T--I hope you don't mind my 2 cents here. I have been following your thread a little and I can't help but notice you seem to be focusing quite a bit on what she needs to do. I agree she needs to do some work--however, you cannot make that happen. Please focus on you and what you can do to be the kind of person you want to be (unless, of course, you feel pretty good about yourself the way you are).
Would it have really been so bad to hug her back? She took a little baby step there. Does pulling away from her when you are not pleased with her behavior change anything? Does it bring her closer to you?
Reminding her of the things she doesn't do (like not playing with the kids)--does that help? Would it help if you were playing with the kids and made a way for her to participate in what you all were doing?
She really doesn't know why she does what she does, and you probably don't either. She will have to figure that out. Are you willing to be her friend and support her during that time? She is confused, and probably feels guilty and disappointed in herself. What if you act as if you are happy to see her, talk to her, etc.? What if you told her you knew she was confused and you knew it was hurting her? What if you could forgive her and have patience with her while she tries to figure herself out?
Please be careful with the FF. Don't do anything you will regret later. You are getting a need met there that your W can't meet right now. FF may be making you feel good about yourself. What if you could do something to make yourself feel better instead of looking elsewhere for that reassurance and confidence in yourself.
I might be way off here, but some of this reminds me of me.
You are quite right that I have been focusing on her changes. I have made a ton which she acknowledges. I have even come a long way on the trust issues but she continues to lie and cheat even after I have given her the benefit of the doubt. She told me the other day that she will always need secrecy and privacy around me. That helped me conclude that she has no intention of being honest with me in the future. I have done a lot to work on me. I have a great support team, do things for myself, spend quality time with my boys, working on my faith, reading good books, etc.
She insulted and attacked me all day. The hug was purely manipulative and I wanted no part of it. She thinks I find her body irresistable and tries to use it to string me along. I caved earlier this week but it is purely physical. If we were getting along it would be different but I don't have a desire to be her boy toy anymore. Her actions and behavior have made a very attractive person quite unattractive to me.
The playing with the kids thing came up in a discussion on who should get the house. The truth is she doesn't play with them and the 10 year old simply answered her question accurately. I invite her all the time but it never fits in her schedule.
I have worked with her on this for almost 4 years. My patience has been depleted by how she tries to find herself. Going out to bars til all hours doesn't cut it in my book. If she was making genuine effort I could be her rock. Unfortunately, the more space I give her the more she takes advantage of me. She has a long way to go to prove herself to me. However, in the mean time I will continue to make myself better for my partner. Whether it is her or someone else is more in her hands than she realizes. Yes, she is very confused right now and what made her realize that was my detachment. Only when she thought I didn't care did she start caring about where our M ended up. I will remain detatched for me. I feel good about myself for the first time in a long time. It took genuine acceptance of my sitch to get me there. This detachment is also helping me to forgive her but it would be easier if she didn't keep repeating the pattern.
You are very right about the FF. They have really helped when I was at my lowest but now I can actually help myself. Yes, it was dangerous for while and I crossed the line with one of them but we quickly reeled it back. As I said we are very open and the two FF do know about each other. Thats the truth. They even ask about each other. Very platonic but could turn into much more if circumstances changed. The real positive for me is they helped me not be so clingy to my W. These FF have shown me that I am not the bad guy my W brain washed me into believing. I am scared to think of where I would be if they didn't help me find my true worth.
You are definitely not off course and if this was a new sitch I would be doing things differently, believe me. I have put all I have into my M and now I need to see something from my W before I can pour in any more energy. As I told her last night,"I am "safe" for you but you have been looking to trade me in on a better model for years and I won't live like that anymore, I can't. Don't stay because I am "safe", only stay if it because you love me and want to be here."
tbone, the reality is that these spouses who want you when you GAL and are not so available gets old...very old, especially when the cycle continues over and over again. I fully believe that some people have life altering changes that really REALLY wake them up and they know what they want in a M and find they really do love their H/W. But there are some who just play the game because the grass is ALWAYS greener on the other side. Your W has much growing up to do I am sorry to say. This will be a long, hard road for you, as it is for everyone. I know people who have reconciled, but it was only after a good deal of time passed where they were apart and to be honest, both spouses were very mature and honest about the problems in the R. If both don't have that quality and don't step to the plate, then it will not work. Only you know when you have had enough and when your W is serious...perhaps she will be at some point, but she may never get there. The WAS is usually so used to the LBS being there for them that they just take for granted you will go back. The LBS wants the M to work, so yes, it is natural to cave when their spouse asks for another chance. But when your life and happiness are at stake and things continue to decline over and over again, then you really have to look seriously at what you want and can endure. Your W has to really want to be with you and make it work for the long haul...not just a temporary fix as before. I see all the signs from my old bf, who came back to me after his ex-w kicked him out (again), that he is not over his sitch, and I have to protect myself this time and I am leaving him alone. You have children together, and that makes it doubly hard I know, and I wish we had a magic wand to make everything all better, but we don't. There is nothing wrong with protecting ourselves after this kind of behavior, so take care of yourself and your kids. Hopefully she will see the light, but one thing is for sure...at some point the WAS runs out of chances if they pull these stunts enough times. I saw the pain my ex-bf went through after his D, and it really was heartbreaking because of their son. And now he is going through it again and the pain seems much deeper. In his case, he has been hurt so many times that he really needs to work on his own life without anyone else in it, even me. I hope things work out for one way or another...I know they will.
