I've been lurking for several months, but this is the first time I'm sitting down to write out my experience. To tell you the truth, it's a little daunting but I'm hoping for some support or at the minimum a listening ear from those who can relate.
My Husband and I have been together for 13 years, married for going on 6 years. Throughout our relationship H has always battled depression off and on. He refuses to seek any type of individual counseling and has never been one to really take care of himself as far as regular doctor visits, dentist visits, etc. He has also struggled with addiction off and on. I believe him to be an alcoholic, he claims he's not. I grew up with alcoholic parents so I'm not new to addiction. Because of his excessive alcohol use and marijuana use I was hesitant to start trying for a family. He will go out with friends or coworkers and not come home when he says he's going to & then be out til 2 or 3 in the morning. & I had told him that I was scared that he would maintain the same behaviors even if we had a baby. I did not mean for that to be offensive to him, but I know that me telling him that really bothered him. His behavior would change for maybe a week, and then he would be back to the same old song and dance.
His mother passed away about 18 months ago, and this behavior escalated to the point where he would no longer even come home right after work. He would go straight to the bars to hang out and drink. In April I became so agitated that he was never home. I was taking care of all the household chores on my own and felt like he wasn't contributing at all. We shared locations on our phones with each other at the time and it all came to a head when I saw he was over at a friends' house when he told me he was just going to make a quick run to the grocery store. I immediately called him out and asked why he didn't tell me he was going to go hang out with his friend. He said we "needed to talk" when he got home. He did not come home until 1:00 in the morning, woke me up, and then proceeded to tell me that he's not happy and we need to separate and start looking at divorce. He was drunk, so admittedly I didn't believe anything he was saying, it's not like he hasn't said mean things before when he's been drinking.
Come to find out, he did mean it. He went to stay at his parent's house for the rest of that week, and then at the end of the week he came back home and stayed. When we talked, H said he didn't feel loved or supported by me. That I devoted too much time to my career and things I wanted to accomplish in life. Which is a fair statement. I think I had felt so neglected by him that I began pouring myself into other things to keep myself busy. He's upset that we don't have any children yet. We had a sexless marriage for the last several years 1) due to some past trauma I'm working through myself but 2) it's also difficult to want sex when you feel like you're constantly "mom"-ing your spouse. Sex has never been super important to me, but no matter the situation, I wish I would have realized sooner how much that hurt him and loved him in the ways he needed/wanted and not how I thought I should love him.
I've been DBing since April. He's been staying at home since April, with a few mentions from time to time about how he needs to/wants to move out. I know it's controversial about whether you should or shouldn't sleep with your partner during this time, but our sex life has blossomed over the past several months. Quite literally never been better. He's made several mentions about how much he sees I've changed over the past several months and how amazing it's been. He tells me everyday how much he loves me, how much he will always love me. He texts me throughout the day everyday. Yet, he still seems very much confused about what he wants. He told me again at the beginning of this week that he's planning on moving out at the end of the week. I'm devastated, and to be totally honest kind of panicking. I feel like DBing works so much better if they are around to see the changes. I know I have to let him go to try to figure things out on his own. But I also know the few friends and coworkers he's talked to about our situation he probably hasn't painted our relationship in the most truthful light, so even if he does miss me they are all going to be in his ear convincing him to not reach out. It just [censored]. We've had our ups and downs, but I truly love this man and want to be able to work all this out. I know he's in a fog right now though and I can't change his mind. Only he can. I'm just not sure where to go now once he moves out.
Welcome to the boards. I am glad you made the daunting step of sharing your story and experience. I am going to copy the welcomed post at the end of this. Lots of useful links and information in there.
Just to confirm, married six years, together 13, with no kids. What are your ages? Rent, mortgage, own? House? Yard? Or apartment?
It appears you’ve read Divorce Remedy. And have been implementing DB since April. And a caution for you, do not share DR, DBing techniques, this site, and such with H. He will likely see it as you attempting to manipulate him, and he will pull back, or even run in the opposite direction.
Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
During your relationship you’ve seen H going in and out of depression. By the sounds of it, a more or less constant shadow hanging over him. I’m hesitant to use “battling depression” as H’s behaviour and looking after himself suggests more just ignore and denial. No IC, no doctor, no dentist, is unfortunately rather common. People do not seem to reach out until they’ve hit bottom.
