Looking backward...but only to move forward THREE

[sage]

More looking backward...my 16th thread:
My 16th thread

A post on some corners I get stuck in:

I mentioned "corners" in my last big post so I thought I'd babble on about some other places I've gotten stuck in the last couple of days. (Well, I've gotten stuck in them many times, I just happen to have recognized my "stuckness"!)

1. Every so often I create a mental fantasy where I find out that h is still deceiving me and I kick him out no looking back. When I get caught up in this I can play it over and over in my head with alarming detail.

For obvious reasons, this has been bothering me. I was wondering if it was a sign of my inability to complete forgive...and that worried me because it can be SO virulent and I didn't want to believe that I was that far away from forgiveness.

Then, while posting on Pam's thread yesterday I flashed on maybe I was replaying this in my head because I was having trouble accepting my "forgiveness" of h...(so, almost the opposite of the above!). That I was holding myself to some "standard" and trying to tell myself that there was some weakness or flaw in my choosing to work on my m. Obviously, THAT didn't sit well with me! I don't want to put myself OR h thru that!

But tonight I think it occurred to me what's (at least in part) going on...I've noticed that these mental fantasies happen when I hit the wall of feeling as though h isn't addressing my "needs" in the exact way that I want. So...a good example...when h and I go out at night, sometimes when we come home he checks his email. this just mentally freaks me out. It reminds me of when he was involved with ow and then I get wrapped up in "why can't he do XYZ to make ME feel better" then I start getting (internally) self-righteous. I think that I then try to soothe my fears and insecurities by thinking "well, gosh darn it, at least I can kick his sorry butt out".

Sigh.

Not too healthy is it?

SO...to be clear...this really only happens when I'm pretty high on my anxiety scale...either because I've been ignoring the warning signals OR because the action is a significant trigger...but when it DOES happen my NEW reaction is going to be to think a bit more deeply about WHAT need isn't getting fulfilled and whether or not I can soothe myself OR ask h for some help. I'm gonna do a 180 on myself!

2. Following along with the notion of asking for what I need...yesterday I had a horrendous day at work, I left late with a terrible headache after finding out that I was going to have to let 4 of my temp employees go today (unexpected). I had called h before I left and we had talked about cooking food from the freezer.

Well..I was feeling awful and on the way home I started thinking "maybe he'll have dinner started" and "maybe he'll surprise me with a glass of wine" and "blah blah blah". Well, I got home and lo and behold there were no romantic and magical preparations planned. Instead h was in his sweats being kind of loud (remember, headache) and boisterous and peppy in a way that just made my dour mood even worse.

Inside I felt mad and stressed and suspicious and annoyed.

And I realized a bunch of things:

All of my reactions were based on things that h knew absolutely nothing about. He didn't know I had a headache, that I had to let people go, that I had had a bad day. I hadn't asked him to start dinner or to have a drink waiting for me or to be kind of mellow when I got home or any of the very simple things I could have said.

Instead I just got quiet and irked.

And, I realized AGAIN that this is the way I spent MUCH of the last year of our pre-bomb m. Except in THAT case I was a lot less aware of my stress being based on unspoken needs and desires and just thought that I was stressed because it was justified.

My h cannot read my mind.
I CAN ask h for specific things. He may or may not respond positively but I can certainly ask.
If I do ask and he is not willing I can let him know that I need to meet my needs myself (by taking a bath, making myself a drink, etc)

(I've noticed that I've mentioned "a drink" at least 3 times in this post! That's ONE drink folks, not THREE! )

anyway...just doing a bit of piecing here!

More thoughts on the “negative fantasy”:

More thoughts on why these feelings keep popping up...I don't know how exactly it works but it feels like a SAFETY net to me in some way...kind of like my hurt and fear and sadness is a rope to hold onto...a barrier to put in front of me. That's it, isn't it? (She said to herself...) It's a false front to keep the soft spot from getting exposed.