I have been skimming your recent posts and you sound bitter and resentful. It sounds to me like you made changes with the expectation that your wife would too. Unfortunatley it doesn't look like that is going to happen anytime soon. Don't get me wrong, you have been doing this a long time and I am not in anyway saying your feelings (or actions) aren't justified. But, if you do get divorced, wouldn't you feel better not having those resentments?
Quote: These FF have shown me that I am not the bad guy my W brain washed me into believing.
This really struck a chord with me. My H was also speaking with 2 ffs, I read an email about a year ago that said "why is she still there if she is not contributing?" Then at the end she stated that she had to run because "she had floors to mop, laundry to do and a yard to mow." She knew all of the issues my H had with me, validated those feelings and than proceeded with all of the things she does that I don't. Not really marriage friendly. My H ended up "crossing that line" with another FF who was also making him feel justified, and like he wasn't the "bad guy."
Our situations are obvioulsy very different, but your FFs have only heard YOUR side of the story...they might get a different perspecitve if they spoke to your W.
I am sorry that you are going through this, unfortunatley not all marriages can be saved. You are the only one who know when you are ready to be done. I know that decision is not easy to make, but it sounds like you already have.
Your points are very valid. Bitter? Yes Resentful? Yes That is something I have been working on. I do realize that my FF only know my side of the story but I have been extremely objective and have taken responsibility for my actions as well. I fully realize that my FF have a distinct advantage over my W if I were to "compare".
I am in a very bad sitch that I don't know how to fix. My heart can't take being a doormat any longer but that is all I can do to stay in it. I'm between a rock and a hard place. The D is pretty imminent. My W has told me countless times that we will never work and all the reasons why. I guess she finally broke me of my optimism. I feel like a may be to the point that I feel my R energy would be better spent elsewhere.
I am really sorry about your sitch. I hope you find yourself in a better place soon whatever you decide. You are the only one who can get you there (although kids help! )
My name is Tbone and I am here to make you infinitely disappointed in a fellow DB'er. Thursday night my W and I are not getting along at a function so I got indignant and stopped for a maragarita on the way home. Rounded the corner not far from my house going way too fast and totaled my car. I was not injured but I had been drinking so believe it or not I headed for home. It was a long, terrible night. My W was livid with me and called the cops to come get me. The next day I went to get my things out of the car and was shocked how close to death I had come. I got sick over the weekend and my W's compassion came back. However, this morning she took my phone and intercepted a VM from a FF she did not know about. The fireworks were not good. W called the FF and then FF called my W back. They were just screaming at each other, not good.
I went to the doctor this morning and got a script for some antibiotics. Then I headed back to the house for more discussion with my W. She wants me to leave but I know that isn't a good idea. I get to the office and there is an intervention waiting there for me. My business partners and best friend. Mostly concerned about my wellbeing but also my career. I can honestly say that I have bottomed out.
Whatever you do please don't follow the path that I have taken. It is not a good one. I reacted poorly or overreacted to many things in my life lately. Tbone's decision making has gone right out the window and I am scareing people including myself. We had the M just about put back together this weekend. My W and I cried a lot about the past and our R in general. Unfortunately, I didn't play fair and got burned by it big time. Someone else was helping me take the burden of my pain and in the end it will cause me even more. Making bad decisions, very bad decisions. That has to stop and right now.
Just read through your thread, and just have to say, I feel for you pal.
Don't hit yourself over the head over the way things are going. "Bad" reactions are pretty understandable under the circumstances.
All I can say is that ya just hafta go with the flow. The problem with GAL is that the L you G isn't always what your SO would have for you.
You have to live your life, and wait to see if W wants to join in.
Don't compromize your values, and don't judge your W's values. I think your W is wrestling with what her values really are, and is inadvertently taking you along for the ride.
Bad feelings cause bad reactions and vice versa; both within yourself, and in your R. It’s better to try not to react.
Having said that, I have to admit to feeling krappy, headaches, etc… But I still feel good about myself, and I also know that if I give in to the bad feelings, my marriage is sunk.
Hope you can weather the storm; no matter how it turns out.
If it wasn't for being sick I really feel okay mentally today. Let me rephrase that, better than I should feel. I found out in the last week that my W and FF would never be there for me in tough times. That really hurts. The good thing is that the rest of my circle is rock solid, thank goodness. I don't know what the future holds for me but it will be better. My best friend said he wasn't sure if I could keep the wheels on. I said,"Wanna Bet!". So I still haven't lost my spunk. Yeah, it looks as thoough a CPA isn't cut out to GAL the way I was trying to do it. I have disappointed most everyone around me but mostly I can't believe what I have done. Talk about out of charachter! As my good friend said the one good thing about being flat on your back is the only way you can go is up. I just can't believe that I stooped to her level in all of this and thought it was okay for me. Venegence gets us no where.
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