H’s alcohol and marijuana use you describe as excessive. From what you’ve shared it does sound like an addiction and/or alcoholism. As you well know, given your upbringing, that is a tough disease.
Originally Posted by jaejae
His mother passed away about 18 months ago, and this behaviour escalated to the point where he would no longer even come home right after work. He would go straight to the bars to hang out and drink.
The death of his Mom would escalate his denial and hiding of his pain. Escaping by sitting at barstool will not work. However, H will not see that right now. In fact, he’ll likely fight against such an epiphany.
Originally Posted by jaejae
I've been DBing since April. He's been staying at home since April, with a few mentions from time to time about how he needs to/wants to move out.
H moved back after his one week living with a friend. It’s pretty normal H mentioning still wanting to move out. He is confused and not facing things.
Give H lots of time and space. Lots!
Keep pressure to a minimum. And minimize R-talks.
Originally Posted by jaejae
I know it's controversial about whether you should or shouldn't sleep with your partner during this time, but our sex life has blossomed over the past several months. Quite literally never been better.
Good. Do more of what works and less of what doesn’t.
My advice/suggest is: no cake eating. Which means, if H is having an affair, then no sex.
At the moment, it sounds like H is not embroiled in an affair. So enjoy.
Originally Posted by jaejae
He's made several mentions about how much he sees I've changed over the past several months and how amazing it's been.
Do make those positive changes - for you. That way they’ll become permanent.
Originally Posted by jaejae
He tells me everyday how much he loves me, how much he will always love me. He texts me throughout the day everyday. Yet, he still seems very much confused about what he wants. He told me again at the beginning of this week that he's planning on moving out at the end of the week.
H’s confusion is ever present.
Originally Posted by jaejse
I'm devastated, and to be totally honest kind of panicking. I feel like DBing works so much better if they are around to see the changes. I know I have to let him go to try to figure things out on his own.
Breathe.
Give H time and space.
You can only control you. Your thoughts, actions, and reactions.
H is confused. And you wisely realize H needs to figure out his mess. Remember, you didn’t break him, therefore you cannot fix him.
I know it’s difficult. Dial your expectations down to zero. H stated he wants to move out this week.
When you expect something unwanted, you will unknowingly obsess and give off vibes, small behaviours and mannerisms, that fertilize the very thing you do not want to occur. As difficult as it is, dial that to zero.
Having no expectations, is like most of the advice here, for you and your mental/emotional health. No expectations also gives you your best chance, by you not subconsciously pushing H more towards the door.
Time and space. Focus on you. Let H do what he is going to do. Hopefully, he remains at home.
Originally Posted by jaejae
I know he's in a fog right now though and I can't change his mind. Only he can. I'm just not sure where to go now once he moves out.
Absolutely. H is in a fog. Be kind and cordial. You don’t place boulders on his path, yet don’t pave it in gold either.
H hasn’t moved out. He might not. Or he might. You cannot control H’s choice. However, you can do for you. Speak with a lawyer.
See a L. Have a consult. This is only for information. You need not act on anything right now. However, if things go really sideways, you will be prepared. Knowledge is power. And like DB, do not tell or share that you’ve seen a L, nor what you learned, with H.
Learn your rights and responsibilities in all this. Discover the best case, worst case, and likely case if things go off the rails.
That probably sounds anti-DB. It’s not.
You are on two paths. One is emotional and healing. The other is business. Keep them separate. And when dealing with business, be business-like.
The business stuff is pretty straightforward, it’s the emotional/healing journey we will spend the bulk of our time with.
I look forward to conversing with you.
DnJ
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Welcome to the board.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by Michele Weiner-Davis. The following link is the first chapter:
Once your registration to the site has been completed you can post and start a thread. Please have only one thread active at a time (per forum); it keeps your situation organized and is easier for those following along and posting to you. There are a few forums which help categorize posters’ situations.
When your thread reaches 100 posts, it will be time for you to start a new thread. It is a good idea to link your old thread to your new one, and even link the new one back to the previous one. That makes it easier for the folks following your story. (There is a help thread on linking in the sticky threads at the top section of the forum’s display.) A moderator will “close” your full thread which prevents further posting to it. It is still available to read.
