Quote: JJ, what you say about separating the choirs is a very good illustration of the developmental difference between boys and girls at that age IMHO. I'm in a college choir and that problem doesn't exist with us. Our tenors and basses are fabulous.
Umm, maybe, but not in the way I think you mean. There have been boys choirs for a llllooooonnnngggg time, and they have no problem with musicality!!! Actually, for whatever reason (and I'm sure we could draw A LOT of conclusions from this), I would say that a great many boys choirs could outperform mixed or girls choirs of this age.
Ok, I was wondering why noone commented on this...thought I had posted this last night, apparently it got lost some where...
My C suggested last night that one way to get H's attention would be to move into the guest room.
As usual, I'm having trouble making up my mind on this one , thought I'd ask your advice. Part of me thinks this is sort of just 'escaping', part of me relishes the thought of not having to 'worry' about H being affectionate in the morning, underlines that I'm serious about this???
FF: I've gone back and forth on my own plans to move to the basement. I'm still in the bedroom, but, if things don't work out with the C we are seeing, and if I don't see any more effort on W's part, I can envision myself living in the basement before the daffodils pop up.
It's a complicated set of questions. Do I force us to deal with our issues better when we're in the same room, or different rooms? Am I doing this to make a point? Is it the proper point? Is it the right time to make it? Is this just a step towards separating permanently? Is moving to another room the right thing for ME?
I can't answer these questions for you, but they will provide a start for you to focus on while you make your own decision.
Flutie, I don't know what to say about the guest room. For me, it would have been only to complete Part One of the Exodus. That is, I wouldn't have done it to make a "statement". Because, after all, you are making that statement to your kids as well and you don't want to be jackin around with their feelings of security. In my mind, I had a series of events that would happen if the marriage were ending (or, in my case, I was moving out--he would never go for a D) and that was the first one.
I would NOT do it as a way to get his attention. Let your actions be those of someone who acts out of love and integrity. If you don't feel loving and like getting up and cooking for him, don't do it. He WILL adjust. The temper tantrums probably won't last for more than a day or two.
In fact, I think doing things like this will get his attention faster and more effectively underscore what you're trying to do than moving into another room.
I think a separation( even in the same house) can be effective to shock your H into reflecting on his behavior, but I see it as a last resort measure. Right now your focus should be on you (making and maintaining changes such as setting goals, being more assertive, confronting H). Try not to back down and keep the pressure on. I used the guest room as a decompression zone after particularly difficult battles. I did have an exit plan( with H moving to the guest room as a first step) but tried not to fantasize about it too much.
IHJ, you talked about setting goals, standing up to H, and especially applying the pressure is when this whole thing sort of blew up in my face - the week with my Dad, with H acting like a complete jerk (to the point that my Dad was ready to haul me onto the plane, and is still asking me when I'm filing for D), then as I continued, H pushes me in a strange convo, throws himself onto the floor in a screaming fit, not to mention yelling at the kids, and me.
And yet, here I am, thinking, he's almost been in a good mood the past few days, maybe I should give him a chance again.
I don't know how many times I've asked him to join me in C, though maybe I should continue asking, since last time he did give me a reason - he thought it was stupid to talk to a stranger about his problems. (I did point out that he was not even willing to talk to me about them.)
I know, I sound angry. I am. Angry, tired, and confused. And the worst of it is, I know full well that I could just go on like this, continue to run myself ragged, get joy from being with the kids, get what I can from my job, and pretend I don't really notice what I am missing.
I've sold myself short for far too long. Even staying here in a 'safe' country where opening your mouth to say 'hello' is seen as a bold, assertive act.
I can stand up to my H, I can't stand up to myself.
I have to point something out here...someone else may bust my chops for it...but here goes...
Quote: H throws himself onto the floor in a screaming fit, not to mention yelling at the kids, and me....And yet, here I am, thinking, he's almost been in a good mood the past few days, maybe I should give him a chance again.
You do realize that many abused women fall into this same pattern don't you? His behavior has been very abusive. Now I'm not saying walk out the door, or move into another room...although I do agree with changing your behavior and perhaps not doing everything you have been for him. But recognize the fact that you're falling into a pattern here. Many abused people continue to take their spouse back...because they continue to see glimpses of the person they know they can be.
I know what you are going through is a tough thing to endure (((HUGS))).
Hang in there! Oh and my S1 still has not had a chance to play in any snow...what a bummer! GEL
GEL is right; the rules are different in abusive situations. Persistence is the key to change, but if someone is unstable as to be violent/suicidal/out of control, all bets are off. You must do whatever it takes to protect yourself and your children.
I know you are angry for allowing yourself to be treated this way for so long. Part of that anger is healthy in that it mobilizes you to feel like a separate person and declare" this is me now." It helps to define the personal boundaries that have been missing. But staying in the anger, as you know, is not good for your health; detach and do good things for you.
Please take care...again, if abuse is in the picture, then separation may be necessary.
Quote: he thought it was stupid to talk to a stranger about his problems
My answer to people who voice this objection is that we all consult professionals all the time for help with problems in our lives-- plumbers, hairdressers, mechanics, doctors, veterinarians, dentists. Maybe we didn't back in the old days, but today we do. Does he fix the toilet? Did he design the house you live it? Does he cut everyone's hair and give the dog its shots? Did he expect you to have your babies at home alone or did you call in an obstetrician or a midwife?
My bf tends to apply a medical model to counseling/therapy; he thinks going to a C is admitting you're not functioning, you're sick, you're broken. You go to a C to fix you. Once you're better, you stop going. To me, this is not what counseling/therapy is.
I apply more of a teaching/coaching model. The coach teaches, supports, studies the team and helps it to play better-- to reach the goal. Our C functions very much like this. She listens to us interact-- and we have no trouble getting into it in front of her! And she points where she sees we are miscommunicating.
Or you could use the example of a dance instructor-- "See, when you turn this way, his foot is there, and that's why you keep stepping on it." Professional dancers take a dance class every day of their lives. It's not "talking to a stranger" about their problems with dancing, it's asking an professional who has seen lots of dancers help them stand better, move better, keep themselves from injury, etc.
People consult YOU when they want to learn to play the flute, don't they? Even very good golfers and tennis players will take a lession with the pro when they can. No one says to them "You must be a really cr*ppy player if you have to go to the pro for coaching."
When companies get into disputes-- and sometimes even countries-- they bring in mediators to help both sides communicate with each other.
I have to say, that although I believe in counseling very much, for someone as troubled as your H, it's the first step on the journey of a thousand miles... Counseling may serve more to support you than to contribute to any changes in him. It may also let you express in safety in front of a third party how frustrated and unhappy you are. It would probably be worth it to just to get this acknowledged and validated.
FF, Did you read The 17 Warning Sings of a Bad Boyfriend / H? I am not suggesting you do anything if you decide your H is good or bad in your own terms. I just posted it sort of like a measuring stick. I know the list is not meant as a pass or fail test, just a general, in or out of ball park scale.
I likes Lill's idea of hiriing professionals to help with things we are not experts. Could you come up with something why people chould consult with a pharmacist instead of choosing drugs on their own?
, thought I'd ask your advice. Part of me thinks this is sort of just 'escaping', part of me relishes the thought of not having to 'worry' about H being affectionate in the morning, underlines that I'm serious about this???
