I heard that statistically WAW's come back more often than WAH'S in general. I heard that is because H's have more "pride" and W's are more introspective. That part is subjective, I think.
To clarify, I was not friends with H while he was seeing OW, I didn't see him at all during that time.
I was actually friends with the OW, I know it sounds kinda strange but she kept contacting me and to start with I was really angry and really bugged and quite attacking ('why are you sleeping with MY husband?' etc), but the more she talked to me, the more I realised that she was a really lonely person and also, I realised that he hadn't told her anything about me or the kids or the sitch, so when it was in court, she was merely defending him out of ignorance.
She apologised to me after she became aware of a few things. I never thought it would last anyway as she has had 4 husbands and was going through a D with hubby 4 when she met my H, hence her attraction to him.
I also knew he still loved me so this helped me have a friendship with her without anger. I have a few common interests with the ex-OW so we were able to connect on other levels.
Sometimes it bugged him, other times I think he was impressed that I could be friends with her. Sometimes I wonder whether he put her up to it, being friends with me, when I was 'dark' with him, so then he could milk her for info on me.
She has emailed me and asked to maintain a friendship after she moves back to Ipswich with her new bf. I don't really want to as I want to close that chapter but I didn't want to hurt her feelings so I just said 'I'll think about it'.
My friend Martha was a WAW and they divorced and she has re-married her ex-H, but then I have another friend who was a WAW and never looked back. She even left the country and started a new life in the UK and has married someone else, and another WAW I know has a new bf, but she was being beaten by her ex-H so that is different.
I really couldn't tell you - I think it's the individual circumstances of the couple rather than what sex they are that determine whether the WAW will return.
Thanks for your opinion. I mostly thought the same thing. I was just curious what you thought since you have such sage advice. I think that it really is all unique to each individual and situation.
Today H and dd's were supposed to be here at 11am but he was late again so it ended up being 1.30pm instead. I felt a bit bugged before he turned up but spent some time dissipating my frustration by doing affirmation exercises.
He walked through the door saying that dd2 had a upset stomach was all sick till 3am last night so he slept in late ad hence that was why he was late. I thanked God that my affirmations worked and I hadn't bugged him for something which wasn't his fault.
Then he gave me a present! (First present since we starting dating last December) - I know you're gonna laugh, but it's Shrek 2 on DVD. (I LOVE Shrek, especially the talking Donkey!! ). He said it was my Easter present instead of chocolate. I thanked him and hugged him.
DD1 gave me this lovely card she made for me and DD3 gave me a picture she'd drawn.
I made drinks for dd's and coffee for me and and H and we put the DVD on and watched that. Me and H had to sit on the floor because I've only got 1 sofa and our 4 daughter's took up the whole sofa He had his arm round me the whole time the film was on.
All of us laughed ourselves silly over it, it's really funny.
Then I gave the girls their Easter Chocolate and tried to tell DD2 to save it for later because of her stomach but she wouldn't listen to me and had some anyway.
I gave H 2 boxes of chocolates and a vegetarian cookery book (meals in 30 minutes or less - great for a bloke!) - he really liked it and said thank you.
The girls are learning Spanish as part of their home ed and DD4 is also learning French (she can speak some French already and she's only 2) through the Muzzy foreign language course for kids so I put on this Spanish vocabulary builder DVD for them to practise. H is learning Spanish too so he joined in!
He commented on my dress being nice (Champagne coloured with one of those lace-up fronts and the laces go right down to hip level, difficult to describe, a bit Celtic, maybe).
Anyway, he was hugging me and kissing me every time kids were out of sight and brushing his hands passed me by 'accident' and of course we ended up ML.
Now, here's the amazing bit. We're half way through the ML and he suddenly says 'I love you.' ILY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG he hasn't said that in 3 years!!!!!!!!!!!! I never thought he'd ever say it again. I kinda freaked out and said ILY back about 4 or 5 times, LOL. That's the first time I've told him in ages too. I am so happy, this is different, if he's saying ILY this is permanent.
There were these cups of tea by the bed that we'd left, so he handed me mine afterwards and I said 'Hey let's just get off and drink tea, what a life!' He laughed at me.
Then we had to get up because dd's were playing in the garden and we had to go and see to them.
Then we spent the afternoon chatting and the kids were playing and splashing water over each other and then I cooked pizza and chips for everyone's dinner and while I was cooking, there was a tricky point.
H said he wanted the kids to see my mother again. I froze. I was standing by the oven and I froze. He said don't look worried, you don't have to see her, and I don't, I just want the kids to see her.
So we got into this really tense conversation about what a nut case my mother is and he said not to look so scared because he wasn't forcing me to have an R with her.
I went into some of the things she has done and he agreed that they were terrible. So far he has only spoke to her on the phone. She, like me, thinks she will ever have an R with me again. No loss there. I told H I am not going to her funeral, I shall break open the champagne. He said he understood. The up shot of it is, I don't agree with him re-institgating contact but I will not blame him. I told him if he was going to let the girls see her, then I wasn't going to as well and that he had to supervise the contact at all times, i.e, no leaving her alone with them. He agreed.
I was a bit stressed out, so we hugged. I asked him why had he not mentioned the phone contact before - he said we weren't together when it happened.
This pleased me in a way, 'we weren't together then' because he's saying now we ARE together. I felt happier and we sat down together to eat our meal.