Post in small frequent replies on your thread. Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity can be very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Post on other people’s thread to give support.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Thank you, DnJ. To answer some of your questions, yes married 6 years, together for 13. No kids. But we do have 2 dogs who mean the world to us. We both are 33 years old. We have a house together with a mortgage.
H officially moved out yesterday. & took one of the dogs with him. I am gutted, but I didn't fight it and let him go. It's so hard being alone in our home with photos of us on the walls and memories everywhere. I am doing my best to not reach out to him, even though I really want to. It's difficult to go from talking to someone every single day for the last 13 years to not at all. But I know it's what has to happen if I want even a modicum of a chance to turn this all around.
I'm working hard at GAL. It is more difficult to do so when I just feel so sad, but fake it til you make it, I guess.
We haven't discussed the bills, mortgage, or household expenses too much. We are in an interesting predicament right now as he's the sole breadwinner. I have been working only little part-time jobs as I'm finishing up graduate school this year. Typically though, I was the one who kept track of all the household expenses and paid the bills and utilities as they came up. I did transfer his car note information back to him make sure it gets paid every month. All other household expenses I plan to keep up on though, as I'm the one living in the house. We have a shared bank account, and despite the fact that we are separated right now he did say he wasn't going to just cut me off. As awful as all of this has been, I do believe him in that sense. & if for some reason he did, I know my support system is not going to let me fail as they want to see me finish graduate school.
I've been doing my best to go dark the past couple of days. I have not reached out to him, although he hasn't reached out either. As far as going dark do people usually remove their spouses off social media so that they can't see updates? That seems so callous to me, but I can also see how it might be beneficial. I've just refrained from posting anything on social media the last 2 days. I want him to feel like he has no way to know what I've been up to. Almost like I've vanished completely.
Journaling: As much as I miss him and want things to work out, I'm angry today. He hasn't once taken accountability for his role in all of this. I'm not the only one that has done wrong in our marriage. I've taken accountability for my faults, acknowledged said faults by name, and have begun doing the internal and external work to ensure these faults are fixed and don't happen again in whatever the future may hold. I've listened to him over and over and over again tell me how he feels like I've messed up. & I've listened. I've agreed. But he makes it seem like every thing is my fault, and it's not. I so badly want to tell him that I'm angry because he has a hand in all of this too. He isn't owning it and isn't doing anything to work on himself.
Journaling: As much as I miss him and want things to work out, I'm angry today. He hasn't once taken accountability for his role in all of this.
Be aware that’s unlikely to ever happen.
I’m six years post bomb-drop with a WAW who has since moved house 7 times, had several new men, and spent every waking minute trying to defame me on social media - despite her initiating an affair and then cleaning out the house and kids.
And not once has there been a shred of remorse or self realisation.
People who decide to rip their family apart want it to be someone else’s fault, and they’ll play all sorts of mental gymnastics to convince themselves and others it was your fault.
My advice - you need to get yourself to a position where you don’t need him to take accountability. Accept it’s likely never going to happen, and then you won’t waste time thinking about it.
JaeJae, I'm sorry you are here. I too had a partner with an addiction. It is not easy on the soul.
I'm going to gently suggest that you put things in place to start protecting yourself. A walk away partner is all over the place... add the addiction.. and it can turn sour very quickly. Being in denial about this won't help you. Taking care of the bills and expenses is now only an illusion of control. Again if its you or his addiction... he is going to choose his addiction.
Originally Posted by jaejae
I do believe him in that sense. & if for some reason he did, I know my support system is not going to let me fail as they want to see me finish graduate school.
I would start shifting to that support system now. You have spent your whole marriage thinking about him, basing your actions around him. That's how addiction works. They are the "mistress" you never asked for.
This "shift" doesn't have to be done over night. It can start discussing options with friends, attending support groups or going to therapy.
I know you know this deep down... but YOU can't save a marriage when an addiction is present. It's a relationship killer.
It's important that you get educated around their communication styles. Manipulation, gaslighting. Promises with no actions. And it's important to go back and see why you didn't listen to the alarm bells going off in your own body. It makes sense you wouldn't want kids with an addict... you know what that does being a child of one yourself.
I know you are coming here to save your marriage so I'm sure this is very much not what you want to hear. But I have walked a similar path. It's painful as all h3ll.. but the amount of time of suffer and how much...is entirely in your hands.
