I've been kind of busy - had a halloween party for the kids yesterday afternoon, then H + I went to a friend's house to eat last night.
H has been walking around like a sick puppy all week. He basically avoids me unless he absolutely has to talk. I've been pleasant, but I haven't been seeking him out.
Last night before we left (he was out all day - he's getting a specialization, taking courses) he said 'I'm in a bad mood, I've been depressed all week. I just thought I'd let you know'
When we got into the car, I tried to bring it up. We did talk a little, found out, as I suspected that when I yelled, he just shut down - 'I just figured, here she goes again', when I tried to continue, calmly, H turned the radio up.
We had a wonderful dinner, and good conversation with our friends and one other couple, a few times I found myself seeing the man I married...When we got in the car to get home, H turned to me and said 'Have you ever considered learning a few basics of the Finnish language' To his credit, he didn't interrupt me during dinner, but he wasn't sitting next to me, either.
I wasn't sure how to respond, and said as much, he continued, I asked him how he would feel if I asked him to learn English after we had had a nice night out with my friends, he said 'How do you think I feel when you yell'. and turned on the radio, rather loud.
So. I've been just doing some soul-searching. I need time to think about my part in this, and to keep myself strong so I don't 'take his bait'. I now have a number for a C, and I'll call on Mon., at least go once (She's an hr. away)
I haven't been here much, 'cause I really feel I need to work things out alone right now. I'll stop in from time to time.
Quote: So. I've been just doing some soul-searching. I need time to think about my part in this, and to keep myself strong so I don't 'take his bait'. I now have a number for a C, and I'll call on Mon., at least go once (She's an hr. away)
One of the first questions you should have for the C is, "are you pro-marriage?" It might sound silly, but many C's have a skewed view of troubled M and will "convince you" that leaving the M is the best solution. I should know... my personal C is one of these. I hope that the one you found is pro-marriage.
Quote: I haven't been here much, 'cause I really feel I need to work things out alone right now. I'll stop in from time to time.
Yes, work things out alone... sounds like a good plan. You have been here on DB to start the process, and now you need to do your own thing. I'm thinking of doing the same thing. good luck!
Quote: One of the first questions you should have for the C is, "are you pro-marriage?" It might sound silly, but many C's have a skewed view of troubled M and will "convince you" that leaving the M is the best solution. I should know... my personal C is one of these. I hope that the one you found is pro-marriage.
Chris,
I do understand that you have to be carefull when choosing a C -if you don't mind my asking, how is your C's view of your M 'skewed'? And how does she try to convince you that D is the best answer?
Quote: if you don't mind my asking, how is your C's view of your M 'skewed'? And how does she try to convince you that D is the best answer?
My C is worried that my W is having an affair or that conditions are ripe for one for her. That doesn't sound like pro-M to me. That sounds like an alarmist who is trying to get me to go crazy looking for signs and snooping on my W. Also, she said back 6 months ago when I first started that she can tell if a M has a chance of succeeding... and recently she has said things like, "I don't know if you are going to have any success with this woman (W)" and "she seems like she's content to drag everyone else down with her instead of having to make the difficult decisions" and "it sounds like you're roommates and friends instead of spouses, and I doubt that anything will change unless you get marriage counseling." Maybe I'm just being pessimistic.
The thing is, my C sees me trying different things to be better and "fix" things... and she (like some of my friends) has said, "I see great progress with your own self in the last 6 months, but I don't see any progress in the marriage. It's more like you try something and then give up because your W doesn't respond the way that you want her to. How much longer are you going to try without having another plan?" I don't know if she means exit plan or other plan. She confuses me all the time.
Anyway, maybe I'm the one who is seriously messed up. Maybe I want too much and will never be happy. I haven't figured out what's going on, and the C hasn't really helped me grow up.
It's also possible that over time this is merely your C's honest opinion. It doesn't sound like you are willing to give up on your M & your W yet I forget, does your W attending C at all? If not perhaps (if she's willing) it is time to request her to attend marriage counseling with you.
Here's a bit of advice that is worth considering. I suggested my C that she get The DR book. She did and her tune changed after she read the book. In pre-DR sessions, she asked me "how long are you going to wait?, "need to move on." You might want to tell your C about DR.
