Quote: do you have any suggestions on what we should do financially? W: I think we need to sell the house and pay off the debt. H: I dont feel that is acceptable. I gave you two options that you were not comfortable with either. Please give me a second option.
We frequently have this dynamic going on in our home, also. My husband is a Chicken Little type. The sky is always falling, if you ask him. When I ask him a reasonable question, he comes up with an outlandish answer..this momentarily throws me off guard. I used to respond by saying, Oh come ON! It's not necessary to sell the house..let's think of another plan..
But the tone of the convo had already been set--I ask a question, he flies off the deep end, and I reel him back in. It was MOST unproductive.
Then there were the times in which I'd say, Fine!! We'll sell the house and live in a 2 bedroom condo!
That wasn't what HE wanted either so then we were both mad and nothing got solved anyway.
Finally, I started refusing to take the bait and voila, some real communication started happenin. Meaning, what if you had said "tell me more about your ideas..." when she said to sell the house. Force her to own up to her chicken little behavior and to the fact that she HAS no ideas and wants you to magically fix it all. The fact that you kept hammering her with "I have presented you with two options.." and the fact that she didn't mention these two options should tell you that she doesn't WANT those two options. The fact that you kept saying it was prolly ticking her off. On the other hand, her failure to come up with any good ideas of her own was prolly ticking you off.
I think we all respond better to each other when we are shown respect even and especially at those times when we don't deserve it--as your W surely didn't when she was Chicken Littling all over the place. Asking her to elaborate on her idea will show her several things: 1. that you value her opinions and ideas. 2. It will force her to acknowledge that this is a joint problem--not YOUR problem to solve. 3. By "buying into" the solution (which she will have to do if it is her idea), she is all that much more inclined to actively participate in it.
I just have to think that telling her "that is unacceptable" is not getting you closer to your goals of drawing your wife towards you and eliminating debt.
I think the others are giving you good R advice, as well as advice on the credit cards. That is a bunch of baloney. We have always kept a credit card but one night we were sitting around trying to think of legitimate reasons to have to use one and we came up with only ONE. People say, In case of emergencies, etc, but really what kind of emergencies requiring instant cash do people come upon that often in their lives? Wouldn't one card--that you never use for any other purpose--fit that bill? I have a terrible history with credit cards and now stay away from them, with the exception of when I go on an Ebay binge. Still working on that bad habit.
Take care and if she has problems going to Dennis, then go to someone else. He'll tell her in no uncertain terms to get a company CC and stop racking up interest on your family card.
I agree and have asked W to go to her boss and ask for a company CC to pay for all travel realted expenses. She says they refused. Is this something I really should get involved in by calling him on it? Im not too sure if it is a problem because she is a little lax in getting expenses in to her company.
NOP
---------------- Where is she going on the trips you are paying for? ---------------- In the past three months she has been to Vancouver, Montreal, Toronto, Denver, New York etc
The bills seem to agree that is where she is going. As far as EA I think what is going on is that she is infatuated with her boss. She talks about him all the time. Currently his mother is in hospital and she is very concerned about him. I asked her this morning if she gave him a hug to let him know she is with him (something that she cannot do for me). Her response was, it wasnt a good time to do that yesterday! He is happily married and she tells me that his R with his W is a strng one, so im thinking that she is jealous of what he has and desires him but probably has never followed up on it.
The funniest thing is that she continues to tell me that for the first time in her life she is happy with who she is! Funny thing about it is that she seems to be trying to push blame entirely on me for our R problems. Geez. I think she is trying to get me to agree that we should sepparate but I am unwilling to cave in on that one. I continue to tell her that I am not going anywhere and that I am more than willing to work on our R and that I know we can end up with a loving caring R if we are willing to work on it. This is always met with silence.
I did speak to her again this morning and apologized for the timing of the convo but that this is something that we do need to discuss. She agreed. So we have arranged to talk this evening. Wish me luck in continuing down the man of steel / tin foil path.
CN, ----------------------------- Have you always taken a calm, logical approach to solving money problems? No one wants to concede fiscal irresponsiblity. Maybe your financial planner friend can give you some advice about the best way to go about getting your W to fess up about all her financial blunders. Sovling this problem together may open up avenues to solving other problems. ------------------- I cant say as I have always been Finacially responsible. I think some times I need to be hit over the head with a hammer. I havent really shared too much with W about F as she would always seem disinterested or even told me on one occation that she found it "icky".
This is part of the problem that I see in our R. We both seemed to put our heads in the sand and continue on status quo. Now that I am trying to deal with difficult issues it seems to be causing alot of greif, mostly because Im asking the difficult questions and taking both of us out of our comfort zones. But it has to be done.