M(f): 43 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
Thanks for your insight, Valeska. I know that you're right, overcoming the addiction has to be something he wants to fix and come to that conclusion on his own, otherwise we're never going to get anywhere. I know he knows his drinking tendencies are a problem, he's admitted as such before. Yet, there have not really been any action steps taken to correct that. I still have a glimmer of hope that he will reach this conclusion now that he's moved out and on his own, but only time will tell. I am treading cautiously, fighting like heck to detach, and also leaning heavily on my support system for now.
Detaching is so so so so so difficult. & I know you all know that, but gosh it just feels like there is an H shaped hole in my everyday right where he should be. Since he's moved out, I've attempted to go dark and have failed a couple of times by reaching out to him. Sometimes communication with him is just so confusing because one day he says he wants us to keep in contact, but then other days I can tell he's so angry with how our relationship has ended up and he acts like he never wants to speak to me again. Yesterday morning he called me just to tell me that he loves me and hoped I had a good day. Afterwards, he texted me and told me he wanted to see me before I have to leave to go out of town for a work trip. But two days before that he had told me he hasn't wanted to try to save our marriage for a long time now, and that unfortunately the failure of our marriage maybe just has to be a "lesson we both had to learn the hard way". It's confusing because if H is seemingly that ready to just give up and put the marriage behind us, then why the barrage of "I love yous" and wanting to see me? Difficult to wrap my brain around, and maybe it isn't for me to understand right now. At any rate, I'm trying to keep busy with projects around the house, walking my dog, and schoolwork. Whatever I can do to keep myself distracted and not reaching out to him.
I went away on a work trip for a few days. It was actually a relief to be away from home, and the thoughts that constantly plague me about my marriage. He came to drop my dog off the day I got home from my trip, and that was nice. No conversations about the R. Just pleasant, small talk. He told me he loved me. Two days later he called me while I was at work. Completely caught me off guard because I was not expecting any type of communication from him. I did answer because I thought maybe something was wrong, but turns out he had called just to tell me he loved me and was thinking about me. We had a pleasant 5 minute conversation and laughed together a few times. I want to hate how much it brightened my day, but I don't. I do hate how hopeful I can feel myself start to get after interactions like this. Like maybe he's gaining some clarity, but I'm trying to temper any hope and just let things be what they are - a nice conversation & nothing more. I know he has no intentions of coming home any time soon, & just thinking about that makes me feel like I'm spiraling.
So sorry that you have to join us here! The big thing to remember is to have patience with yourself. It takes time to master your emotions and the techniques that work for you. And those techniques will only work at certain times, when the wind is blowing just right! You may have days where the connection is strong, only to be followed up by being accused of gaslighting.... like DnJ firmly states, keep your expectations at 0. Enjoy those moments as they come, but expect nothing to come out of it. You seem to be on the ball with that!
As for going dark, you'll know when the time is right. Hopefully it doesn't get to that, but you will know.... you'll do it for your own sanity. Do not feel bad about it, it is part of self care. Just like he needs his time and space, there will be times when you need yours too.
To me, I liken the spiraling to riding a malfunctioning carousel, until one day you get thrown off.... and that's just the you part.... this carousel was in a car on your S' rollercoaster! You'll begin to see things clearer, and be able to stand on solid ground again. Like S' journey, it'll take as long as it takes.
Me 45 XH/X 47 T27 M9 S1-19 S2-17
My WAW OM EA BD 2009 MI w OM 2009 D 2010 R w OM 2009-2010 Detach OM 2010-Jan 2017 R w XH 2016 to 2024 BD 1 Not attracted Oct 2024 BD 2 His PA w 27yo OW March 2025
Thank you for your response, and the kind reminder to keep expectations at 0. It is an awful, malfunctioning carousel crammed into a rollercoaster car to be on but there is comfort in the fact that I'm not alone on the ride.
In some ways I do feel like its a positive baby step in that he's seemed to be softening over the past week. Reaching out to me more, hanging around for a little bit when he dropped the dog off after I got back from my work trip, an ongoing text conversation that has spanned the last few days. We take our time to respond back and forth to each other, but the fact that he hasn't just ignored it like he has in the past is a small win. Today I choose to be grateful for that.
In some ways I do feel like its a positive baby step in that he's seemed to be softening over the past week. Reaching out to me more, hanging around for a little bit when he dropped the dog off after I got back from my work trip, an ongoing text conversation that has spanned the last few days. We take our time to respond back and forth to each other, but the fact that he hasn't just ignored it like he has in the past is a small win. Today I choose to be grateful for that.
