W won't talk

[HDsocal]

we do ML, but there isn't any desire in it, not really mercy sex (well kind of) but certainly not wanting.

It isn't whos problem it is but getting her to truly understand that there is a problem.

suggestions?

[NOPkins]

HDsocal.

I was thinking of your situation specifically when I wrote that post, but evidently, I plugged in Wildebube's variables :-)

I will get you the same info plugged into a proper context later tonight - been one of those days.

-NOPkins-

[Bube]

HP,

I did try what you suggested. The setting wasn’t the greatest, but we were alone. I was doing the dishes and W was decorating a couple of cakes that someone ordered for a retirement party. The convo was short, so it was easy to remember. These are exact quotes.

WB: It’s been over a week now since I gave you that letter. I would really like to hear if you have any comments about it.
MrsWB: I didn’t think it required comments.
WB: Well, it doesn’t really. It was just my feelings about us and I was hoping you would have some reaction to it.
MrsWB: (about 2 minutes of silence)
WB: Didn’t you have any reaction to it?
MrsWB: It was nice.

Then she changed the subject and started talking about the cakes.

Should I have continued probing? I got the distinct impression that she didn’t want to talk about it.

Wildebube

[JRB]

Should I have continued probing? I got the distinct impression that she didn’t want to talk about it.

I don't think that pressuring her for more would have been helpful, especially since she has a history of not communicating. If she won't tell you how to be more of the ideal H, you're going to have to figure it out yourself. I suspect you have some ideas already.

Or maybe it is time to talk to the MC again (together), if she's willing to do that. In my case, the good news was that the W was willing to talk with the MC present. The bad news is that part of the talking was dropping the D bomb.

[cinemanymph]

You know that our SL has drastically improved in the past nine months or so and that I don’t understand it. She won’t talk, so I don’t know what’s behind the changes.

Wildeman,
Do you think that she may be improving frequency in leiu of talking? Maybe having sex is easier for her to do than talk.

Predictably enough, I’ve gotten no response. I haven’t even gotten any acknowledgement that she read it. No comments. No actions. No nothing. I know that she had some response/reaction to what I wrote. She’s sad about the wasted years, she’s angry that I brought up the past, she’s happy about the current sitch, she’s unhappy with the realization that sex really does improve the R, … I don’t know,… something. After a couple of days, she said that the girls had showed her their letters. I said, “I hope you didn’t show them yours”, and she told me that she had put it away where they wouldn’t see it. That was the first (and last) acknowledgement that she had even gotten a letter, so I was hoping that maybe she would say something about it. But that was not to be.

It must be frustrating and painful to pour your heart out and not get any response. Have you tried to bring up the letter with her?

[HDsocal]

Here is the letter that I want to send. Any thoughts on this?

It is time for another letter

We have talked repeatedly about a problem that we are having. I’m not sure what I need to do for you to understand that this is something that we need to address. I am convinced that you don’t understand that there is a problem and that we will not be able to solve it without help. Any time I have tried to bring it up, or make suggestions on what to do about it you are reluctant, or there is no follow up.

I have given up on buying books, they have either gone unread or after you read them none of the suggestions are followed. I threw away the ones we had collected. I hoped that they would help us solve this by working together at things, or at least help understand where the other is coming from. The sex starved marriage book was the best one that I found describing the frustration and resentment that is fostered. I hoped it would help you understand why we need to figure this out but it appears not to.

Valentines Day was particularly frustrating for me. You know I usually like to do something fun for you and buy a good gift. This year I went shopping, and couldn’t bring myself to buy a romantic gift knowing it would lead to more frustration. I don’t know if you remember but the last few years I had bought something fun and romantic along with a book to help us with our relationship. This year, when I saw the crowds at the mall at the lingerie, jewelry, candle, card, and the other ‘romantic stores’ buying things for each other, got depressed and left. I didn’t even buy the card for you until I was driving home on the 14th. I knew this isn’t what you had in mind for Valentines Day.

