Quote: Through my own experience as a Class A Defender, I know that I personalized every single critical convo as a personal attack. When I launched my own defense, I'd go on counter attack and Mr. Wonderful would shut completely down. And we'd continue this miserable cycle.
Yes! Very well put!
Quote: Let's say for the sake of argument that you ARE attributing this insecurity to not being around H. What mechanisms can you employ (thought stopping) that would prevent you from entering such a cheeseless tunnel?
I meant that for some reason when I am AWAY from H, or when I was single, or when NOT is a serious R (I've only had a handful), I WOULD feel better about myself. I'm not one to get so lonely while being alone, but more lonely while being in an R. Why? Because I transfer all of my feelings onto the S.O. Just looking for a "knight in shining armor" to "rescue" me??? The expectations get put on to HIM to inflate my ego. While unattached or whatever, I don't have that expectation b/c there is no one there to put it on.
Quote: it seems pretty clear to me that when you start down the path of thinking negatively, you start acting on those thoughts. And then your H pulls back from you.
What do you think?
TOTALLY TRUE!!! The big thing here is for me to NOT act on it. Yesterday I ended up leaving a vm for H saying that re: our convo that I was trying to reassure him, but I didn't feel like he was reassured and that I just wanted to make it "clearer" or something like that. Later I wondered how BIG of a blubbering fool I sounded like. I knew I was in that "mode" yesterday...(Panic/anxiety/fearfulness) Does anyone have a creative name for it? So, I should KNOW not to make any calls, send any emails, or try to have a convo, but to get off my fanny and DO something. Even if at work I could go walk around the bldg. for a few min. outside to release some tension. As you see, I'm not good w/sitting still for v. long and at my job, that's all I do. I need to have memo cards or sticky notes reminding myself to ? focus on something else, that I'm in Funko Mode and need to stop ?
I feel like I am usually the one to call my friends to ask them to do something and that they don't call me. However, with the clubs, usually everyone is invited to everything-picnics, camping trips, biking trips, etc. I have PLENTY of projects to do by myself-I love to be crafty, I love to shoot pics of nature, I used to take my dog before she had pup on several hour long trips just to hike and take pics. Oh, if only I lived in CO!
I guess I'm still concerned about things like wanting H to think I'm having so much fun, staying out later than him, etc. Ya know...creating mystery. Saying I went to crop w/a bunch of ladies doesn't sound very exciting. But, it just may be time to give that up. I am 35 after all, and don't really feel the need to go "clubbing" a lot anymore. I would like to go out dancing sometimes though-even if it's line dancing or taking salsa lessons or whatever. YEAH! I want to dance!!! One of my new friends loves to dance too-that's the one that is traveling a lot. She doesnt' like to make commitments though as far as planning a night ahead of time. ??
What I enjoy most IS being either physically active or being creative. Perhaps on the evenings that H & I are just having din at home and not biking or hiking, I could incorporate a half hour or so to work on a "project" or my scrapbook, or whatnot, or take the dogs walking for half an hour. Seems like a manageable goal.
Last night I drove up to Cleve. for din. w/my sis. We had a good time, then we just hung out and played on the internet. Have you heard of the Lizard Man? Nevanna probably has!!!
H actually came home BEFORE 2am, and we chit chatted and I init. which was great. Def. one of the strong points of our M!! PROGRESS! PROGRESS! BABY STEPS! BABY STEPS!
OK, so I sound like a normal person today, right? (Well, relatively-haha). And yesterday I sounded weirded out...How can I be two diff. people? Am I Cybil? Would you tell me if I was??? How does anxiety take over my mind like that. Yes, I do know I have MORE control than I used to...keep swimming...
Tonight I'm going to a party and H is going to a race if the weather is dry. And, I am OK with this!
Quote: OK, so I sound like a normal person today, right? (Well, relatively-haha). And yesterday I sounded weirded out...How can I be two diff. people?