Chances are this is more cake-eating more than anything. He wants to have his life and yet still have access to you.
That is not to say that he doesn't have feelings or isn't confused... but you enabling the behavior isn't good either. 1st - it's painful for you... but also 2nd - if he was to have a "wake-up" call - you are extending that time line for that realization indefinitely if you keep things the status quo.
Having 0 expectations only happens when you detach. From the spouse, from the outcome... and that is going to take time.
One of the hardest things to grasp about ourselves is that we see every little good thing that happens as "hope". At the same time - we fear that in any little way that we choose ourselves - we push away our spouse.
And those two things muddy the water so much to see things clearly. Denial is very strong.
And I won't sugar coat it - working towards understanding and fighting it... and "allowing" the spouse to live his life... hurts like h3ll!.
That's why being busy and GALing is a good thing. Not just for your mental health - but it helps create the boundary for YOU to stop enabling behavior that although feels good short term - long term does nothing good for you, him, or the marriage.
Be so busy before your trip so that there is NO time for him. That way when you say you can't - you literally cannot.
Whatever adjustments you make follow it with "I heard you when you said you wanted your own life. I am supporting that decision by acting accordingly".
There is no way that doesn't create push back or conflict for him. We usually say to be prepared to for them to "spit venom".
I know it's hard to understand but you can't worry about if he leaves your or marriage... he already has.
Now is the time to start asking yourself how to better take care of you.
M(f): 43 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
As difficult as some of this is to read, you're absolutely right, Valeska. I need to stop enabling and distance myself. I took a photo of a page straight out of the DR book that talks about why distance and not reaching out is so important. I've been trying to read that little part every day, so I will continue so that I may remind myself that it's what H needs.
So it seems to me my best course of action now is to just go dark. Until when? Until he decides he's ready to talk about the R?
So it seems to me my best course of action now is to just go dark. Until when? Until he decides he's ready to talk about the R?
I wish I could give you a timeline but their isn't one. And unfortunately as much as we hate the possibility - he may never be ready. We can't make someone ready to change. They will do it on their own timeline if at all.
It's okay if you go dark as an attempt to save your marriage before you see it as a way to save yourself. My .02 is to just make sure you have the proper support when doing this. There are lots of confusing stages. It's difficult to navigate on your own. The ways in which they try to hold onto us whilst avoiding the work in painful, infuriating, crazy-making. It can make you second guess your choices, your values, your self worth.
It is by no means a walk in park. So be gentle with yourself. Have compassion when you slip up (which will happen) and then try again tomorrow.
M(f): 43 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
This weekend has been very difficult. The weather is changing here - getting cold and dreary. I went out this weekend to distract myself, but even then it was difficult not to think about H. Today was our nephew's birthday (H's sibling's son). I saw photos of H and all his family there to celebrate our nephew. Obviously I wasn't there, never got the invite. That stings. I didn't realize the last time I was around his family would be the very last time ever, and now it hurts to think I might never be again. I didn't get to say goodbye. Of course my knee jerk reaction was this urge to reach out to him and just cry and tell him I miss his family. That it makes me sad I may never be part of that again. But I know it won't do me any good, and only puts more pressure on him. So I have suppressed the urge, and am instead just sitting here crying while I type this.
Some part of me wants to tell him to just rip the band-aid off and file already. I'm tired of living in this limbo. But I don't mean that & I won't say it. That's just the angry part of me talking. Angry that he can just run off and live his life like it's nothing, while I have to wake up every morning in our home surrounded by our things and our memories. Actively choosing someone I made a lifetime commitment to while he decides if our marriage is even worth it to him or not. It makes me feel insane.
This weekend has been very difficult. The weather is changing here - getting cold and dreary. I went out this weekend to distract myself, but even then it was difficult not to think about H. Today was our nephew's birthday (H's sibling's son). I saw photos of H and all his family there to celebrate our nephew. Obviously I wasn't there, never got the invite. That stings. I didn't realize the last time I was around his family would be the very last time ever, and now it hurts to think I might never be again. I didn't get to say goodbye. Of course my knee jerk reaction was this urge to reach out to him and just cry and tell him I miss his family. That it makes me sad I may never be part of that again. But I know it won't do me any good, and only puts more pressure on him. So I have suppressed the urge, and am instead just sitting here crying while I type this.
