants.
We're in the middle of the abstinence period for NFP. Last night I got her warmed up when we were fooling around a little, and she got to the point where she needed me inside her. I resisted, as hard as it was to do so. I mean, gosh, I wanted her too...a woman actually begging me for sex, but it wasn't worth risking a pregnancy), I think that was the first time I've ever seen her begging to be boned. This morning I tried to explain to her that it feels like that to me often, even before I am all revved up. She doesn't believe me .
I believe there will always be maintenance, although I think it becomes easier with time as new habits start to replace old ones. There will always be the tendency to slip into behaviors (and thought processes) that come naturally to us, so that is where the effort and maintenance comes in.
I don’t think there is anything wrong in wanting to grow further. It is natural and human. I understand your fear of backtracking if you ask for more, and she is already stretching herself. In my situation, the dynamics have changed somewhat. When we started this process, my H was (understandably) frustrated that I would always want “more” from him sexually, because I had a history of doing that. Recently, he has been telling me that if I wanted to ML or try something new, I should ask. This is somewhat surprising to me because of his earlier strong stance on the subject. I think it is because when I do ask for something now, it is not out of neediness, but it is stated as a preference, it gives him a choice and he can respect that. It is also very rare now for him to reject me or withhold or decline to participate in an activity that I want.
I guess what I am trying to say is that once you have been in the comfort cycle for a while, it is okay to redraw the baseline IF both partners are agreeable. If your quest for more variety is not sitting well with her, maybe you have to coast in the comfort cycle for a while longer.
I wouldn't be satisfied with your sex life, but I am much less inclined to be apologetic about it. I DO appreciate H's efforts and I don't want to come off as impossible-to-please, but on the other hand, I refuse to sell myself short and end up resentful.
Fwiw, I do believe that your wife wants it sometimes. She is a human being with sexual urges and she may not want it the majority of the time, but I'm certain that there ARE times when she's horny. The problem is that she acts the same way every single time. Reserved, awkward, etc.
This is fear. She is scared and feels inadequate and as if she is "no good" at sex. The only way around it is for the two of you to tackle it together, don't you think? Try new things a little at a time..work at allowing her to be stimulated during sex..compliment her liberally but try not to let her backslide into the comfort zone every time.
But the first step has got to be to rid yourself of the resentment and the only way to do that is to communicate your creeping dissatisfaction to her.
I think the moving target thing is a valid concern. I am guilty of that myself, but I don't think you're at that level yet, Z-Bube. (you are aware that you have a rapper-sounding handle now, aren'tcha. LOL)
Quote: Why do you feel like you "should" be satisfied?
I don’t know. Maybe it’s just empathy. I’m looking at it from what I perceive to be her POV. She’s never had much of a sex drive. She’s obviously very uncomfortable with the whole sex thing: doing it, talking about it, anything. She’s alleged some kind of sexual abuse. She’s admitted to hating men. And so on and so forth. There are some serious sexual hang-ups and sexual dysfunctions going on here. We went for years with nothing but occasional HJ’s. We went for even more years with twice a year duty sex. I may be projecting my personality onto her, but were I in her position, I would feel that I had done quite a bit of stretching. I would feel that my S had no justification to complain.
The rest of your post is spot on. She does sometimes feel sexual desire. But she gets no physical stimulation from IC. She wants oral and that’s what she gets. The IC is just something she does for me.
I don’t know about being scared, but there’s no doubt at all that she feel inadequate and she has told me that she’s no good at sex. I’ve tried to be supportive of her efforts and I’ve tried to dispel the notion that she’s not good at it, but alas, she still feels that way. I agree that it’s something we need to tackle together, but I don’t know how.
Stimulating her during IC is another thing I would like to do but don’t know how. With the aforementioned weight problem, I just don’t see how it’s physically possible in the positions that are “allowed”. I can’t do it in the missionary position, and on those rare occasions that we roll her on top, her stomach prevents access to the bits.
And finally, I don’t want to communicate my creeping dissatisfaction to her. She’s already feeling inadequate and feeling that she’s not good at sex. She’s already stretched herself quite a bit in order to address my needs/desires. Maybe I’m just trying to protect her from something from which she doesn’t need protecting, but I don’t want to add fuel to her feelings of inadequacy. Or maybe it’s just the old conflict avoider whispering again…
Quote: Stimulating her during IC is another thing I would like to do but don’t know how. With the aforementioned weight problem, I just don’t see how it’s physically possible in the positions that are “allowed”.
How about the starfish? Her on her back. You on your side approaching under her legs. Together you form an "x" touching at the squeezy bits. The weight issue probably makes her not want the woman on top position because she feels too exposed. The starfish does not cause such exposure, can even be done under the covers.
Quote: Stimulating her during IC is another thing I would like to do but don’t know how. With the aforementioned weight problem, I just don’t see how it’s physically possible in the positions that are “allowed”. I can’t do it in the missionary position, and on those rare occasions that we roll her on top, her stomach prevents access to the bits.
If she lies with her bottom near the edge of the bed with pillows under her to prop her up near your height, you can be in a standing position with good access to the bits during IC.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
I appreciate the suggestions, but the problem with both is that I have yet to be able to convince her to do anything so adventurous as to try another position. Please note what I told HP: my suggestions to try something else are met with, "Let's just do this."
The beauty of the starfish is that you don't have to announce anything. You just spoon up behind her in all innocence and then pull her over against you. I definitely wouldn't announce "now we're going to try something new." You might even act like it's something the two of you both discovered. All parts are in easy reach of both of you. It's comfortable and you can stay in it for hours if need be.
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