I was going to post on Is it even possible to motivate a LD women? but I didn't want to hijack, nor do I know if my comments are welcome anymore. So, here's another of my own threads.
I am a lot like a "current" CeMar and GreenEyedLass... and a lot like a "former" honeypot. I have a SSM since D3 was born. I do a ton of things at home (all the laundry, most of the food buying, all of the finances, all of the house maintenance, most of the clean-up). W and I both work fulltime. Both of our sets of parents are still married (1st marriages of 38+ years). Weekends are divided between both sets of parents, with Saturday going to my inlaws and Sunday to my parents/grandma. I get the feeling that my W thinks she can't do more in life... and I suspect that she's in the middle of a MLC. And so it goes.
For me, finding a way to approach my W about things without pissing her off is Job #1, and it's most difficult. When I start a serious discussion, my W gets very quiet at the beginning... and I know what her first thoughts are most of the time: "oh great, here we go again... and it's always about HIM and what HE needs!" How do I prevent this? I can't. I just have to continue regardless. At this point, I feel I have nothing to lose.
Sex with W is twice a month at most, and these days, I'm just letting W initiate when she feels like it. I tried a "sex twice a week" experiment during September, and it failed to really do much for me (besides making me feel like the last 2 times W gave me "mercy sex" to appease me). I'm finding ways to drown my sex drive because I know that that's not the #1 "thing" to work on. There are tons of other issues.
So, what am I left with? I'll tell ya. I'm left with improving myself and working on self-validation of my life. I won't do things anymore just because W will like that I did them. I won't keep quiet when I feel like I have something to say, even if it sounds mean or pissy. I won't go out of my way to appease the whims of my W like I used to. Avoidance got me where I am today, and I refuse to follow that path.
I think you finally got it!!! See if you start doing things for yourself, self-validating if-you-will, that's going to eventually make your W take notice. You've just started the ball of change rolling!!!!
Oh, and by the way...if you approach your W about something and it pisses her off so-be-it. You've said what you need to. Keep the communication clear...and if she gets pissed off do your best not to let her anger rub off on you. I find that the calmer I remain during an argument with my LDH the more #1 he takes me seriously, & #2 he hears me.
I want to clarify, though, that all throughout the SSM busting process I have remained a nice and loving wife. At no time did I feel free to say mean or pissy things to my H. Not that I DIDN'T, lol, but that I really tried not to and if I did slip, I would apologize. Differentiating means to hold onto yourself and keep being the great person you are, despite what your spouse throws your way. It does NOT give one license to act like a jerk all in the name of "marriage repair".
When I laid it on the line with H, I attempted to do in a kind and loving fashion. It was with great sadness and tears that I informed him that I would move on if he chose not to pursue this with me. I have had to be firm MANY times in my marriage, in order to get my point across, and bluntly honest about our sex life and the depth of my sexual longings. But I never tried to intentionally inflict pain.
And I always did things that my H would like, simply because he likes them. Why would you stop doing these things? How is that going to get you closer to your goal?
IS your goal a loving R with your wife, or just more sanity for yourself?
Maybe I am misinterpreting your post...?
Again, I just wanted to clear up what my m.o. was. Former HP or current HP, I have always been nice and kind to my H, just sometimes I have been more successful in my efforts. Along the way of becoming a better wife, I clarified what it was that I wanted out of a marriage and what I was not willing to go without. That is when I told him what would happen if things didn't change. I have always tried to remain empathetic towards my LD partner, though I still do not understand what makes him tick.
I won't do things anymore just because W will like that I did them.
Quote: Differentiating means to hold onto yourself and keep being the great person you are, despite what your spouse throws your way. It does NOT give one license to act like a jerk all in the name of "marriage repair".
Now who said I was gonna act like a jerk? I probably should have worded that as, "I won't do anything additional just because W will like that I did it." I'll still be Super-Me. I'll still give her her coffee in the morning and get her the low-fat Silhouettes Chocolate-Peanut Butter ice cream flying saucer & coffee at night... still make dinner on Mondays & Tuesdays... still get the chinese food on Fridays... keep doing her laundry when she asks... etc. etc. I hope she doesn't want more 'cause I'm about out of gas.
Quote: IS your goal a loving R with your wife, or just more sanity for yourself?
Egad, you mean they're mutually exclusive? Pigs balls! I know the sanity thing is tough with D6 and D2 around, but I'm not giving up on that just because I need some lovin' R.
All kidding aside, I hope that my W wants to work on things for her own good. I don't know how she could be happy with the current state of things between us, but she's not sayin' much to indicate that she's unhappy. This is why I'm thinking MLC - a certain level of denial exists, and she seems not to be aware of it. That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
I know I mentioned this before, but let me repeat. Once I spent 3 weeks stripping wallpaper off a bedroom wall, patching cracks in the ceiling, and applying several coats of paint in two colors. When I finally finished, I called my W in to have a look. Her response was: "I (W) sure picked nice colors." As if the dang paint just flew onto the walls by itself!