My financial advisor did suggest that I show W the total that would be paid in interest alone from continuing down the CC path and the savings that would happen if a loan or line of credit was used. I think that if I show W the bottom line as it were that maybe she may realize what I am saying. I can only hope that she is willing to swallow her pride and face the financial reality of life and kids.
Some great comments here. I like your line of thinking. Just to clarify in my mind, should I say, ok then I need you (W) to do some research and find out what kind of return we can get on our house after legal fees etc? Also let me know what kind of home we can move into with what is left behind?
I know I have done the research but W doesnt want to hear it. I know from looking at properties that anything that we get into would have to be very small and in a rough part of town or the other option is to move out of town (housing prices have skyrocketed here in the past four years).
I think more than anything W is trying to get me to agree to pack in the M (I know that is what she wants but will not take the step herself). I hope this tough conversations do not drive her away, but it is something that has to be dealt with. The longer we wait the worse it gets.
Here's hoping the Man of Steel / Tin Foil is able to save the world
If she is lax in getting her expenses turned in, then you are at the minimum paying the interest accrued on the credit card due to those trips, possibly late fees too. I'm sure she's not turning in the interest or late fees on the expense reports, the company probably wouldn't pay for that.
At the very least I would do what NOPkins suggested, call and speak to someone over accounting and ask for a copy of their travel policy, inquire about why she is expected to use her credit card. This just doesn't seem right to me....how big is the company she works for?
Regarding paying for travel: I've worked for several small organizations over the years where I made reservations with my own card and was reimbursed. For those of you who work for or have always worked for big companies, this may be unfamiliar behavior. But it's certainly possible. I don't find it suspicious in the least. The idea of calling your wife's company without telling her and checking on this is outrageous. How would you feel if someone from personnel stopped you in the hallway and said, "Your wife/hubby called this morning to check up on you." 'Nuff said on that one.
On the debt: Why not get your financial advisor to draw up the paperwork, along with the interest numbers (as you mentioned) and let her see exactly what it would look like. Stopping credit card use for anything you cannot pay off at the end of the month would have to happen. I wouldn't wait for her to come forth with ideas and suggestions. If push comes to shove, you can always bring it down to the finish line with everything done but her signature, and then say, "If you don't have a better idea, please sign here."
That is exactly why I asked what size the company is that she works for. I do realize that small companies may not have the negotiation wherewithall to have Corp. cards.
LP wrote: -------------- The idea of calling your wife's company without telling her and checking on this is outrageous. How would you feel if someone from personnel stopped you in the hallway and said, "Your wife/hubby called this morning to check up on you." 'Nuff said on that one. --------------
I completely disagree with your assertion here Lilly. It wouldn't bother me in the least. I have nothing to hide.
There is nothing outrageous about this man checking as to the spending habits of his wife's COMPANY, in this case, with HIS MONEY and HIS CREDIT CARD.
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I recommend that you consider reading/studying these books. Keep them to yourself for now.
"Divorce Remedy" by Michele "Surviving An Affair" by Harley. "Love Must Be Tough" by Dobson.
Also buy a book called "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass.
Rather than keeping that one to yourself, leave it lying about for your wife to see.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
LP wrote
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Your wife/hubby called this morning to check up on you." 'Nuff said on that one.
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LP I think you added to what someone suggested. They suggested checking on the "COMPANY'S" CC policy. Not checking up on the guys wife. CM could say to the company, he has a financial problem his W is hessitant to talk about and say a little about the financial impact it has on him. CN could ask for or suggest options. Saying his W can't handel money has to be avoided but he can ask for help from the company.
I go along with NOP on this one. If spouses can't get factual information for fear of offending someones super sensative feelings, how do you solve problems. To solve problems everyone has to have the facts.
LP, I see your point, some spouses would feel this is checking on "THEM" but somehow she has to get over that if that is what she is feeling. I am the financial person in my M. To me 2+2 always equals 4. My W throws in too many feeling words and makes the sum's come out 3, 4, or 5 sometimes.
About companies being too small for CC. (general information not about LP's post)
I am a one person business and get CC applications almost weekly. I don't think any company is too small for a CC. If for some unimaginable reason, being too small is not the issue why CC don't issue cards. Almost any reasonable fool can get several personal CC for 4 to 10 times more than they can logically pay back. If the company can't get a company CC, I am sure the boss can get another personal CC for her. Either the company trusts an employee or they don't.
OG Lou Your milage may vary.
LP, I started reading "Undefended Love" Will comment later.
