PG, If you Hub is anything like me he's a get to the point now! You're wrestling with demons and he doesn't get it. Neither did I. Now I face this "give time and space" approach and it's killing me. But, I'm here DBing and W is not. She even picked up DB and got mad at it. I am absolutely the worst the worst person to provide counsel at this but hey, even a turtle wouldn't get anywhere if he didn't stick his neck out! Tell H someting like this "Honey, I've been with you long enough to know you want to understand how to put this behind us but I'm really struggling. It's part you and it's part me and I've got to fix me first. I need time and I need some patience from you. Our relationship is too important for a bandaid fix. We need permanent repairs an that will take time. If you can't give me that time I can understand." If my W would say that I'd be in 7th heaven but nooooooo! It's the same old "you're no good, you don't love me, you've been a terrible husband and father, yada, yada, yada and I hate your dog!" Hang in there. Aren't you inspired by the people like geneva who open their heart to you?