Quote: If I were bolete, I'd be trying to gently continue the conversation to get at the heart of the matter. Especially since they are committed to staying married.
We're spending at least an hour every day taking long walks and discussing feelings, hopes, fears, possibilities...and this is going to continue. When sex isn't working, you've got to work on all the other things that are holding your marriage together, and we're doing that too.
[quote[If she was wanting out of the M, I'd say more power to her..but she's not. She is holding his sexuality hostage along with her own.
Oh come on, she's not holding me hostage. She doesn't have a gun. If I decided I wanted sex more than I wanted the marriage, I could divorce her. Frankly, if I had an affair, I think she would forgive me, or if I pushed for an open marriage she would probably consent, but I think either of these would eventually lead the marriage to fall apart (and I don't believe in these things anyway, but it took me about a week of serious pondering to remember what my values and beliefs are).
Quote: So she'd better be DAMN sure that she is correct in her thinking and is not letting naivete lead her into a declaration of something she's not. Being aroused by naked chicks does not a lesbian make.
I think she's taking this process very, very seriously.
Quote: She can't have it both ways, I guess is what my gut feeling is.
If I had to choose between giving up sex and giving up my wife, it would be like choosing whether to have my left arm or my right arm amputated. Since I'm right handed, it's actually a clear choice, but not an easy one. And I do want to keep my wife. That means she doesn't actually *have* to choose one or the other, but it's gonna hurt if I don't find some way to keep both.
Quote: However, it's not my M and I wish the both of them the best of luck in whatever path they choose.
Quote: Your sexual identity is exactly what you identify it to be.
Bingo.
Quote: I like seeing beautiful women naked, like HP said, because I like seeing all sorts of unique and beautiful things, but I don't have the urge to touch or be touched like I do when I'm in the presence of a sexually attractive man.
By that standard, I'm clearly a lesbian. One of the things my wife and I have in common.
Quote: I guess I don't see that she's doing that. It may be the easiest piece to verbalize, or the revelation that opened her eyes, but I don't get the feeling that she's so simplistic in her thinking.
You're right. My wife is very richly textured, subtle, and educated. Maybe I'm not communicating this very well, it's not easy to describe her journey.
Quote: This may not be true for everyone, but for me, being a lesbian means wanting to be with a woman. For Jonathan's sake, I'm worried that's where W's evolution will lead her.
I keep reading about "lesbian bed death", where the sex slowly stops, but the relationship carries on with intensity. That intense relationship seems to be more important than the sex. am I getting this right?
Quote: I don't agree that she's holding his sexuality hostage any more than he is holding hers. Everybody is an adult and has to make their own choices. It pains me to think how difficult those choices are.
And as long as we are married, at least with our current understanding, we're holding each other hostage.
Quote: I do agree with everything else you say, especially in wishing them the best.
Quote: I can't imagine having sex with a guy because I had a crush on his girlfriend. Are straight women more likely to feel this way than straight men?
I should add that this reason was one I came up with after the fact when I tried to explain my behavior to myself. The "real" reason I had sex with my female friend was we were both young and attractive and we were on vacation together in Florida and we both had boyfriends who weren't with us that we didn't want to "cheat" on with other guys. So we hung out at the beach and went dancing and got quite drunk and ended up having sex with each other because we got so horny not letting ourselves have sex with any of the readily available men. So maybe it was just a simple case of life mimicing porn unworthy of further analysis.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
So, did she ever like sex, with anyone? I am wondering about your choice of the word aversion. That is such a strong word. I think about the commercials for fear factor and those people eating yucky things. I have an aversion to tobacco smoke, it makes me cough, sneeze, and feel so nauseated. I will get up and move if a smoker sits next to me. So, is this what you mean when you say she has an aversion to sex with you?
It sounds as if you made peace with this years and years ago. At least have agreed that living with your best friend is what you want. You sound content and in love.
Arguing with reality is like trying to teach a cat to bark—hopeless. (Byron Katie)
Insufficient data. Neither of us ever really dated before we met each other. In circa 1993, when I had those two brief affairs, I felt for the first time what it meant to have a woman wildly turned on by my body. That's never happened with my wife.