My point is that the amount and difficulty of the work you do may be lost on your W. There have been many times when she has taken credit for a project that I completed, because she pushed me to do it.
I went on strike a few weeks ago, partially to press my concerns about W not sleeping with me alone, and partially to show her all the things I do (during the strike, I still took care of the kids much of the time). The strike was tough for both of us and I don't recommend it for everyone, but I think I made my point.
Also, remember SuprDave. He claimed to do maybe two minutes of chores a day, and was appreciated for it! He must have known how to do those two minutes at just the right time!
It sounds like you are not appreciated and that bums you out.
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I hope she doesn't want more 'cause I'm about out of gas.
Sorry, but I'm afraid it doesn't work that way. It's grow or die, and something's bound to some up that she just HAS to have you do.
Quote: Oh, and by the way...if you approach your W about something and it pisses her off so-be-it. You've said what you need to. Keep the communication clear...and if she gets pissed off do your best not to let her anger rub off on you.
This is very important. It is not your job to avoid pissing off your spouse, especially when something is really bugging you. You have to speak up. Suffering in silence doesn't get you anywhere. Just because they get mad, doesn't mean you didn't say it nicely and in a grownup way. Their anger can be a tool to shut you up. Unplug that tool... don't let their anger keep you from voicing your needs and desires. Cemar, this is for you, too.
Quote: Unplug that tool... don't let their anger keep you from voicing your needs and desires.
Oh yes, I agree. I think it was in PM that Schnarch wrote something like, "what do you mean you don't communicate well with your spouse? You're arguing and fighting, aren't you?"
In the past, I would let W's angry words "get to me" and shut me up. Now, they only distract me temporarily. I give W time to "cool off," and then I make my point at a less tense time of the day. Unfortunately for me, W's usual reaction to my point is to walk away and not bring it up again. Progress? I'm not sure.
Sounds like a good plan. But do listen to HP, she has some good advice.
Exmaple - this morning it was next to impossible to get D6 and D8 up for school. I had to carry D6 downstairs, and feed her! I knew, since I had called them last evening from school, that they had gone to bed fairly late again...
As I was getting their coats on, it took forever to find their hats and mittens - we have a wire 'closet organizer' in one side of the closet with pull out drawers where we keep the hats + stuff. I had gone through and organized it a couple of weeks ago, but it had 'collapsed' the other day (I have an ongoing battle with that thing...looks like a good idea but it's not built well, it was here when we moved in, and I would love to find a better solution, but that's another story ) Anyway, H + kids had put it back together last night, and in doing so, H had 'organized' things.
My first reaction was 'why does H always think his way of doing things is better!!' and I thought, 'now I'm not going to stand for this!', and planned to march upstairs as soon as the girls left and confront H.
Instead, I took a breath, realized I did appreciate very much that H had fixed the ?%#*! thing, and my bringing that up would only start a fight, and what I 'really' needed to talk about was the girls bedtime.
So I 'chose' my battle, realized that H doesn't really care how that thing is organized as long as it's easy to get to stuff, put things back the way I had them, and tried to figure out what to do about the bedtimes.
Took me a while to decide how to do that, I knew if I waited till H came down for breakfast, he'd be in his 'I'm in a hurry!' mode, and I wouldn't get to say anything.
But I was exhausted, don't function well on less than 6 hrs sleep, and I'm pretty sure I'm going to have to talk with (difficult) mother of difficult student this evening...so I think it might be a good idea to just take a nap while I can and wait a while...
When I got to bed, H was awake, so I decided I might as well do it now - asked him how I could help to make things easier for him to get the girls to sleep earlier. I told him what the morning had been like.
We ended up having a pretty decent convo about it, and H gave me a hug and kiss at the end.
Sorry this is so long, but I just wanted to show what can happen when you 'choose' your 'fights' and how to present them. Ok, this was a much less heated topic than sex, but as you've seen, at our house, at the wrong time, just about anything can be a 'hot' topic.
Good luck Chris. I'll write more on my own thread when I get some time.
I pick my battles... and recently have had more than usual. Really, though, they're ones that are difficult to avoid. I just have no energy left sometimes.
I probably should have worded that as, "I won't do anything additional just because W will like that I did it." I'll still be Super-Me. I'll still give her her coffee in the morning and get her the low-fat Silhouettes Chocolate-Peanut Butter ice cream flying saucer & coffee at night... still make dinner on Mondays & Tuesdays... still get the chinese food on Fridays... keep doing her laundry when she asks... etc. etc. I hope she doesn't want more 'cause I'm about out of gas.