Heh, I feel like that all of the time... I just try to remember what I felt like on the good days, and hold that feeling when I start feeling not-so-good. Kind of like reframing my mind.
Quote: The expectations get put on to HIM to inflate my ego. While unattached or whatever, I don't have that expectation b/c there is no one there to put it on.
So what can you do to keep from putting those expectations on him? Or, at least, letting them get out of hand??
Quote: I would like to go out dancing sometimes though-even if it's line dancing or taking salsa lessons or whatever. YEAH! I want to dance!!!
Too bad you don't live closer to me...I know a great place to go dancing. Okay, okay, so it's the club where my H works. But I love latin night there! Latin style dancing is soooo much fun.
Quote: Have you heard of the Lizard Man? Nevanna probably has!!!
Sat. night when I went to party, I accidentally took H's car key. And then, since it was raining and a pool party, I left my phone unattended for an extended pd. of time. Well, H called me 12 times w/the messages getting more and more escalated. I called him and offered to bring the key home. He said it was too late and said "I gotta go!" And hung up. I tried to call back, no answer. So, I left party early and put key on counter, took a shower, went to bed. H did not go out, and fell asleep on the couch.
He came to bed at about 4. In the morn. when I was in the bathroom, he went out to the garage. Soon after he came back in. We hugged, he said he was mad but getting over it, frustrated, & that he knew I dind't do it on purpose. I apologized, validated and told him I would check my phone at least hourly if in that kind of sit. again.
We didn't spend any time together this weekend until last night when we took my dad to din. H was really sore and tired, so we went to bed as soon as we got home.
Today he calls and says that he can't get the sat. off the weekend we were going to go camping. He was the one that didn't want to go labor day weekend b/c of other things going on, and suggested that weekend. well, he never checked the vaca calendar at work until today. He did get off for vegas though in November.
So, I ask if he could drive to PA after he's done working. He says that 5 hours driving time isn't worth it to be there for less than a day. I said that we could still do stuff on sun. afternoon. (Just b/c checkout time at campground is noonish, we could still stay in PA and come later.) He grumbles and says, "well, you'll get your camping trip." I said that the objective was to go with him too.
We just wrote each other...I am going to try to get my other friends to go on a diff. weekend. I told H that I know I could go without him, but already feel like we haven't done much this summer together and that I would miss him.
I talked to a gf, and she helped calm me down. I know that I REALLY REALLY need not get into the-if it were a race or a concert you wouldn't have waited to get off work, or you would drive a million miles, etc. grr... and the -you care about other stuff more than me. In my head I was starting to think that I would leave him and find someone who DOES want to be with me and would put in the effort.
Hi, The past couple weeks have been ok. H and I had a couple skirishes but made it through ok. Last night, however, I got a little upset. I had spent a couple/few eve's away from h. This weekend we were supposed to go to the river two days and go to cleve. saturday. However, it was cloudy with a forecast of possible scattered thunderstorms, so h didn't want to chance it and go to cleve. sat. and get rained on.
Fri night he worked on his truck, then came into the house to get ready to go somewhere. I had a migraine so I was just laying down for a while. Well, we were down to a broken thin bar of soap and h got all huffy that he had to go to the store for soap. i felt guilty that i hadn't gotten it, but thought "he can go to the store sometimes too, and we DO have soap." He had previously had trouble with the truck so I never did hear if he was actually mad at me or the sitch. So, we just went out to eat.
Sat. since he didn't want to go to cleve, we decided to go out to eat and to movie. I get ready, looking nice, and h is just casual w/jean shorts, tee, and sneakers. so i changed my top and said it looked silly for me to be dressed up and him casual.
when we got to the rest. i had started to cry. i said that i was bummed that we weren't doing the things that we had planned and that i was tired of things getting cancelled b/c it might rain. he got angry-b/c this implication is that it is his fault. Well, i think, why not accomodate the stinkin' ohio weather and wear a hat and take an umbrella, etc. People in Seattle don't stay indoors 24/7 do they. Plus I was hurt that he wasn't putting more effort into our date by dressing up a little more or wearing cologne, etc. But, I DID NOT bring this up.
