<Gabe puts away his spray-on hair coloring and jaguar-print speedo>
Hey! Thanks, Kim, Lost, Martha, and Russ. I never knew gray hair was so appreciated. Ladies, you've boosted my PMA! Now I don't have to live with a dye-job mistake for several weeks (or shave my head!). Thanks for the clothing pointers as well. I have the flat-front pants going, and I'm going with a smaller shirts size - good to know that I'm not a complete fashion moron. M, you mentioned different colors. W used to joke that all of my shirts were blue or white. I'm trying to mix in different colors, but thats a solid idea to check out GQ and 'Queer Eye' for fashion types. Will do!
Lost, you stayed above the belt! I'm surprised! Martha, I appreciate your honesty. In terms of women checking out the package, I always thought this was true...
Running is helping me to defy gravity back there, but guys I'll tell you (maybe women too, but not sure), doing squats with decent weight is really an important part of the equation for that.
I'm taking this adjustment of my appearance as just part of my self-improvement work. I do hope it turns W's head to some extent, but this will be more for me. I'm trying to stay positive, knowing that this is likely a very longterm sitch. This fun stuff will help.
Sorry for hijack and lack of qualifications for making intelligent remarks on couture. I am in almost identical straits as you are and like the group that you are interacting with and thought I would pop in to say I have posted as a newcomer on this forum and would love to participate in the discussions. I really admire the way you are handling things and staying positives and would like to emulate. Thanks.
The 3 laws of DBing:
1. PMA is critical to DBing.
2. Since drop in WAW's PMA leads to drop in LBS's PMA and vice-versa detachment is critical.
3. Validate to raise WAW's PMA and GAL to raise LBS's.
HA! Wow, when you women folk get to talkin about fashion, you really break it down to the fine details! No camel toes here - ouch! I'm not quite that much of a slave to fashion. My twins ride in comfort!
Jo, I think generations of my little sailors won't experience the heroic storming of the beach (if you catch my drift - ). I would fall over if W came to a point of wanting another child. I'd probably insist on lots of practice first anyway, just to make sure we got it right.
This weekend, I had separate convos with two guys who got D'd without any kids and I found myself sooo very grateful for S5's presence in my life. Experienced great appreciation, warmth toward W for giving him to us as well. He brings so much more joy and hope to the sitch.
W just called from the car to tell me they're nearly back "home" from visiting ILs. I'll go by this eve to see both and take him out to dinner. She doesn't quite seem ready to do anything with us three, and I don't think asking and getting rejected is good for the sitch. Opinions?
Apropos of your statements: "I had separate convos with two guys who got D'd without any kids and I found myself sooo very grateful for S5's presence in my life. Experienced great appreciation, warmth toward W for giving him to us as well. He brings so much more joy and hope to the sitch." (Ooh, mastered cut and paste, I am getting there...)- This is so true. But it is a double-edged sword isnt it. My D3 sustains me, but it also causes me so much pain that she is stuck in the middle of this mess. I have a really hard time dealing with that paradox. I guess it is as it is.
"W just called from the car to tell me they're nearly back "home" from visiting ILs." - Even after two years of separation I still have twinges of pain in my ribs when she calls her place "home". I see that you are still using quotes around that word! And it seemed that your problems surfaced only a few months ago (I think though that in most cases the spouse has been disgruntled for a long time and only threw the bomb after much internal strife).
"She doesn't quite seem ready to do anything with us three, and I don't think asking and getting rejected is good for the sitch." - You know, I really dont know if it matters one way or another. Personally, my W, I and my D3 have been having dinner together once or twice a week (on the upside of the rollercoaster even more) and lunch every Saturday for the past two years!! But nothing has changed her road to a divorce. I now think I should have really given her space and time more than I have but these dinners and lunches were not altogether my idea (in fact mostly at her behest!).
Summary: This situation is like being in quicksand. Seems like the more you flail around the faster you sink! I read somewhere that it is like that Elton John song about butterflies, if you chase after them they fly away. But if you sit quietly there is a chance they may come to rest softly on your shoulder (not my observation- some other acute soul on the bb).