He says he will go with me for the evening to my friend's house on Thursday.
What do you reckon? Good? It still counts if a man says ILY during sex, doesn't it?
Jo I am happy for you. Many atachment words from your H in your post.
Do you feel betrayed that H is going to thak the kids to see your mother?
Maybe he is doing it so the kids think they have a GM. Maybe he is doing it so your mum will see that you are a good mother or that you have more worth than she previously thought you had. Maybe your H wantas to show off his and your kids and prove to your mum that you and he are capable of raising strong, happy children. Maybe he is doing it so your Mum will eventually apologise to you or show her how proud he is of you, dispite her feelings.
----------- It still counts if a man says ILY during sex, doesn't it? ------------ It does when I say it. It is also something he will think about if he is not just a player=(in it only for himself)
Honorable Guys tend to carry out their bold statements like ILU just so they will not be called "two timers".
The gift of Shrek 2, the unsolicited explanation for being late, the snuggletime with the kids, and the ILY during ML all are wonderful positives to enjoy and to help solidify the R.
I'm very happy for you.
I appreciated the input you made on the 'odds' of WAW vs WAH. I too think it depends on the persons and sitch. I hope my odds are better than average, but a good part of that depends on my own work on myself and W's decision to improve or not.
Congratulations again! What a nice way to wrap up the weekend!
I'm glad you had a better weekend - how's things going with the W?
Yes I do feel a little betrayed about my mother, but mainly I am scared of her getting her paws into my M and ruining it (like the last time) and emotionally abusing me.
She is really good at emotional abuse and sophisticated mind games.
I am even more scared that she will do the same to my dd's and cause them psychological harm. I have never seen genuine love from the woman. That is why I insisted that H supervise the contact. He says he will not leave her alone with them.
It's always been like that with her because she had a terrible childhood (raped at age 5 by a neighbour, beaten by her father etc) and she is controlling in the extreme sense.
When I was a kid she never let me go out anywhere. I asked to go to typing class, she said no. I was allowed to a Disco once a week but with her there beside me. She wouldn't let me do the ironing in case I burnt myself, wouldn't let me wash pots in case I smashed them, wouldn't let me go to the dr alone. Walked in on me when I was in the bath (still tried to do this when I was 26 - she has few physical boundaries).
When I met H she told me I had to choose between her or him and if I chose him I was out, so I chose him and she threw me out of home at age 16. I slept round at H's mother's until we found our own house.
When I got pregnant, although my dad was happy, she was not and she kept sending these abusive letters (pages long about what a crap person I am and all the reasons why she hates me and thinks I would be a crap mother). She'd ring up at 11pm to shout at me down the phone about having an abortion.
H used to come in from university and find me in floods of tears after another nasty phone call.
After the baby was born it got worse. She found out we were bringing her up as vegetarian and because she wouldn't do that with her own kids, she reported us CPS for 'child abuse' and we had to have social workers visit our house and our baby. They of course told us we were doing great and that it was a hate call.
The letters continued (same malicious style, but more about the baby, 'you're doing this wrong, you're doing that wrong, you're hurting the baby' etc).
So we went to an attorney and got a non-molestation order which forbade her to contact us for 6 months. It was 14 months before we spoke again.
She carried on the same after, putting sugar on their breakfast and accusing me of being 'boring' and a bad mother for not letting them have sugar. For the births, she said I had to have a caesarean because I would never be able to give birth and that 'H should have been sterilized at birth'.
She bad-mouthed my H whenever his back was turned. Then when we split up after years of putting up with this and H unsuccessfully trying to protect me, she reported us to CPS again saying that H had 'messed' with our dd3 who was then only 2 (not true, of course).
Again, CPS said it was a hate call. She turned me away when I went to her for help after H left and on the times she did see me, would ask me questions about my SL and whether H forced me.
She got married and I was not invited to the wedding. My sister apparently got married but I didn't find out till months later. All Christmases, birthdays etc I was not invited to post-separation. She said 'I don't want you ruining my Christmas'.
Her new H just encourages her behaviour.
Then, when I was going through court to try and keep my baby and get custody of the others, she wrote a letter to the judge saying I was mentally disturbed and a 'sexual deviant' and that I neglected dd4 and that H had sexually abused dd1, dd2 and dd3 and she wanted them put in foster care so she could see them whenever she wanted.
You can imagine what I was going through. I was going through a custody battle, I was terrified of losing my precious baby, I was hurting and scared etc and my own MOTHER did that, to the judge!!!
Luckily, they knew the history, the previous letters, the non-molestation order etc. It was evidence to back up my case.
She is 70% of the reason we split up - you have to be really strong to withstand that.
I wrote and told her afterwards that I would never call her mother again.
You can imagine why I am not terribly happy with her having contact with the kids, but H was attacked by her also so I think he knows what he is dealing with and I trust that he can handle it - I am just not having an R with her again.
Thanks for the comments re ILY, that helps. I did wonder whether it was because sex is emotional anyway, but I'm pretty sure he's serious as he hasn't said it in 3 years.
Absolutely you must carry on working on yourself because if you're this confident, sexy and happy person, even without her, your chances of getting her back are much more.
I had to live without my H totally for a year and get through depression and actually start feeling happy for myself before he was interested.
).
(Champagne coloured with one of those lace-up fronts and the laces go right down to hip level, difficult to describe, a bit Celtic, maybe).