He said that i seemed to be more concerned with WHAT we did and WHERE we went rather than just being together. I said it's not that, but that I like to do stuff, that I was looking forward to it, etc. He said something about him maybe not being the right guy for me since he is not so concerned about that.
Had din, came home, rented movie. I laid down for a few again. Getting another headache. Went and watched movie.
This morn. tried to talk a little I said I was afraid that things were going back to how they were. He said he was too, and that I had been doing so much w/my friends and now I'm getting back into just hanging out with him and unhappy. I said that I want to do fun stuff WITH him, that I could live a separate life, but that I don't want to.
I am married to HIM, I don't want to be away from him 5 days a week. I WAS happy doing all this other stuff, but I want to incorporate him into that. He said I act like we never do anything, that we are going camping in a few weeks and to vegas in a couple months.
I said that he was acting diff. than our first week back together too, b/c he was acting happy to be with me then...He says, "well, I wasn't the one trying to railroad the R." So, I have to pay for this for HOW LONG???
TBH, I'm afraid that H just might not fit into my life. When we were dating, he was attracted to me b/c I like to do so much stuff, he tried many things, but didn't stick with many. So, this other guy that I became friends with in July was interested in me...and I was attracted to him, but told him that I wanted my M to work and I never told him that I liked him too. So, what if I do more stuff w/club and this guy and have more fun w/o h around???
Can I have it both ways? Just do things that H and I already do together and not try to get him to do other stuff and just do them myself w/others? I am having trouble finding the balance here. I sometimes wonder if I really love h for who he is or for who I want him to be and thought that he would be in our M.
I often wonder if he really loves me for who I am or for who he wants me to be. I feel like I cannot share any emotions with him. I feel like he is not interested in my life. He doens't ask me many "engaging" questions, and the way for us to have a convo. is if I ask him questions about him and his stuff.
I hope that this is just something that will come with time as some of you have said. I'm confused right now and causing myself migraines...I have a lot to do, and a lot that I want to do, I just want him to be involved and to feel important to him.
So, now he says that this is no fun and that he is reluctant to plan things w/me b/c if they get cancelled I get upset. Well, I could see if it really WAS raining, but saying that it "might" rain seems to pansy-ish to me.
I must realize, however, that not everyone is as active as I am or likes to do as many diff. things as I like to do, or is as resourceful and determined as I am. So, why can't I apply that determination to my m?
thanks for reading. hope all is well with you, karen
Hey Karen, Sounds like you are falling back into the habit of how you guys used to interact. You gotta break the cycle, girlfriend! Reading this, I have to think he feels like nothing he does is pleasing you. Ya know, I am alot like you...when we had plans and they fell through, I would be all hurt and upset w/H. I have worked so hard to change the way I react about stuff like that. For instance, H stopped "staying over". Normally, I would have threw a fit, badgered him about it, etc. until he wanted to escape me like a wild thing. I still have those same feelings, Karen, but now I "act as if" and give him a cheery goodbye (keep in mind I feel like clubbing him!!!) and lo and behold, this week he changed HIS way of reacting. It was nice. I still didn't "get my way" but he made me feel like he was ready to give me a baby step instead of the stagnant place we were at. Nuff about me...I just wanted to tell you it CAN be done.
I see you are still putting too much on him, about your feelings. Yes, you are doing your own thing and that is super. But when you two make plans, you set the goal too high. You need to relax and go with the flow. I know it would irritate me too, about your H not wanting to go because it MIGHT rain. Esp. as I LOVE the rain. But it sounds like it is alot of pressure on him, when things don't go perfect. He is waiting for you to make a big deal about it, and you aren't letting him down.
On the upside, you had the right idea about the soap! He is a big boy...he can certainly run to the store for himself. You did good...don't sweat it.