When I get stuck:

The last few days I can feel myself making "trouble" for myself inside...I've been tired and stressed and "in corners" and grasping at EXPECTATIONS and ASSumptions. Why am I such a bottomless pit when it comes to needs? Why do I end up in these spots where I just feel so stuck?

The good news is that I used to lash out and be reactive when I'd end up in these spots. Also good news that these phases are fewer and farther between. I just get frustrated with myself and feel so worried that my internal musings and stresses are somehow driving h away. Will I ever stop wondering if a prolonged silence or mood or "feeling" I'm getting is the beginning of crap starting all over again?

Sigh.

Well...a pretty common theme on my threads is you dear folks telling me to relax and lighten up on myself. And I'm applying Zoo's h's advice to her to ME too...I need to stop trying so damn hard to make everything perfect.

I'm sure h will appreciate the lighter load.

Some “beating myself up” but also a lovely gesture from h:

This may be a beating myself up post. There are times when I feel as though h reads my thread...so I've been putting so much pressure on myself to not be honest with my struggles right now on the BB...it's absolutely stupid...I want and yearn for honesty and intimacy from him but then even on these boards I find myself wrapping myself into "as if" mode. I'm so afraid of displaying uncertainty or fear or sadness for fear that he will say "forget it, let's throw in the towel" as he has said whenever these anxieties rear their heads.


Here's the deal...I am stuck, stuck, stuck in my suspicious, disbelieving, "there must still be something going on" mode...I'm interpreting every phrase, sigh, action, tone of voice, etc from h -- putting it thru some ridiculous filter that says "does this mean he's still having an affair?" "does this mean he's going to leave me". I cannot stand what it is doing to my head and I can feel the pressure and tension and suspicion all around me. It's wrong for a thousand different reasons and painful as all hell for me right now..I suspect it's painful for him too although I'm not reacting or expressing it or withdrawing or any of that...I'm just trying my butt off to battle the demons of fear and anxiety and insecurity in my head.

A few weeks ago this wasn't present. I don't know what's different now. It just comes and goes in waves....lasts for a day or a week or and then goes away. It's not every minute of every day -- I'm up, I'm down, I'm all around.

Last year -- March 03, h and I had a conversation in the middle of one of these cycles and he said "let's just forget it. I've tried to love you as best as I can and as much as I can and it still isn't enough". It's a year later of him loving me and I'm still there today (not every day but today). The good news? These cycles are MUCH farther apart...and probably even better news...I don't feel the need to lash out or react to them...it's in my head.

WHAT is my problem? Why can I not be at ease?

I tell myself it's because instead of hearing "you'll never be over this" I need to hear "I'm so sorry that you are still hurting, can I help?" or instead of hearing "I don't know what happened" I'll hear "I don't know what happened but I will think about it and maybe we can brainstorm together because it's incredibly important to me that this type of thing never happen again in our m."

Yesterday I had a terrible day at work. h was great. I picked him up from the train station and when we got home I saw that he had left me a note. It said

1. Take remote

2. go upstairs to guest room

3. hit play

h had loaded the "Sound of Music" DVD to what I feel is the most romantic movie scene EVER...the scene where Maria and Captain von Trapp are dancing at the party.

It was a beautiful,loving, romantic gesture. It was creative and thoughtful.

I loved the moment. It brought tears to my eyes.

This is not a man who doesn't love me.
Why am I still looking for the words I swear I need to hear?

I want to stop punishing myself for this. I want to stop worrying that I'm punishing him.

A tough realization about my fears and how they might look to h:

There are times when I feel as though I have fears oozing out of every pore...but no doubt it doesn't look that way to the outside world...more like a barrier or distance or some sort of bravado. This morning it occurred to me that in my recent bout of "scaredy-catness" I think I'm telegraphing dissatisfaction to h -- not fear and love and a desire for closeness. And, to your point, it's because I keep rooting around looking for THE words I want to hear.

I've been here before and I know it's not a smart place to be.

Questions from LL:

Is it possible you are beating yourself up for nothing?
Is it possible that you've won the race but are still trying to reach some finish line you've imagined in your mind?

