HP, I can see how pressure and the need to bring the tools can cause the tools to not be there. Now that W and I have stepped up the frequency, I've been finding that the instant erection is no longer a fact of life unless it has been a while. If I sense a lack of interest on her part, willie goes to nillie and it takes a large show of interest to get even a small rise. Kinda leaves me questioning my manhood a bit, is rather embarrassing, and I worry that it may be interpreted as her not being able to turn me on. really kind of sucks to feel horny, but when it comes to show time having nothing to show for it I guess I can sort of see your point, especially if a fear of not rising to the occasion makes it true all the time.
SD, I agree with you, provided S is willing to engage in other than just IC in the LM. In a case where LM is strictly IC, ie. no oral, no toys, etc, the repertoire is so limited that without an erection there is little that is possible beyond cuddling and maybe a HJ without any lubricants (if you see it differently, please educate me).
He doesn't have a problem getting an erection. I suspect that it is more resentment that he HAS to get one in order to proceed that precludes him from even trying.
So when he's not in the mood..meaning he has little desire right then..he knows that he is the main star of the event (this is his perception now folks)..so he refuses to participate.
I don't know why this is...but I haven't heard of too many (any?) LD men who are willing to offer a HJ in lieu of intercourse. It seems to be an all or nothing mentality. Perhaps because a man would feel even LESS manly to have to offer a HJ, whereas a woman would do it because she would feel 'normal' as a woman who occasionally has to offer something to make up for the widely-known disparity between male and female desire.
I think you should start a thread about the erection issues.
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I thought I would chime in here about the "not needing an erection to have sex." This is true however, it would never occur to my H that holding me, stroking me, telling me I'm sexy and giving me oral or a hj would be sufficient sometimes. I have even mentioned this but it doesn't happen. When couples have such disparate desires and are in gridlock it seems that there is no negotiation around the issue of sex. As in, "I understand that you want sex but I am too tired, stressed, etc... so how about x?"
My H had a few erectile difficulties early in the R due to anxiety - he had only had two prior lovers and didn't have much experience even with them. Now he doesn't have that trouble but I still wonder to what extent he worries about it. He may not worry about it under normal circumstances but when he is stressed or tired the worry might surface. KWIM?
Quote: SD, I agree with you, provided S is willing to engage in other than just IC in the LM. In a case where LM is strictly IC, ie. no oral, no toys, etc, the repertoire is so limited...
It's sad and, yes, problematic. There are plenty of problems out there without creating unnecessary ones. Sigh.
Quote: that without an erection there is little that is possible beyond cuddling and maybe a HJ without any lubricants (if you see it differently, please educate me).
There was an article on the smartmarriages.com website (which I can't find now because they don't have any decent search feature... ). It was a conference presentation by ??? Bill Doherty maybe? He mentioned speaking to a therapist friend of his, a woman whose husband had become totally impotent because of some physical problem (he could still have an orgasm, but no erection). The author was amazed that his friend reported that she and her H had a great sex life and were thrilled that they had the opportunity to discover what lies beyond the limited sex they had before. Lest you think they were doing anything wild, she was basically straddling and rubbing, which got them both the big O that they found to be way better than that from the old way.
It seems to me that many people focus on what they don't (or might not) have around sex when no matter how much you don't have, there are still infinite possibilities in what you do have. I think all sexual problems exist entirely in the brain. Except in cases of overcoming abuse, sexual problems all have to do with attitude and (lack of) imagination.
I think that, in my H's case, he has a hard time seeing the infinite possibilities because he is so inundated with what he "doesn't have". Meaning, an excess of desire. The messages he receives daily (from his coworkers, from television, etc) are that men have an excess of desire. So when he doesn't feel that way, all he can focus on is what he doesn't have--not the possibilities.
Wives who have a lower sex drive are not receiving the same types of messages, day in and day out. That ALL of the other wives out there are sex maniacs, etc. So I am not surprised that, in general, the wives are more apt to think of other possibilities--they have been conditioned to just know that their mates sex drive will outstrip theirs and that there will be a need to provide something in the interim.
No, SD, is not necessary for great sex (this coming from one who has played for both teams), However, it is so important. Not because that we all can't have a good time without an erect penis, but I think men ( I am only guessing) tie so much of their self worth to their penises. You just have to look in all that junk email we get about penis enlargement and enhancing and see that there all whole industries dedicated to them.
I think that whole performance anxiety sets in and we begin the whole cycle that is so hard to break.
So, for me ( because I only know about me), when my husband could not get an erection or worse yet, lose the erection right before intercourse, I felt that there was something so ugly about me. It made me feel so unwomanly. I felt the way you might feel if every time you were making love to your partner, she suddenly got the urge to vomit.
Now we all know feelings aren't facts. But those are the feelings elicited.