Re-read your post if you can...as if it were someone you don't know posting it. H is telling you some good stuff, too. He said you are acting like the WHERE and WHAT is more important than being with him. I think he is trying to tell you lots with that one sentence. He feels unimportant to you, I'd say. He seems to be testing you, with the not dressing up thing, the cancelling the outing thing, etc. See it as that, and don't let him "win" those tests. Don't fall into the old pattern, Karen! You can do this!!!
I feel like when you show him that doing things with him NOW doesn't have to be a struggle of your wills, he will maybe begin to want to do other stuff with you. Don't pressure. Let him see you can do this!!! I know he loves you, how else could he stay and work on things with you? Stop courting those negative things! Speak the positve into your R. Speak his LL, be self-less for a bit and forget about it when he doesn't speak yours. You can't force him but you can change the way he reacts.
I hope I am not hitting you too hard. It's just you KNOW how to DB like a pro, and then once you make headway, you start the old patterns. I want to see you lunge ahead! You ARE going to be a success!!! Hear me??? LOL.
Guess I will slink on out of here before you bring out your own club! LOL You are gonna be fine, just back up and take a deep breath and try to see it from his viewpoint instead of your emotions. I'll check in later. Take care! Debi
Debi! Hi! Believe me, I will not club you!!! I really need this!
Sunday we went to river to see a band. I had left him that card that I told you about a few weeks ago and wrote that I was sorry about last night, that he was right, and to call me when he woke up. I had left the house b/c I had a migraine all day on a beautiful sunny day, so as soon as I felt better, I wanted OUT! So, within 10 min. he called. I said I was going to meet gf and he could meet us. He asked if I wanted to go w/just her and I said no.
When he got there, he was surprisingly chipper. Ok, something worked! ?? Was it the note, the nap, the illusion of me going out w/o him?
Monday I went to Pittsburgh w/my sis and her fam. We shopped at IKEA and went to ride the little incline thingy with the boys. I went home and h & I went out to din. All was well.
Tuesday I went to climb and got home early. He had band practice. I fed us ice cream and we went to bed. Another good night.
Tonight I don't know what is going on. He said he might do din. w/friend, but I haven't heard from him. I may go to scrapbook store and/or hardware store. I am resuming the huge project of sanding our knotty pine living room walls and white-washing them. Anyone have any good suggestions for white-washign???
Yesterday I accidentally took his phone to work with me! He ended up coming up for lunch which went really well-just pleasant convo/chit-chat. He's been affectionate and he was huggy.
THE PATTERN...I still have this nagging urge to check up and see how dressed up he got to go out w/friends and compare it to when he is with me. I am def. driving myself bonkers. And, he has one his ring once since we've been back together. He cut himself twice on his ring finger making scars that made the ring harder to get on. He was waiting to see if one bump would shrink before getting it sized again. I have not said anything about it.
He has made a couple references regarding other women. Such as if he were single again, he'd use match.com. Or that there are more w than m in the world so m have more "opportunities." He told me (again) that some women have told him they like his crooked teeth. I don't know if he is testing me or what???
I totally acted as if while S-to the point of him thinking I didn't care. Maybe he's looking for assurance that I do care??? Also, he never believes me when I compliment him. I tell him he is hot or gorgeous, and that he really "takes care of me" in bed, etc., but he just rolls his eyes or harumphs me. I ask him why he doesn't believe me. He has always claimed to be modest. He doesnt' think he is good at much, which is so not true!!! I hope I don't sound phoney when I compliment him...I really do mean what I say to him. 'Cuz he REALLY makes me hot for him!!!
Prob. need to work more on the friendship b/c, as you know, I have a tendency to focus on the sex.
Today he sent me an email being mushy and asked if I wanted to go to a truckfest down the street from our house. I said sure, except I'll end up wanting to "pimp my ride" and don't have the means to do so!
Quote: I feel like when you show him that doing things with him NOW doesn't have to be a struggle of your wills, he will maybe begin to want to do other stuff with you. Don't pressure. Let him see you can do this!!! I know he loves you, how else could he stay and work on things with you? Stop courting those negative things! Speak the positve into your R. Speak his LL, be self-less for a bit and forget about it when he doesn't speak yours. You can't force him but you can change the way he reacts.