No, there's no joint counseling going on... just my personal C (who is within walking distance to where I work). W has not made efforts (that I know of) to find a C for herself, nor has she agreed to see a marriage C with me - and I have suggested it twice this year. I'm not going to give up just yet, and if you've read my own thread, you can tell that I'm doing stupid things just to get a reaction, perhaps because I think I can wake my W up and make her want to see a C. Guess that's the wrong way to go about things. Oops. I plead temporary insanity.
Don't be too hard on yourself we all do things we normally wouldn't in situations like the ones we find ourselves in. You say you have suggested a marriage counselor...but have you suggested, or have you asked her to go with you? The reason I make the differentiation in this is from my own experience with my LDH.
I mentioned to him (prior to his getting counseling) that I'd like for him to go to a C with me several times, so that we could work through our current problem. He always blew that off...until I told him very matter-of-fact that if we didn't seek out help with our problems that we wouldn't be having another anniversary.
Now, that was what it took for him to take me seriously...that doesn't mean that's the approach that will work with your W. When I left it to him to make the C appt. he didn't. For some reason he just couldn't make himself do that...he finally asked me to make the appointment and let him know when it was...which was fine, whatever it took to get us there.
I guess what I'm saying is...you need to make the appointment and then tell your wife you would like her to go with you.
I was also very careful not to point blame when I was suggesting a C for us...I told him I'd like "us" to go to a C to work on "our" problem.
It's just a though....like someone else said on these BB's there are many approaches to our problems, what worked for me may not be the best approach for you.
The question is, how accommodating should I be? W and I work 45 miles apart, so a marriage C would need to be somewhere in the middle if we were to have an appointment during the work day. Weekends and late night appointments wouldn't work because of the kids. I suppose I could find one within 5 minutes of my W's workplace and just go there first thing in the morning (9am probably) and then show up to work by 11AM. Hmmm.
As far as being clear, I think I have. Marriage counseling would obviously be for us, not just for me or her. The problem is, we had a crappy EAP (employee assistance program) counselor in April 2003 that neither of us liked, and the bad experience (even though it was only 3 appointments) was enough to make us hesitant. I don't want another crappy counselor who will focus on MY problems or HER problems separately from the M. Guess I'll just have to throw a dart at random and pick one.
TNC wrote: ------------- My C is worried that my W is having an affair or that conditions are ripe for one for her. That doesn't sound like pro-M to me. That sounds like an alarmist who is trying to get me to go crazy looking for signs and snooping on my W -------------
She said that because of the increased likelihood that a betrayed spouse will have a 'revenge' affair.
I am going to tell you how to fix your relationship. You will probably not agree to give it an honest try, but here goes anyway.
Chase your wife. Treat her the same way you did when you first fell in love with her. BE IN LOVE with her as a state of existence. Ignore emotional jabs, nicks, cuts and bruises. PURSUE HER!
You told another woman that you loved her. Your wife has had a child, a miscarriage, then a second child. If I understand the timeline correctly, you had the affair during the time of the miscarriage. You have taken vacations without your wife while you physically PURSUED the OTHER WOMAN. Your wife has had a recent cancer scare complete with biopsy. She has also been physically ill recently. She has gained weight, fought with 4 different birth control pills and has two kids to care for. SHE IS EMOTIONALLY DEVASTATED and you want her to have sex.
Rhetorically, let me ask you this. What would you be feeling right now if the roles were reversed, and your wife had done these things to you? Would you still be there?
Your wife does not believe that you want her. She doesn't believe that you will stay with her. I would venture a guess that she has questioned her choice of fathers for her children - many times. I would also venture to guess that she has a well thought out exit strategy, possibly one that includes an affair. Chris, I don't even believe that you really want her
I am not trying to be mean and put you down. ALL of us do stupid things at times. What I am trying to tell you is that YOU HAVE TO WIN HER HEART BACK, and you have to do it soon. IF you decide to do it, it is forever, not just until you get laid. You, in essence, have to have a change of heart toward your wife.
Sex is not the issue with your relationship, and no matter what you do, until you get your relationship repaired, the sex between you and your wife is nothing more that a random, anomalous event, realized due to hormonal pressures.
Sorry for the hijack, FF.
Hang in there Chris. -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I forget, does your W attending C at all? If not perhaps (if she's willing) it is time to request her to attend marriage counseling with you. 