I have to say though, your dramatic post made me laugh.
I have no intention of giving up - I've come so far that I'm not about to let a bit of his paranoid fear stand in my way
I read your thread. The trouble is, you aren't DETACHING properly. Detaching does not always mean physically detaching. You can physically be in the same space as that person BUT if they say hurtful things, you have the ability to SWITCH OFF.
Just validate everything she says whilst keeping your wall up.
Think of those science fiction films, you know, where they had an invisible force field? Well, just visualise an invisible force field around you and imagine her words are just bouncing off you - she has said them, you have validated them, but they can't affect you.
Everything is back on track (and I didn't even shag him just like Tag said ).
My friend Sam (female) rang me up today and asked if my H would fix her computer or build her a new one (he's a computer technician). I rang him and gave him her number.
We then had a very nice MSN conversation where he thanked me because I got him a customer and he needs more money for this new car he's getting (1 score to Jo!).
I told him I wanted to help him out with his finances. He said 'LOL, ta, thank you'.
Later on he came round with dd4 and to have coffee. We chatted and he asked me what I've been up to. I told him I have writer's block and have been struggling with the chapter on this book.
I also told him that I have made some online friends on here and we are all going through the same thing. He doesn't know the site details but when we reunite I will show him.
Then I told him I was worrying about dd1's birthday because every time I get involved with the kids, he gets scared. I said he was hands-offish last visit and it makes me feel as if I have done something wrong.
I said I didn't want to get close to him or the kids if he was going to push me away and not let me be involved with them.
I was sitting on the living room rug when I said this and he knelt down on the floor next to me and took both my hands in his and squeezed them and said 'I know how much you are putting into this.' So that was great, he acknowledges it!
He said he was just trying to take it slowly. I said when he backs off it scares me as I am worried I will get hurt. I asked him directly to tell me if he had second thoughts. I know this is R talk and against DB'ing but I felt it was appropriate at the time and felt comfortable with it.
His response was 'No, I didn't tell you that. I never said to you once that I wanted to end it.' And he kissed me - whooo hoooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He said just because he is taking things really slowly doesn't mean he's not interested in me. Then he kissed me again and left to go and do the computer job.
Still no invite to kids function but at least we have established the fact that he wants me and isn't going to backtrack (so he says).
Now I'm going back to limited R talk, confident, sexy and no more questions.
What do you reckon? I personally thought it was great, and he was looking at me like he thought I was wonderful
Jo wrote ------- Hey, because this site has the word divorce in it, that might shake her up a bit and she might think 'heck, he wants to divorce me. I'd better do something to soften him!' -------- This site has the word DIVORCE in it so W would think that is what I wanted (mistakenly so) and she would not want to be the dumpee so she would be the first one to call a D lawyer. W's common reply when I bring up a R topic is "do you want a D?", Well if you would do xyz. Not what can we do to solve the problem.
W knows I have read the DR and other of Michele's books. They were on the coffee table in the livingroom for a month.
-------- His response was 'No, I didn't tell you that. I never said to you once that I wanted to end it.' And he kissed me - whooo hoooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ---------- Very good Jo. I like reading post like that.
-------- What do you reckon? I personally thought it was great, and he was looking at me like he thought I was wonderful --------- I agree.
The computer customer was a good move. Being a man and work oriented, I would have appreciated your actions very much.
re: people outside in pajamas. I only saw it if a person wore pajamas covered with a bath robe and the person made a quick trip to get the newspaper laying on the lawn or maybe a quick watering of the flower next ot the house. Anyway not the norn in most of the U.S.
Re your W - you know her better than I do. If I found out my H was on this site I would DB my head off, but obviously your W responds differently.
She sounds really insecure. Did you try the romantic approach or did that not work either?
My H told me once (a long time ago) that his life didn't work without me in it, and I have remembered that ever since because it was such a nice thing to say.
Would she respond to that if you said that next time she asks if you want a D?
What about sex therapy? Have you ever considered going to that? Even just on your own, it might give you a few ideas of how to sort out your M.
I must say I admire your dedication to your M. A lot of men would just walk away. I really like men with standards.
Jo, Great news. good progress. you showed clarity of purpose an he's seeing solid citizen. I wish I could have similiar results. W and I had another session from 11 PM to 2 AM see my thread: Running on Empty III
Look further up my post. I left you a message on how to emotionally protect yourself from these fallings out you are having with your W - build yourself an invisible force field.
Another thing I will say is just because you are separated, doesn't mean you have to sit there for 3 hours and take it. If she was getting at you from 11pm-2am solidly I would say that is abusive.
It's one thing to validate but another to put up with continuous verbal abuse.
And remember, she didn't tell you all those things 20 years ago, she stayed silent. Why? How are you supposed to know what hurts her if she doesn't say?
Yes, you have faults - you were maybe too critical, perhaps you had a temper, I don't know, but the point is, she still sat there expecting you to know what she needs and she said NOTHING. You are not a mind reader, Tag, you're a human being.
Next time she goes at you, just say 'I appreciate the fact that you are being so open with me about your feelings now. I didn't know at the time. Why did you not feel able to tell me then as I could have tried to accomodate your feelings more if I'd known?' - or something along those lines.
You want to save your M, Tag, but you have to look after you as well - and simply letting her yell at you continously and use MC as a means to slag you off is not going to help.
I think MC is too much pressure on her atm. Is the C solution-focused? If not, get a solution focused C and think about going on your own. I think you would have more success that way.
Forgot to add UNLESS she did tell you her worries and you didn't listen, in which case it makes the situation different and then I wouldn't know what to suggest except validate and also give yourself plenty of space so you can cope with it.
Like you don't have better things to do, would you mind reviewing my sitch if you have a chance. I have it linked at the bottom. I'll warn you ahead of time, there are some long posts of mine.
Of course I have time, especially for people with difficult R's so don't apologise.
I looked at your current thread. I read your letter to your W and from a woman's point of view, I thought that was romantic. I am not surprised your W cried. I sometimes wish my H would do something similar. However, I think that should be the only letter.
She does not - in my opinion - sound like a woman who is terribly sure of D. First she started off saying there's no hope and then she went to MC, not the actions of someone with 'no hope'.
Also, my H said there was 'no hope' and now I am dating him after everything we have been through so it doesn't always mean anything.
She is hurting and she felt hopeless, but as I've said before, nothing is ever final apart from death.
One thing I will say is, men and women communicate differently so maybe your W did try to talk to you before but perhaps you didn't hear her? If you haven't already, read 'Men are from Mars, women are from Venus', it's really good at explaining how men and women think.
I'm not sure what sort of advice you want (I'm better at solution focused advice) so if you've got any specific questions you want to pose that you think might help your situation, I would happily give my perspective.
But speaking as a woman, I think your W still loves you.
Jo wrote
------
You never know, you might get your inhouse *miaow* then.
--------
Will I walk strange after? I hope, I hope
re: looking at this site.
I do tell her the general purpose and what some people are discussing. If W knew I was posting my / our problems here there would be an atomic explosion and she might say you were an online affair I was having. I hope I am not comming across as trying to pick-up anyone. Cyber friends are good.
W has her rules which do not make sence to me sometimes. W has some minor medical conditions which she tells some people but it is a major sin to tell some relatives about them.
I think the best thing I can do is listen to her some but not let her turn it into verbal abuse thing like Mrs Tag. Also have more selfconfidence in my opinions and actions. Quiit being a nice guy and resenting it. Do what a man should do so his W thinks of him as strong that is able to protect his and her kingdom, not a wimpy person that can't protect her.