Good stuff Debi! I can hear your voice w/your accent telling me these things!
And, my good buddy Pam is reminding me every day to be PATIENT.
I can only say , I second the patience! I ready my bible nightly and grow stronger in faith every day. I'm waiting on GOD's word to restore my marriage.
Hi, Last night was fine. Went to scrapbook store, groc. store, cooked din., and hung out w/H. He asked me what we would do if it rained & we couldn't bike Thurs. I said, "can I climb?" He said, "when have I ever said 'no'?" I said never, but that I didn't want to be rude and just say I was doing it. He said he wouldn't care and that he wanted me to have fun.
He said he may go out w/buddy since I am climbing or go out with him on Friday night. I acted cool with it, but today I have anxiety. Torturing myself w/jealousy and thoughts of how much effort he'll put into looking good. I wish I could get help with this once and for all! I'm going to go to a new IC, but can't get in until Nov.
I'm taking the next 3 days off and I am going to work on a big house project, have some fun, and go to 2 dr. appt's. I asked H if we could do something Tuesday day if he is not too busy.
I am reminding myself that maybe some day we will be able to go out-out together again and have a good time. Baby steps and patience. H has continued to be more loving, playing with my hair or face (which I LOVE), or signing loveeeooo on emails, etc.
Hi, Does anyone have suggestions on what to see out west? We are flying to and staying in Vegas. I would like to take a day trip or two to see a national park. H would rather go to the Grand Canyon when we can stay there for a couple days and hike or whatever.
Can anyone tell me how far away Zion Nat'l Park and Joshua Tree are and which one is more worth seeing?
We will def. go to Red Rock Canyon b/c that is where we got married, it is so close, and I want to shoot some black & whites for my new pic frames to hang in liv room when it is done. I will prob. go climbing there with a guide too!
Hello again. Last night I went to climb w/a gf and then met up with the bike club for din. I had fun socializing with the group and my new mf. It's just a friendship-I enjoy his company b/c he likes to talk and actually admits to having issues and has shared some with me. He also likes to do a lot of the same things that I like to do.
When I came home, H was home and up. He had gone out w/his buddy to eat and play pool. (+since he went out w/his friend Thurs, he's going out with me Friday). I know I really need to give up this jealousy and just accept that H needs to feel comfy with me and is not just going to do something (ie wear a nicer shirt when going out w/me) just b/c he doesn't want me to get upset. In fact, he'd prob do the opposite for fear of feeling controlled. So I must come across as not caring about what he wears or what we do.
He asked about my whereabouts and where I went after climbing. We went to bed and he was grumbling. He is really tired of his job. But last week he said he wasn't going to apply for anything at this time b/c of vaca. I said that the employer should let him have a week off. And H said that he can't afford to take a week w/o pay and that if I made more money, it might be possible. Ok, so he can spend hundreds on his truck, but can't save a few hundreds for a week of no pay? Furthermore, I felt kind of guilty...
So, I just snuggled him a little and he fell asleep. I feel like-I don't know-It's good that he feels comfy enough with me to be "himself" and be grumpy and share stuff with me, but on the other hand, I feel a little taken for granted in that he is more "on" with his friends than he is with me. And, well, the first week or two back together was v. exciting and passionate, and now it feels like more of the same.
OH, but wait! I forgot about PATIENCE!!! Will there ever be a time where we both feel comfy with each other and happy???
Furthermore, it's usually on me to come up with things to do. And sometimes the things that I want to do are diff than what he wants to do, so I try to come up with things that he WOULD want to do. ???Make sense???
which was great. Def. one of the strong points of our M!! 
PROGRESS! PROGRESS! BABY STEPS! BABY STEPS! 
Ok, so he can spend hundreds on his truck, but can't save a few hundreds for a week of no pay? Furthermore, I felt kind of guilty...