wow - even MORE interesting thought provoking posts - pen, i have to say that you play devil's advocate very well - thank you for such an eloquently stated position of both sides of the story

while i process the things i need to process - this thought struck me as thought provoking all it's own

for those of you that use the bible as a guide, let me go to this forgiveness issue for a moment. in the lord's prayer, there is mention that we need to ask for forgiveness of our sins and to help us forgive others that have sinned against us

later it says that if we do forgive others that sin against us then our father will forgive us our sins, but that if we do not forgive others and their sins that our father will not forgive us

everyone with me so far???

so i got to thinking - when it says we must forgive others and their sins against us, would this include sins we commit against ourselves? is forgiveness of ourselves lumped in with the whole statement of having to forgive others in order to get forgiveness from our father?

i thought this very interesting - i know i for one am dealing with skeletons that i have come to the conclusion i haven't forgiven myself for yet...

here is something totally different i want to consider in this community thread...

someone whose opinion i value very highly recently told me that my husband confessing to me after everything was completely over and done with was a complete act of selfishness on his part - this relieved HIM of all his guilt and feelings of pain but laid upon all those feelings on to an unsuspecting innocent person

how do you feel about this? i am struggling with this right now in essense of the 'thing' i am working on right now...

am i making sense???