I know it's not easy to do, but can you step back and look at your m and answer where you think it is?

Sometimes when trouble hits we go into fight mode but don't know enough to relax when the battle has been one. I suppose in some sense that fear of relaxing comes from not wanting to resort back to ways that led to the fight but what if in keeping in fight mode we are infact doing more of the same?

When was the last time you set goals for you and/or your m or when was the last time you looked over your goals to find assurance that you have infact met them.

And my longwinded answer:

Yes to both and it wouldn't be the first time for either.

I describe myself as "stuck" because I KNOW that's what I am...stuck in the same cheeseless freaking tunnel that I've wandered boldly into many times.

And as I mentioned above, I can FEEL myself telegraphing dissatisfaction to h...I can FEEL the tension I'm creating within myself and likely within "us". And I'm trying to drop it, to lighten up, to cut myself some slack, blah, blah.

The dissatisfaction is all about wanting to hear something very specific:

You are safe with me.
Your heart is safe.
I will not deceive you again.
I want our m.
You are worth it.
Etc.

I'm trying to breathe deeply into feeling afraid because that's what I am.

The cheeseless tunnel is wallpapered with posters...they say:

If you don't TALK about it and find out WHY it happened it will happen again

If you let your guard down you WILL end up wrecking your m, the way you wrecked it before

If you share ANY of this with h (taking a big chance here by posting it!) he will decide that YOU are not worth this and leave

Because you don't have an "action plan" for your m. and dealing with infidelity, you are DOOMED to fail

He told you you were wrong for him once, so it must be so

You deserve: words of SAFETY, words of COMMITMENT, words of "THIS WILL NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN" and if you don't get the WORDS then nothing counts

Being trapped in this tunnel again is a SIGN to h that you will NEVER get over this

If h doesn't share more about his emails and on-line activities then history will be repeated

on and on.

I'm NOT, NOT, NOT always stuck there.

I don't even think I rent there.

It's just when I wander down it, it takes me a while to back out. And all that propoganda is peppering the walls making the journey that much more difficult.

I'm afraid to relax because it was in the "relaxed" mode that I missed the warning signs. Well, actually, to be HONEST, it was in ANGRY mode that I missed the warning signs but I find that VERY HARD to remember.

And I know with all of my heart that this churning that I'm doing inside is MORE OF THE SAME. And the one REAL advance and progress I can note in myself is that I'm NOT spewing it all over h. I know that it's radiating outward a bit but it's not out there in everyone's face.

One step at a time I say when I feel good.
Why can't you hurry up and heal I say when I feel bad.

Rottzilla’s great suggestion for redecorating my tunnel:

The fact that you still see those posters on the wall says to me that you really need to start hanging new posters. You meditate, why don't you have a tunnel decoration party?

I am worth my H's love
My H loves me
My H will not leave me, because it will not be an option because I am so wonderful
I am loved by many
I am cherished by many, even those I have never met

I think you can come up with many posters to cover those old ones, perhaps three or four times over.

The battle of “conflicting needs”:

I think I get most stuck when I forget what h needs and focus exclusively on what I need:
Quote:

(from Minnie) I thought that he was just unhappy in the M....but...when I think back I see that H has been looking/reaching for something all along. On two different ocassions he told me that he "needed to start his life."He told me this when he wanted to buy a house and I didn't. He told me this again when he wanted to have a child and I didn't. It's as if he was looking for something".

I think this information can really help guide your DB'ing to the next level!

We obviously can't SOLVE our Ses problems and wounds any more than they can solve ours...but I do think that having an understanding of what they might be bringing to the table can help with DB'ing.

It's SO hard sometimes though, particularly because our needs and wounds are counter to each other. Some think it's no surprise that we marry people who often poke at our wounds with their wounds...

For example...I have this strong need to be safe. To me that means having some sense of control of my destiny and that's often meant that I yearn for more understanding and disclosure from h.

H seems to have a strong need for independence and privacy and NOT being controlled.

Ouch.

