No, the WAS cannot begin to understand how we cannot and do not want the whole friendship aspect. We want a better, full-time, committed, intimate R with them, but clearly they do not.
Long-lasting intimate Rs have a basis of friendship. If you could let go of the other parts and just focus on friendly back and forth, the rest will come, Jo.
I know that you are hungry for more. I imagine he is as well. Yet, some work needs to be accomplished first. Imagine yourself as meeting this man and the two of you are working to understand each other. Lots of positive discoveries remain, with no assumptions from the past. Let that go. Except for your daughters, you can let it all go, and then start to rebuild the R you desire brick by brick. Treat him as if you would an intriguing man you were just introduced to at the local cafe.
That's what I mean by friends. And Dogma's suggestion of boundaries fits here. As a new acquaintance wouldn't be graced with your sex yet, neither should H. He needs to work for it and to do his share of R work first.
When H slips and makes assumptions or judgments based on the past, bring the focus back to the here-and-now, and keep you two moving toward your goals.
It isn't so much the lack of sex that bugs me, more the intimacy. A couple of weeks back we were chatting for hours, doing stuff as a family, talking about the future - he told me I love you and that was after a passioned speech about how wonderful I am and now I've just got to act as if we're friends which is really frustrating.
It seems every time we get to a point in our R where there is a cross roads (like me being more involved with the kids) he just gets scared and backs off. Then I have to go back to platonic and re-build again, and I've done this about 4 times now.
I don't know how to break his cycle of fear.
That coupled with the fact that I knew him BEFORE we were romantically involved. We were childhood playmates, so in total I have known him for 18 years which is a lot considering I am only 28 - this means I have spent more of my life with him than without him, and 11 years of that time has been romantically involved.
It's therefore extremely difficult to pretend that most of my life didn't happen.
This time around though I am trying to implement a no sex boundry until he agrees to some type of proper M, otherwise I could see us doing this dance forever. I thought if I did that, he may realise he has lost me physically (which he couldn't cope with long term, he is always raving about how much he loves my sex) - so then he might panic and think I have to commit or I've lost her, type of thing.
It's really difficult to go through this - that's why I need all of you on here.
Quote: This time around though I am trying to implement a no sex boundry until he agrees to some type of proper M, otherwise I could see us doing this dance forever. I thought if I did that, he may realise he has lost me physically (which he couldn't cope with long term, he is always raving about how much he loves my sex) - so then he might panic and think I have to commit or I've lost her, type of thing.
Sounds like a good plan Jo.
About the kids and your involvement in their activities, maybe take that a little slower when the next time comes up.
I am thinking when OW moves out, Andy might might need you more and will ask you to become more involved. That is if he does not have other people/friends to take up the void that OW and her family if fullfilling now.
Quote: It's really difficult to go through this - that's why I need all of you on here.
Jo, you have cyber support, that is for sure. The BB and the books help most of the time. Sometimes real, live support is needed. I know the feeling of "what do I do next?" too well.
That interaction at the house to me sounds like what I do when I want previous bad stuff forgiven and forgotten. Act like nothing happened and nothing is different. He doesn't want to be just your friend unless by that he means "friends with perks" (friends and sex). I DO NOT enter my 1st wife's house at all unless specifically invited in and I do not make myself at home. That's more something I might do with my current estranged STBX wife that I love.
I would take his interaction to mean he wants to reestablish what you had prior to the setback. He's trying to see if he can just glide in the easy way back to what you had. I agree with Dogma about boundaries. He needs to actually verbalize he's sorry and tell you what he wants out of your R.
In the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years. Abraham Lincoln
It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. Theodore Roosevelt
The ex-ow is a bit of a problem because she tells me she isn't in a hurry to use that money to move because she is worried about leaving my girls without a female figure, yet she doesn't realise that until she moves, he never will get me involved with them so it's a bit of a vicious circle.
I do know, though, that H hates where he is living and wants to move so it can't go on forever and ex-ow tells me that whenever H visits me, he goes home and yells at her and is moody with her and irritable because he doesn't want her there, and he gets at her bf 24 also, so I can't imagine that she would put up with that forever.
That is how she guessed we were together because he was being horrible to her and everyone else in the house aside from our kids.
I was lurking on your thread, Lou - congrats on new intimacy with W! and go and get some fish as this helps with back pain!
Thanks for that, you really cheered me up. I'm back singing now (usually sing daily and I stopped after that email).
I figured he was interested to start with and then had self-doubt. I shall just act friendly but with no sex.
After he sent me that horrible email, I basically told him to get lost in a less than polite way and I told his father everything that has been going on and spoke to ex-ow, AND I told him to go when he brought the kids round with flowers before my birthday so I was expecting him to be FURIOUS and not speak to me for weeks (which would have been his usual response) so this is a total 180 for him.
I'm thinking there has to be some interest there if he has just ignored all that and the flack he must have got from his family. My guess is he probably panicked because I was so angry and I told him this was the last time he was messing me around and I was never sleeping with him again.
Maybe he now regrets what he did and realises he was a bit rash.
I shall just try to go with the flow but without the ML.