I think that you might have a hormonal issue. For a while I have been asking you to talk to a doctor about it. Recently I spent the time on the internet trying to find out if this was the case and found the information on hypothyroidism. Let’s face it, I’m not a doctor, and even within the web sites online there is contradicting information. That’s not the point, the point is that I have been trying solve or at least figure out where the problem is coming from. How do you think I feel when you haven’t picked up the phone to talk to a doctor either out of concern for your health, to see if this could be a problem, or at the least so I get some feeling that you are making an effort. There is a good chance that the doctor will tell us that this isn’t a problem and we can look somewhere else. At least then I would get the feeling that you want to do something about it.

You know me, and know that I don’t have any problem talking to people about things and I don’t let things phase me. I can’t remember feeling more pathetic than the other week calling your ob/gyn and having the secretary ask me ‘what’s wrong with your marriage, can’t you talk to your wife about this and have her call?’ I almost hung up.

I don’t know what to do. I could scream and shout or do some grand gesture but what would that accomplish. Maybe that was my mistake, not screaming and yelling about things. I really believe that this isn’t your problem or my problem but is something we need to work on together. What I am upset about is that you don’t want to work on it with me. I can’t figure out why. Do you understand that this is a problem that tears apart marriages? I can’t solve this alone and until you understand how important it is my frustration and resentment will increase. Do yo understand what the problem is? Tell me what to do.

[Greeneyedlass]

Wow,

I'd have to say that lays things pretty well out there. Didn't you once mention though that she tends not to respond to these? I might mention something about that if this is the case.

I remember writing my H a similar letter once (which I never did give him) in it I remember referring to the fact that he had acknowledged that there was a problem and that he would fix it but that his course of inaction only led me to feel that my feelings and needs and our marriage were unimportant to him.

Good letter,
GEL

[StubbornDyke]

HDsocal,

Have you read DR? I'm thinking specifically about the chapter on asking for what you want. I hear a lot of vague complaints in your letter and no specific request. If that's what your W hears, then it probably won't help.

My suggestions: Don't refer to more than one incident from the (very recent!) past (no digging up old garbage). Say how you felt about that (not how she "made" you feel, and don't make her guess). Then focus on what you want (pick one, specific, doable thing). Tell her what is important to you. Tell her how important it is. Tell her why (based on your needs). Express your deep interest in addressing her needs, too. In fact, I might start out the letter by talking about how important it is for you to understand her needs and finish off by telling her how important her happiness is to you.

Best of luck, whatever you decide.

[honeypot]

It sounds attacking to me.

Not that what you are saying is mean or untrue, but it seems to me that the tone of the letter will just make her defensive and all the more unwilling to work on things--cause she's feeling attacked.

I liked the last two paragraphs. If I were you, I'd condense it down to: I feel we have a problem that repeatedly goes unaddressed. Can you tell me, in your own words, what you think I'm talking about? I'm interested in hearing your ideas for a resolution to this. Please get back to me by the end of the week. If I haven't heard from you, I will know that your response to all of this is: I don't care and have no interest in repairing the M. I love you, blah blah.

Good luck, whatever you decide!

[NOPkins]

Hi, HDsocal.

I'm sorry that I haven't redone my earlier post to you yet.

I agree with SD, that the letter appears to be more a complaint than anything. She already knows you are unhappy.

The theme that I was trying to generate a working example of in my first post to you, was simply, generating a conflict to highlight the need for a decision.

You have decided to work on this issue. You wife has not. There are many reasons that she hasn't, many of them probably legitimate.

What you have to do is pin the issue down.

"Dear wife, I am anxious for your help with our sex life. My concern is that ignoring this issue, is going to tear our marriage apart.

I am asking you to directly address the issues plaguing our sex life by directly working with me on it. I am willing to, go to counseling, seek medical aid, and address any issues with me that are contributing to the state of our marriage.

Please consider this issue. I would like to discuss this with you tomorrow at dinner.

All my love,
HDSocal"

All the best,
-NOPkins-