Hey Paul. Yes, I was on vacation during your intro to the group. It was during that vacation that I ML to my W for, yes, the first time since Sept 2003.

No, PM has not helped the frequency, but it is helping my attitude. I have not yet told my wife the basic deal: "I did not sign up for a celibate marriage...we need to work on this, and (the kicker), I will take your actions from this point forward as indicative of whether you are willing to work on it, and will adjust my life plans accordingly." PM is helping me realize that I deserve better treatment, that I need to be honest with myself (that I CAN'T be happy with celibacy), that I don't have to agree with everything my wife says and does, including that I don't need to agree that sex is not that important.

My W is a case. I love her very much, and, if sex had never been invented, we would be an almost perfect couple. But the sex issue is there, and, by its very dismal-ness, is HUGE, especially compared to how great everything else is. Getting her to understand that me wanting to ML is not "just about sex" has been an uphill battle, and PM has made me understand that, basically, she needs to figure it out for herself. I can't lecture her into bed. I can't use the Socratic Method to induce her to kiss me. Hell, I can't even suggest she read SSM completely to figure out where I'm coming from.

A note on her reading of SSM. She read the first chapter and said it was "your basic book telling the lower drive person to give in." Then, she read selective sections in order to show me all the things I was doing wrong. So, which is worse--having your W not read it, or having your W use it against you?

You have some hard work ahead of you. You have to decide whether your children need the two of you to be together. You need to decide if your W would actually work to improving the ML part of your marriage if you told her that you are not willing to live that way...would she choose divorce over passion? You need to figure out what you truly deserve, and whether you have the integrity to stand behind your convictions that you deserve it. It's tough. It's heart-wrenching at times. And nothing is guaranteed.

I have a 3 year-old daughter who we adopted from China, and who I think needs to see us stay together. Yet I am wrestling with the realization that maybe mom and dad aren't setting a very good example for a loving couple to this little girl. Maybe she needs to see her dad stand up for himself and for what he believes in. Which is worse, growing up and knowing that your parents stuck together just because of you, or growing up with two parents in separate homes, one of which stood up for himself?

No easy answers here, Paul.

Hairdog