Some part of me wants to tell him to just rip the band-aid off and file already. I'm tired of living in this limbo. But I don't mean that & I won't say it. That's just the angry part of me talking. Angry that he can just run off and live his life like it's nothing, while I have to wake up every morning in our home surrounded by our things and our memories. Actively choosing someone I made a lifetime commitment to while he decides if our marriage is even worth it to him or not. It makes me feel insane.
These feelings all make sense. It's extremely difficult to walk this walk. Take one day at a time, one hour at a time, one moment at a time.
Good job typing it all here instead. All grief needs a witness.
M(f): 43 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
It's been a little over a week since I last updated. H came over yesterday to help fix a house issue. I'm not sure how I feel about the whole thing. After he fixed the issue, we sat down on the couch and chatted for awhile. He mentioned that we're probably going to start having some tough conversations soon. I'm assuming he means how to divide up the assets and get the house on the market, but I didn't say anything. Right after that he said "I don't know what our future holds, but I'll love you forever. & I know I'd miss you forever." In my mind I thought "Okay, so why are you doing this then?" But again, I said nothing. We shared a couple of kisses and he said "I don't want you think that this means we're okay." I assured him I was quite aware we were anything but okay. Before he left for the evening, he said "This is hard and it really [censored]. I don't want to say there's no hope, but I don't know what's going to happen." My ears immediately zeroed in on the "I don't want to say there's no hope". If you would have asked him a couple of months ago, he would have said there was absolutely zero hope. So this slight change I'm taking as a very small win.
In some ways I feel like he's backed himself into a corner by telling friends and coworkers that we were going to be divorcing (long before he ever told me) that now he feels like he has to follow through or risk looking "weak" to them. Which irritates me because I told him at the beginning of this separation to take no one else's thoughts or opinions into this time apart. He needed to figure out what HE wants. I also feel like even though we are living apart, he hasn't truly gotten a taste of living completely alone as he is living with a friend currently. He has someone to hang out with after work and socialize with. I wonder how different he might be processing this if he had to be completely alone with his thoughts every evening. But I digress...
In a positive light, this has allowed me to begin re-exploring my faith again. I pray a lot. All I can do right now is continue to give him his space and keep praying we can rebuild our marriage.
H moved out a little over 5 weeks ago. His hanging around post house repair was him doing a temp check. Seeing if you are where he left you. Tossing a few breadcrumbs even.
I’m not saying H, in the moment, was insincere. He may very well felt everything he said. However, he does speak in negatives and with ambiguity. “I don’t want to say there is no hope”. Is different than “I’m hopeful”.
I agree, H has not had enough time alone to sort out his thoughts and feelings. Living with what is likely an enabling friend has probably promoted the alcohol and marijuana usage. Another stumbling block on H’s path.
Anyhow, back to temp check. Imagine if…
Originally Posted by jaejae
H came over yesterday to help fix a house issue. I'm not sure how I feel about the whole thing. After he fixed the issue, we sat down on the couch and chatted for awhile. And I went out shopping. Time I got back, repair was done, and H had left. Sent him a thank you text.
I do not know how big the house issue was that required fixing. Perhaps it needed both of you.
Originally Posted by jaejae
H came over yesterday to help fix a house issue. I'm not sure how I feel about the whole thing. After he fixed the issue, we sat down on the couch and chatted for awhile. I thanked him and went to get some groceries.
Let him feel the loss.
People don’t change until they hit rock bottom.
I suspect you get the idea. And I know, hard to do. Be less available. Let calls go to voice mail. No R-talks.
That all being said, I think you did well with the conversation and interaction.
Originally Posted by jaejae
He mentioned that we're probably going to start having some tough conversations soon. I'm assuming he means how to divide up the assets and get the house on the market, but I didn't say anything.
Good not taking the bait and letting his comment go.
Believe nothing they say and only half of what they do. Does H mean it? Or was he trying to get a rise from you? Or something else? Who knows. You did right by yourself with letting it go.
Continue doing right by you by speaking with a lawyer and being prepared in case H does push some tough conversations forward. You having foreknowledge, and various options and scenarios already considered will place you in a much better position. Emotionally, intellectually, financially, etc. Of course, it’s still basically listen to H’s proposal and sign nothing until your lawyer looks it over.
