Yes...unfortunately she does hold the cards. Fortunately for her though you do value your marriage (I'm not saying she doesn't) and you are willing to keep trying. And definitely keep trying as long as you are willing to...one of those things you try may just be the catalyst that causes her to wake up.
I think you're right though that people do tend to associate with others similar to themselves. Now that I think about it my closest friends I would consider to be HD...so they've definitely influenced me. If given the chance I'd do my damndest to influence your W too :-)
That's really what was killing me in my sitch with my LDH as well...and it still does, considering we haven't really increased frequency yet. He knows what the problem is, he can even empathize with me now...but he still hasn't done what to me seems so simple now. What I have to force myself to remember on a constant basis...is that once it wasn't so easy for me. For those of us who are HD physical contact and intimacy can come so easily...for LD's however you may as well be asking them to row across the Pacific Ocean with a toothpick for a paddle. If at all possible find out what your LDW's true issue is...if she'll give you a clue...and try to help her past that if you can. If she seems awkward/self concious in bed...tell her how well she does something...not just that you like it. I know for me that really helped...Just food for thought. I'm sure many of you guys have tried that...just thought I'd bring it up again.
Hi GEL, I am working on verbal communication when ML and it's not easy. Both H and I are silent types and for me, something was missing. I saw I relied too much on going into my own head instead of developing a connection. I knew I had to confront this.
We are starting to make progress in this area. I love it when he says something encouraging to me, and we have dabbled just a bit into dirty talk. But one thing that has been really amazing is that I am able to speak up and say that something isn't working. This happened last nite...I was having difficulty with arousal, and I stopped the whole thing and said I need to regroup. He was so "with me" at that point, no judgment, no hurtful feelings, and we went on to reconnect intimately. I am truly in awe of anyone who can talk comfortably during sex and would love to hear any suggestions on how to do this better. J
CONGRATULATIONS!!!! That's a great thing to hear and so encouraging. Actually the only thing I can suggest...and please realize I'm still working on this myself, I still feel very awkward talking during sex...is you just have to force those words to come out. Eventually it will become less uncofortable for you....believe me, I know how difficult it is :-) I'm by no means a pro there!
Quote: there seems to be two aspects-- physical pleasure and emotional intimacy.
You hit the nail on the head with that!
Quote: I have to feel "safe" and feel mutual affection.
I truly believe this is what I was lacking in both of my first marriages...although I might have to add respect in with the mutual affection. I didn't have that...so I didn't feel "safe".
Gelass, thanks for adding this, I can't believe I left it out. I can't like someone I don't respect. Trust and respect go hand in hand for me, when it comes to men. For me, the trust probably has to do with whether I can expose my tender parts, like my heart.. without unacceptable risk. But respect tells whether I even want them around. In my younger days, if I did not respect a man, I might toy with them for a while anyway... but they were not gonna be around for very long at all. Once I did the post mortem on my marriage, I realize that once I lost my trust and respect for my wasband, it was over. I should have left, because it was over and could never be salvaged, ever. Maybe I was right or noble to try to stay and hope it could be better, but it wasn't smart.
Quote: I'm not totally into it going in... I can get there if someone takes there time.
This is very important to remember...I know there are many of you out there like myself who are sick to death of having to initiate...the fact is though we're going to have to suck it up and "just do it"..are you sick of me saying that yet?
Lots of very high paid sex therapists subscribe to this too. Basically they say, "you're not in the mood? do it anyway. Once you get started, you'll get in the mood". Steve Harley said "just do it".
It does occur to me that maybe when working with a LD, you should focus first on the emotional intimacy part-- I know there is a minimal threshold for me personally, and it's sort of a classic thought that women are like that. A HD woman could have issues with you, and be willing to F (but it won't be really you in her mind, it's just physical) A LD woman probably won't do that-- she needs to take care of that emotional part first to even consider the physical.
I could be way off base here, but figure this is worth mentioning. HDs can be so pro-sex that sometimes it seems like they don't even care who they have sex with.... and most women want it to be personal, about them, not just their parts. Most of you guys truly love your wives, so this is not a problem-- you are taking the time and effort to work on getting your sex lives with your wives better, rather than going elsewhere.
So make sure she knows that you don't just want an orifice, you want her. You're also not just talking about sex/physical release, you want to make love with the woman you married. (This is not instead of doing her/being done or just plain F'ing..... forever. It's where to start, to get her where she needs to be.)
I think it would be worth trying to personalize your desire. And personalize what you like, want. Instead of "I'm so horny"... "I want you so much". If there are real ways you can tell her that it's HER you want, make things specific rather than generic, it can go a long way. The idea of someone wanting you specifically rather than as a set of interchangeable female parts is pretty powerful.
The other thing I remembered I wanted to mention was the idea of confidence for the LD partner. That can be dealt with, and its not that hard. They need some feedback on what they are doing really well, but they also need to learn other ways. It's astonishing how much you can learn about sensual pleasures from reading, or from other people. At some point, I realized that you'd only be as good a lover as your best lover... and that if you were always with the same person, after a while there would not be anything new or exciting. Since I was married and not cheating, I had to figure something out. Turns out there are some really good resources out there, along with some really dumb ones.
In my case it was easy, as I was motivated. If you have a LDW, you might have to be the role model first. You might have to let her know you want to become expert in giving her pleasure... but need her help, feedback. Make a game of it, and don't start out with high stakes stuff, make it non-threatening and easy, short sessions so she doesn't have time to get self-conscious. A few sessions later, bet she'd turn the tables on you.
Anyway I have to get going. Y'all have a good one.
Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and annoys the pig.
Yeah. I guess I backed off enough, differentiated enough, let her make her own mistakes enough or let her talk enough that for the first time in about 2 months....
Doing 180s. I looked up what Paul said about marriage. (1Cor-7) Amongst other things he said that if you're married to a believer you both play by the same rules and so shouldn't split. Don't divorce a non-believer but let him/her walk if s/he wants to. So I took some pressure off. It's not the end of the world if she walks. I'll uphold my end of the deal (or more) but I won't be desperate for her to stay.
It seems to have helped... a lot.
It's funny. Sex doesn't seem that important now (but ask me in a week ) Nor does it feel like my life depends on my M working. It is now perhaps only my second most important relationship.
Whoa! This is just starting to have a slight smell of success... but don't tell anyone yet. It still has a way to go.