Arguing with reality is like trying to teach a cat to bark—hopeless. (Byron Katie)
To be quite honest the sexual gap in my R with my H always was there...but it was easy to excuse away at the beginning. There were some extenuating circumstances causing excess stress the 1st year we were together..so I thought "he's just stressed out", and with good reason...my bad!
I knew from the beginning that we didn't have sex as often as I had in other R's. But in other R's I would be considered the LD partner...so it really didn't dawn on me that we had such an abnormal SL until after we were married a year. During that first year of M things calmed down greatly for us, but the frequency of sex never increased...and I had NEVER been in a R where the man didn't initiate....ever!
I knew too that my H had been in a few bad R's w/very controlling women who used to withhold sex....supposedly they told him that he wasn't normal for wanting it so often (which I've come to learn wasn't often at all). So once again I excused the behavior and attributed it to them...thought I could be a patient/loving/encouraging W and everything would fix itself...NOT!
My feelings began to overwhelm me and I noticed myself beginning to become depressed...moody...irritable...frustrated etc. I began to feel completely ignored, unloved, and unimportant. I mean my H would materialistically give me anything I could ever wish for. Emotionally/physically however he seemed to simply shut down.
We would ML only when I would finally break down and initiate it...which by the way I had never had to do before, so learning to do that was difficult in itself. He'd get into ML and we'd both enjoy it...but he would never start it or even give me any inkling that he even wanted it.
I tried every approach I could possibly think of to get this out in the open...everything I tried only pushed him further away. I tried to talk calmly about it, I got upset about it, I tried to relate to him....nothing, everything was considered "nagging". Nothing worked at all until the day I put my foot down and told him we wouldn't be having another anniversary unless we sought out counseling because I was too young to live the rest of my life celibate.
It didn't take long for our C to see that my H had some issues and that he had in fact been treating me EXACTLY the same way he was treated by his ex-wife...defensively, from a stance of "I'll never let anyone do that to me again!!"...so he did it to me first.
That was the beginning of some progress for us...our communication has now really improved. Now we're going to seek out a C to help specifically with the sexual issues. I've DRUG out of my H that yes he does occasionally think about sex with me (he used to say he never thought about it at all) but that by the time he gets home...he gets distracted, or he's too tired...or some other excuse. So basically I think he ignores the twinges of desire, or simply suffocates them LOL. It's simply not a priority for him...and lets face it, I'm not getting it and I want it...it's become a BIG priority for me.
The really frustrating thing for me is this...he tells me he loves me, I'm the best thing that's ever happened to him and he wants this marriage to work. I've told him in plain no-holds-barred language what I need of him (to initiate sex occasionally and to ML at least 1 time every 2 weeks, hopefully more) and he doesn't step up to the plate.
He takes care of other things in his life that are important to him...but not this. It doesn't make me feel very important...and it doesn't make me feel like a priority in his life. The question is how do I make it a priority for him?
Okay, this is just a question. But I am wondering if those of us that would define ourselves as high drive women, pretty much agree it is not orgasms alone that we are after, but validation, among other things. I am wondering out loud, if my high drive also translates to high maintenance in other areas for my low drive hubby.
Arguing with reality is like trying to teach a cat to bark—hopeless. (Byron Katie)
I agree, des, and I think others will, too, that one of the important components of sex with our partners is validation of our womanliness.
Stubborn wrote
Quote: It was a conference presentation by ??? Bill Doherty maybe? He mentioned speaking to a therapist friend of his, a woman whose husband had become totally impotent because of some physical problem (he could still have an orgasm, but no erection). The author was amazed that his friend reported that she and her H had a great sex life and were thrilled that they had the opportunity to discover what lies beyond the limited sex they had before. Lest you think they were doing anything wild, she was basically straddling and rubbing, which got them both the big O that they found to be way better than that from the old way.
It seems to me that many people focus on what they don't (or might not) have around sex when no matter how much you don't have, there are still infinite possibilities in what you do have. I think all sexual problems exist entirely in the brain. Except in cases of overcoming abuse, sexual problems all have to do with attitude and (lack of) imagination.
I absolutely agree with this. My husband was completely impotent due to diabetes and also did not ejaculate, but still had spine-shaking orgasms. During the early part of our marriage (before the depression took its toll) our sex life was very imaginative and loving. One of the best periods in our life was a time when he was at home for a week recuperating from leg bypass surgery (still had both legs at this point) and all we did all day was eat, watch movies, and ML.
Anyone who wonders about this subject just has to watch that Viet Nam era movie "Coming Home" with Jane Fonda and Jon Voight, where Jon, the paraplegic, gives Jane her first orgasm. That scene is one of the hottest ever filmed.
I guess I can sort of see your point, especially if a fear of not rising to the occasion makes it true all the time.