Originally Posted by jaejae
So this slight change I'm taking as a very small win.
Yes, H has exhibited some positive movement. Let hope he continues.
Keep moving forward.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Thanks for your perspective, D. It gets difficult for me to step back and see the situation with an unbiased lens when I'm wanting so badly for things to be better so I appreciate an outside perspective.
Absolutely will try to make myself less available moving forward. I think the reason I really struggle with this is that sometimes it seems like "more of the same" from me. Before the BD I was very focused on my work and hobbies and did tend to ignore him when he was home. So I do wonder if being around could be a 180 on my part? But perhaps I'm overthinking that. Regardless, I can definitely do a better job at being less available in other ways (i.e. not contacting him ever - I have struggled with this a bit).
We have not talked since he came over to fix the house issue. I have not reached out, he has not reached out either. But the last two days I've really been hung up on the comment he made about having to have tough conversations soon. I didn't take the bait while he was here, but I've been down and upset thinking about what that means. My mind is telling me it's over. He's done, he does not see any way to mend this marriage. Which leads me to feel frantic, desperate, clingy. All the things we should not be while trying to DB. Of course I'm not allowing him to see any of that, but the no contact just further amplifies those feelings. Hopefully it's just a bad couple of days, and my positivity and glimmers of hope can make a resurgence in the coming days.
Absolutely will try to make myself less available moving forward. I think the reason I really struggle with this is that sometimes it seems like "more of the same" from me. Before the BD I was very focused on my work and hobbies and did tend to ignore him when he was home. So I do wonder if being around could be a 180 on my part?
I do understand your idea and worry of displaying ‘more of the same’. My two cents is not to jump at every opportunity and time H wants to interact. Letting his calls go to voice mail and responding on your time; meeting up maybe every third time he proposes (being busy otherwise), though not making a pattern either; are some examples.
The 180 would be, as you said, not ignoring him. So, for those time you do reach back or reach out, be engaged. Which from what you’ve shared it sounds like you are. Listing and validating where appropriate, while giving time and space is a bit of tight rope to learn to walk.
Originally Posted by jaejae
But the last two days I've really been hung up on the comment he made about having to have tough conversations soon. I didn't take the bait while he was here, but I've been down and upset thinking about what that means. My mind is telling me it's over. He's done, he does not see any way to mend this marriage. Which leads me to feel frantic, desperate, clingy.
Good on you not reacting/reaching out to H due to your emotions. Frantic, desperate, clingy, wouldn’t come cross very well. Likely would propel him away. Strong and stable has a better chance at fostering interest within H and his addled mind and heart.
I know how defeating it is to hear things like the ‘tough conversations soon’. Envision a big red stop sign! Stop your runaway thoughts.
You realize H talking about reconciling would be a tough conversation for him as well. We do tend to be drawn to the worst case scenarios when facing things like that statement. Point is, you don’t know and catastrophizing - although normal - just leads to you reenforcing those dreadful feelings.
Now, yes, H is likely referring to the logistics of separating. Doesn’t change anything. Let him. Leave the heavy-lifting to him. You don’t place boulders in his path, yet you don’t need to pave it either.
Separating is work. It takes effort. Most of these folks are seeking an easy way out. Leaving the ball in H’s court will likely buy more time. And time is your ally in this. More time for H to feel loss, to burn through his anger and such, more time for him to start feeling emotions more beneficial to your cause - shame, regret, remorse for example. Giving time and space is a big thing.
Also, I figure H’s friend’s offer for him to live there will start getting stale. Pretty sure friend isn’t wanting a long term roommate. And Christmas is coming up. More time and more pressure will be pushing upon H. This is good, when it doesn’t come from you. Remain clear and don’t take any bait. H will try to keep you as the bad guy in his narrative, don’t fall for it. Let him feel the bed he chose to lay in. Remember, rock bottom usually needs to be hit before sincere life changes happen.
Time and space also promotes your healing too. Giving you opportunities to find clarity and you again. It’s quite a journey.
Stay strong.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
I found out there is at least an EA going on, possibly a PA. He has at least admitted to an EA, but denies a PA. My trust is obliterated so I don't believe anything at this point. I don't even know what to do. Everything feels hopeless at this point.