So, ASSuming that I'm not completely over the top..the things that h could do to make me feel safer would be:

To share much more of the hidden sides of himself
To involve me in his decisions and thought processes
To disclose "private" things

AND, to make my h's needs feel fulfilled I'd need to:
Stop all elements of "control"

Drop the rope regarding his decisions -- even those that strongly effect me

Overtly respect his privacy to a level that satisfies him (more, I think, than others require)



What's HARD to remember, even HARDER to execute but SO AWESOME when it works is that if you GIVE your S what THEY need, often they stop needing it as much...

So...if I stop trying to control, he stops feeling controlled by everything and it becomes less of an issue with him.

If he discloses more things that normally he might consider "private", I have less of a need to hear them, etc.

---

The realization (again) that often my needs/fears convey dissatisfaction to h:

Quote:

---

To be really, really, really clear...when I say "I will never hurt you that way again" I honestly DO NOT mean "I will want to be married to you forever" -- although I certainly HOPE that h wants to be married to me forever and I certainly HOPE that he will decide to work with me for our future and I certainly HOPE that our m. lasts and lasts and lasts...it's NOT what I mean by "hurt".

What I mean by that phrase is:

I will never blindside you and lie to you in that way again as I did when I was having the EA. I will not ignore your pleas and earnest requests for honesty. I will not bring a third person into our m.

I'm sure it sounds like rose colored glasses but I honestly believe that if h had come to me and told me that he wanted to end our m but there hadn't been another person involved I would have healed very differently.

Something about it (and it's mainly about the months of sadness that I had when I KNEW something was going on) just rocked my world.

I guess I just want to hear that if he found himself wanting to leave that he wouldn't choose to be unfaithful first.

I fear that h wonders if having that responsibility is too great...is too much of an effort...

Does he know that "safety" is what you're looking for? In other words, is he showing that he cares but doesn't know that "safe" is the word you're looking for?

We've never talked about "safety" outright.

I honestly think that my neediness in this area hits a wound deep in h. I think (an ASSumption) that this might make him feel as though he can never be enough for me.

The more I write in the post the more bummed out I feel. WHY does it take me so long to swing around to how MY fears and needs make him feel not good enough???

ARRGH.

---

Constructive goals:

What am I going to do constructively?

I'm going to be grateful that my BB friends helped lead me out of the tunnel.

I am going to accept myself and the fact that I sometimes get stuck and that is OK -- what that means is that I will not turn on myself with anger and guilt.

I will focus my energies on loving h. that means doing "what works" -- planning dates, spending time together.

I will let him know how much I appreciate the things he does for me. I will do this by thanking him verbally.

I will work on my goals and re-wallpapering.

I will continue posting my positives and continue my efforts to re-frame them in ways that let me see how h is certainly addressing my needs in his own way.

I will eat those chocolate cookies that h and I bought during our breakfast date -- as I sign that I deserve chocolate

Sage

[Hopeful_Scared]

Hi Sage,

Its amazing how reading your posts always helps me! I am having same issues in my M. My neediness sending message to H that he's not good enough and will never be.

H's need for privacy and my need to control, also my fear he will hurt me again.

Just yesterday I precipitated a bad sitch by accusing him of having ow. No proof, in fact I really believe that for first time he is really trying.

But my own fear of being hurt and all the Qs about whether I can ever trust him again keep me afraid, especially when things are going well.

Its almost like I must sabotage. Thanks for the insight.

[andrea]

Sage, its always nice and usefull to read how you control your self fear and badd moods... I thnk i had done a lot of Hopeful strategy... i think i had sent many many times the message : hey, you are not trying and working what i want... hey... isnt enough... hey... i still feel scare and fear...!! so thanks a lot for your inseight and inspìration
Andrea

[2much]

Sage, just wanted to say thanks for all the valuable information and insight. You ask yourself all the same things I ask myself, but I just dont have any answers...so thanks for you!