The 3 laws of DBing:
1. PMA is critical to DBing.
2. Since drop in WAW's PMA leads to drop in LBS's PMA and vice-versa detachment is critical.
3. Validate to raise WAW's PMA and GAL to raise LBS's.
Hey Gl. I think UD may have something with that butterfly thing.
My WAW wants to have supper every Wednesday night. I find this leaves me very little time for me.( Have kids each tues. and thurs, and every other Fri, Sat, Sun.) Basically leaves Monady's as the out night..It Monday....
How would you feel if you W came to the supper and still nothing changes?
I do not think the family suppers are good DBing. Though the may be good parenting.
Gab, I don't know the answers, how about next time when going for supper ask if W has eaten? And play it by ear.
Well UD, it actually is still 'our' home. I bought W out of her equity share, so I own it, but she lives there and rents from me thru August. When S5 asked about this future move with some anxiety about him and his Mommy leaving several weeks ago, I told him, "S5, Daddy's coming back to fix up our home, to put in nice new floors, make your bedroom neat" and noted that his Mommy would be welcome back if she wanted to return. This was all he needed to know, that I wasn't locking the door in a more than a literal sense. He's had no questions since then.
Interesting perspective on family meals. Thanks for sharing the other side of that opportunity. I had a nice dinner with S5 only. Russ, I decided not to invite W after seeing her tired/cloudy mood. W seemed relieved about getting a break, but was definitely in wave crashing mode - not uncommon after visiting her folks. After returning from a brief light saber duel at my place (boy, did he ever have energy to burn off), I dropped him back at the house. During our time together, S5 seemed to need to work out some anger toward me, so I let him.
At our return, W started complaining about S5 struggling with reading, mainly about the schools 'we' have been paying a lot of tuition to. Poor DBing, as I validated a little of her feelings, then started to say, "Well, we can't undo the past, and I think it is eventually on us to teach him or not." Back and forth a bit, with W having lots of negativity about it. In the past, this meant that W was harped on by MIL about it, and made to feel inadequate. I just seem to lose focus when she gets locked in the past. Probably need to just shift topics, as her depressive funks are cheeseless tunnels. I had purchased "Hooked on Phonics" and am confident we'll get him reading by summer's end. It's as if my optimism clashes with her pessimism. I noted, "If it is too much for you or just not the best match b/t one parent teaching him, let's talk about that. Maybe one of us will be better at leading him thru the lessons. All that matters is that he learns, and I'd be happy to do it with him." She seemed to accept the flexibility okay. I'm growing, as I didn't feel the slightest urge to bring up how research shows that S and D tend to regress kids, as this would just add to her guilt.
I tried to leave 2 times and she or S5 brought me back with comments or new convo pieces.
As I was leaving, I told S5 to remember to say his nightly prayers. He ran out to my truck in his bare feet and said, "Lets say them together!" and proceeded to sit on my knee to say "Thank you God, for Mommy, Daddy and me, and for having a good time. Please bring our family back together." It took all my strength to not cry, as I know he was with W's pro-D family this weekend, and that he was hungry to be near his dad, who he knows still loves the family that he yearns for. I said softly, "Amen" then kissed him on the top of his head, and carried him back inside before leaving.
I'm down after hearing W's negative talk: environment, war, congestion, Hummer/SUVs, pit bull dogs - you name it, she complained about it tonight. I remembered many a long night of such complaints, but I also wondered if MIL's cooking made her constipated (usually does) or if she was menstrating (close to her time).
Now I don't have to live with a dye-job mistake for several weeks (or shave my head!). Thanks for the clothing pointers as well. I have the flat-front pants going, and I'm going with a smaller shirts size - good to know that I'm not a complete fashion moron. M, you mentioned different colors. W used to joke that all of my shirts were blue or white. I'm trying to mix in different colors, but thats a solid idea to check out GQ and 'Queer Eye' for fashion types. Will do! 
Martha, I appreciate your honesty. In terms of women checking out the package, I always thought this was true... 
No camel toes here - ouch! 
I'm not quite that much of a slave to fashion. 
It took all my strength to not cry, as I know he was with W's pro-D family this weekend, and that he was hungry to be near his dad, who he knows still loves the family that he yearns for. I said softly, "Amen" then kissed him on the top of his head, and carried him back inside before leaving.