I found out there is at least an EA going on, possibly a PA. He has at least admitted to an EA, but denies a PA. My trust is obliterated so I don't believe anything at this point. I don't even know what to do. Everything feels hopeless at this point.
I'm sorry to hear this JJ. I wish it wasn't the case but so often it is.
So what to do is to take extremely good care of yourself in this time. It can be a rather difficult concept to grasp as there are pretty intense emotions flying everywhere.
Some thing to understand now is that all of H's positive messages... aren't really about loving you... at least not in the way you are hoping. Perhaps there is still some love or perhaps there is some confusion... there can also be guilt and shame and "showing up" helps alleviate that.
Regardless of the reason - please try to remember that trying to understand why... is a cheeseless tunnel for you. You won't get the answers your seek... no matter how hard you look.
Seeing that you have alot of emotions going on - a recommendation I have is for YOU to give some space to H and the situation... as a form of self care. I will tell you that the part of you that fears losing the relationship will make this seem impossible. Especially if your H then uses it as "evidence" that he made the right choice.
The control that your H says you have over his decision AND the control you think you have to save this relationship by responding from a fearful place - this is an illusion. Don't take the bait on either. This is a practice rather than a one time deal. You will have to make this decision over and over. Managing the anxiety that comes with letting go takes time.
Please remember:
You didn't cause this. You can't change it. You can't control it.
Pull way back. Allow your H to feel the consequences of his decisions. Be honest with yourself that he may be okay with those consequences. His growth and journey are not your responsibility.
For now... breathe... cry.... yell... allow those emotions to flow with whom you feel safe (probably not H). They are very hard emotions to handle and you deserve nothing but compassion and kindness when they come.
(( JJ ))
M(f): 43 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
It is staggering how many of these folks/situations have affairs. It’s nearly 100% of the time.
Do realize an affair is built upon lies and deceit, and that makes a terrible foundation for a relationship. An affair is just a symptom of a deeper problem. Do not assign much meaning to such illicitness.
I understand your trust being obliterated. H has some serious work if he wishes to regain that precious commodity. And that is a ways off for now.
Believe nothing they say, and only half of what they do. H’s words have lost much, look to his behaviour. And even then, take with a grain of salt.
Those feelings of being lost and unsure of what to do have welled up, again. Perfectly normal. Realize you are fine. You are ok.
So what to do…
Originally Posted by Valeska19
Pull way back. Allow your H to feel the consequences of his decisions. Be honest with yourself that he may be okay with those consequences. His growth and journey are not your responsibility.
For now... breathe... cry.... yell... allow those emotions to flow with whom you feel safe (probably not H). They are very hard emotions to handle and you deserve nothing but compassion and kindness when they come.
Agreed!
Pull way back. Focus on you. Give H lots of time and space. Let H feel the weight and consequences of his decisions. This is not being mean, rather treating him accordingly. People will treat you the way you allow them. You are not going to be disrespected and lied to. Be dim. Be kind and cordial.
As V stated, H’s growth and journey are not your responsibility.
Live and love your life. GAL. Be busy. Focus on you.
Hang in there j. (((jaejae)))
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
I found out there is at least an EA going on, possibly a PA. He has at least admitted to an EA, but denies a PA. My trust is obliterated so I don't believe anything at this point. I don't even know what to do. Everything feels hopeless at this point.
I’m sorry JaeJae. I really am.
It’s not much consolation for you I guess, but know that you aren’t alone. Nearly everyone who comes to this site finds out about the affair eventually.
Prioritise self care - exercise, individual counselling, eating well, avoid drinking, start some mindfulness training, do some daily gratitude. Turn inwards. Focus 100% on you and build a wall around yourself and your heart. Don’t isolate. Lean heavily on family and a few trusted friends. And get outside and out of the house - yoga classes, cooking classes, mountain biking, hiking, live music. Force yourself to do those things, even though you won’t feel like it.
Affair discovery is pretty much the lowest point, it’s worse than bomb drop. So you’ve actually passed the worst bit now. Whether the affair fizzles and he comes crawling back, or he serves you with papers and you go separate ways - either way, what comes next gets easier. It will be painfully slow and hard, but rest assured you’ve passed the worst bit.
I remember when I found out about the affair. I could hardly breathe. But it was actually a turning point in my journey. The start of a new beginning.