[sage]

Hi folks, thanks for the visits! (Andrea -- a special welcome back to you...sounds like a DB shot in the arm is needed? )

I'm glad to hear that the reposts are helpful. I know they are to me.

After an uneventful day at work yesterday I met h for drinks/dinner after his class. He made a lovely toast to moi and we had a relaxing evening. Good food and good drinks.

h is on spring break now and looks like we're going to go away for a mini vacation next week (thurs, fri). Should be nice to get out of town for a bit and go to another locale -- not too far away but just a change of scenery.

Work is blah today. I'm glad it's friday!

One thing I want to journal...towards the tail end of dinner last night (and on the ride home), h talked a bit about "newest" ff. He just mentioned some stories she had told him about her internship...I have to admit it's hard for me to hear him talking about ffs. He knows that too, I think, so I TOTALLY LOVE that he's talking to me about them -- why? Because it's brave and open and honest of him...and I need, need, need to get over this "heart closing up" feeling of fear. He reacts to it so differently now...holds my hand and gives it a squeeze when mentioning some story or other...doesn't close off or back away. The other night at the banquet he introduced me to one of his ffs...some of my jealousy reared its head (inside) but he was so great...leaned over and gave me a squeeze in the middle of the introduction/conversation. I really think he's tuned into the fact that it's hard for me...and he's working to make me feel better.

He's in a bit of an itchy butt mood today. Seemed irked by an errand he had to do (not something for me, however) so I tried not to take the bait.

Sage

[unsure70]

Hi Sage--

I truly hope you never decide to stop posting on this BB. Your threads are so insightful and it helps me know that my feelings are "normal." I understand that my fears may never truly disappear but that I can choose NOT to let them control me. Although, as far as I know my H is still involved in an internet A I am trying (struggling today) to focus on the positives in our R as opposed to what may or may not be going on in their "cyber world."

Have a great weekend!
Unsure

[sage]

Unsure, what an amazingly nice thing to say! I'm sorry that you're having a tough time of late -- as you know from reading my "retrospective" it's entirely to be expected (and overcome!).

***********************
Had a really nice weekend. The weather was snowy again! arrgh! Speing can't come soon enough!

Friday night we stayed in and got pizza and watched a movie on cable. It was a nice quiet evening. Saturday h had a test so I did stuff around the house -- I'm in the LONG, SLOW process of getting the kitchen ready for painting. Tacked washing the walls and ceiling -- next up, spackling! (blech). It's definitely going to take a few more weeks!

Saturday night, more snow, so we got chinese food and watched "The Elephant Man" on DVD. A highlight of the afternoon was that h surprised me with champagne and . We were hanging out and he told me he was going downstairs to get some water. After a while he asked me to come check something out in our room and when I got in there a bunch of candles were lit and he had champagne! I **heart** that kind of romantic surprise!!!!

Sunday, up early for the gym and off to breakfast. We ran some errands and then hung out. We went to see "Downfall" in the theater and had dinner out. At one point driving home he said "this has been a great day because I got to spend the majority of it with you!".

h is out of school for the next week. Sounds like he's got a nice balance of "work" and "fun" things planned. Thursday and Friday we're taking a little mini-vacation in Maine so I'm psyched about that!

Sage

[minnie1]

Hi Sage,

sorry to hear about all the snow; I admire you and H for getting up early in the am and going to the gym!!! I can't do this in our warm, sunny weather.

After a while he asked me to come check something out in our room and when I got in there a bunch of candles were lit and he had champagne! I **heart** that kind of romantic surprise!!!!

I LOVE this!!! How romantic....I am so happy that the two of you have this awesome, awesome R!

Minnie

[slowly]

Hi Sage - I'm so happy for you that H is so romantic, wow, candles and champagne. Bliss

Slowly

[BeingMe]

Lucky girl, you! I wish my H could be more romantic, but he's not there, and probably never will be. Enjoy the good stuff!

I totally understand where you're coming from viz ff's. My H doesn't care to put me at ease there, but oh well, doesn't matter now, I guess.

Your posts always gives me a different angle on things, and makes me think.