Quote: I am wondering about your choice of the word aversion. That is such a strong word.
Her word, not mine. It feels like someone just kicked me in the stomach when I hear that word.
Quote: I think about the commercials for fear factor and those people eating yucky things. I have an aversion to tobacco smoke, it makes me cough, sneeze, and feel so nauseated. I will get up and move if a smoker sits next to me. So, is this what you mean when you say she has an aversion to sex with you?
I don't know - she's afraid of telling me this in too much detail, because she can feel how much it hurts me. And talking openly about this is really, really new for us.
Quote: It sounds as if you made peace with this years and years ago. At least have agreed that living with your best friend is what you want. You sound content and in love.
That's partly because it's true, and partly because I'm telling the part of the truth that the rest of y'all aren't telling. If nobody were representing the fact that sexlessness is tough, I would be. And I might mention that I have chronic migraines and just long to be ... well, you get the idea.
I haven't really made my peace with sexlessness, but I'm sure about wanting my wife. That kind of makes the sexless decision for me.
Quote: partly because I'm telling the part of the truth that the rest of y'all aren't telling.
I have to say I'm dead curious to know what you meant by this.
After I started taking a strong stand on the sex issue my H once said to me "I'm actually kind of relieved to find out that there is something that would make you want to leave our relationship.". Have you ever given your W reason to believe that you would be okay without her? Sometimes the love that seems to make you strong is really the crutch that keeps you weak or the cage that keeps you trapped.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Quote: partly because I'm telling the part of the truth that the rest of y'all aren't telling.
I have to say I'm dead curious to know what you meant by this.
Well, I think both of the following statements are equally true:
1. Not having sex is a major bummer.
2. There are other things in life that are more important than sex, despite what our obsessed culture seems to preach. Love, maturity, and stable families come to mind.
I think all y'all are doing an adequate job of preaching #1, so I don't have to. I've been focussing more on #2. But not having sex will always hurt, and hurt bad. I do feel like I'm going to explode much of the time. I'm doing a *lot* of running, which seems to help. I've never found a shower cold enough to make a difference. And there are plenty of times that I'm talking to a woman, and I realize that I'm looking at her like a hungry man looks at a chocolate cake. Sigh.
At first I can't imagine living without sex - then I remind myself about what's more important, what my commitments are, that I'm not going to go out and have an affair, that I'm not going to get a divorce and find another wife, that these other things are more important. It takes discipline.
Quote: After I started taking a strong stand on the sex issue my H once said to me "I'm actually kind of relieved to find out that there is something that would make you want to leave our relationship.". Have you ever given your W reason to believe that you would be okay without her? Sometimes the love that seems to make you strong is really the crutch that keeps you weak or the cage that keeps you trapped.
I simply don't believe that sex is more important than my commitment to my wife, our children, and our marriage. Which is saying a lot about the importance of that commitment.
Good luck man. Is your wife affectionate? I have the double whammy, littles sex and virtually no affection, they seem to go hand-in-hand. Does your wife fill your love tank in other ways? That can sometimes help. My wife NEVER adds to my love tank. I am running on empty.
You mention other things that are important in life. I agree they are all important. It just depends on which ones are MOST important to you.
Quote: I simply don't believe that sex is more important than my commitment to my wife, our children, and our marriage. Which is saying a lot about the importance of that commitment.
Gotcha . Of course, you are right in saying that most members of this BB feel that way more or less. If we didn't we wouldn't be on this BB. We'd be on the AdultFriendFinder BB . In my case, I guess my commitment to raising my children with my H is strong enough to withstand lack of sex but I'm not sure how far I'm willing to go beyond that. I respect you for your willingness to make sacrifices for what you believe in.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
. Of course, you are right in saying that most members of this BB feel that way more or less. If we didn't we wouldn't be on this BB. We'd be on the AdultFriendFinder BB 
. In my case, I guess my commitment to raising my children with my H is strong enough to withstand lack of sex but I'm not sure how far I'm willing to go beyond that. I respect you for your willingness to make sacrifices for what you believe in.